Pumping Iron with Zemekone and Icehog3

[kaisersozei]

The odd thing is, my left arm seems considerably smaller than the right. Measuring them has my right arm at 11.5" and my left at 10.25". Is that weird?

Nah, the human body isn't exactly symmetrical, so there's usually one side that's a bit larger or differently sized than the other. 1 1/4" seems like a lot, though--my biceps differ by about 1/2".

[DBall]

Are you left handed?


Right handed, and that's the bigger one. But a whole 1 1/4" seems like a huge difference. I work both of them out equally, too

[BigFrank]

Gotta ease up on punching the clown...

[DBall]

Gotta ease up on punching the clown...

:r:r:r

[BigFrank]

In all seriousness, just do an extra set or two during arm day for that arm. I still have a lot of muscular imbalances and strength from playing Baseball. I just do an extra set or two targeting the areas.

Hit the Gym this morning.
Did some Back, Shoulders and Biceps. Followed by 40minutes of cardio.

[Patrick B]

246.5 lbs today. I always weigh in on Friday afternoon after waking up. Down almost 50 total since getting back in the gym. Just got new a smaller size in my uniform pants and it's almost time to do it again! :)

[Patrick B]

I decided to cycle off the creatine for a week. That's done and I just took it a little while ago. I use Pump Fuel from GNC. I'M FIRED UP AND READY TO GO! BBBWAAAHHHHHHH!!!!

[BigFrank]

Try jack3d. There may be cocaine or something illegal in it...honestly.

[GreekGodX]

Try jack3d. There may be cocaine or something illegal in it...honestly.

Amen I love the stuff :tu

[Patrick B]

That's what I'm taking when this jug runs out. :)

Anyone remember smilax from the old days? I thought it fired me up but reading about now on the innerwebz it sounds like it does nothing...

[itzfrank]

In all seriousness, just do an extra set or two during arm day for that arm. I still have a lot of muscular imbalances and strength from playing Baseball. I just do an extra set or two targeting the areas.

Hit the Gym this morning.
Did some Back, Shoulders and Biceps. Followed by 40minutes of cardio.

I have similar issues. On my throwing arm side(right) my chest is a lot weaker and smaller then the left because of how much stronger my right shoulder is then my left.

I, also, seem to be a lot stroner on my right leg then my left. I attribute it to it being the leg I use to fire out of the hole with when throwing down to bases after base stealers. Either that, or better co-ordination.

[SilverFox]

Good posts there SilverFox.

Tx Frank, sorry for the delayed response. Damn cold is trying to kick my ass.

On a different note..............been reading a lot about Branched Chain Amino Acids.

I am trying to limit my supplements to stuff that has some proven science behind it and at this point am supplementing with Whey Isolate, and Creatine.........has anyone had any experience with BCAA's?

[BigFrank]

That's what I'm taking when this jug runs out. :)

Anyone remember smilax from the old days? I thought it fired me up but reading about now on the innerwebz it sounds like it does nothing...
Never heard of that. But I do remember ultimate orange, which got pulled for having some REAL illegal supplements in it...

Tx Frank, sorry for the delayed response. Damn cold is trying to kick my ass.

On a different note..............been reading a lot about Branched Chain Amino Acids.

I am trying to limit my supplements to stuff that has some proven science behind it and at this point am supplementing with Whey Isolate, and Creatine.........has anyone had any experience with BCAA's?
I feel you on this one. I used to take a lot of crap. Now I just stick to the basics.

Silver Fox, I take BCAA is one form or another. There are a lot of drink mixes etc. They are great to drink anytime before/during/after workouts, when the muscle are in essence primed and ready to upload nutrients quickly. Also, they are good too drink when not in workout mode, they body uses them to rebuild muscle. Since they are already broken down into simple form they upload quickly. There's a lot of science behind them and they are pretty damn cheap. I guess bottom line, get some they cheap and they are helpful.

I use two types. Carb and Non-Carb
Carb= Powdered Gatorade + BCAA
Non Carb= Universal Nutrition EAA or BCAA

[jmsremax]

I am more cardio now (I could still be consuming BCAAs nevertheless) but when I was focused on lifting I would make sure I consumed BCAAs pre and post workout. You can simply buy protein that has BCAAs or take it as a separate supplement (I used to use purple wraath).

BCAAs assist with protein synthesis and reduce muscle fatigue (aka breakdown). I recommend anyone take BCAAs.

[PeteSB75]

Taking the week off lifting. Have fun guys.

[bonjing]

Kinda of a poor workout night last night. I just couldn't get the last sets up and couldn't do the weight I'm used to, and on the treadmill I couldn't keep up the pace/incline that I normally do :(.
Supersets

Incline dumbbell/bent over lateral raise 3x15
flat dumbbell/lateral raise 3x15
15 min on the treadmill

[BigFrank]

Taking the week off lifting. Have fun guys.

nuuuuuuuuuuuuuuuuuuu

=(

[GreekGodX]

I really messed up my shoulder doing incline bench. I was trying to target my upper chest more and I think it was just too much. Good/Bad thing (depending on how you look at it) is it is the opposite shoulder that I have tendonitis/bersitis in. It is murder to even sleep on that side. Looks like no pressing movements for a while. Even doing pullups aggravates it.

[Da Klugs]

got to 80 push-ups this morning.

Bought a couple 12 pound hand weights and one of those bundgy corded things with handles.

[DBall]

got to 80 push-ups this morning.

Bought a couple 12 pound hand weights and one of those bundgy corded things with handles.

Damn, Dave... you are a beast!

Are you doing these all at once or breaking them up (like, 20 at a time, rest for a few minutes, 20 more, etc.)?

[Da Klugs]

Damn, Dave... you are a beast!

Are you doing these all at once or breaking them up (like, 20 at a time, rest for a few minutes, 20 more, etc.)?

All at once. It wouldnt be 80 if I broke em up. Getting pretty hard, I may need to slow down my quest for 100 a bit. Don't want to tweak anything.

Starting to firm up a bit and notice the shoulder definition.

http://www.stayfitbug.com/wp-content/uploads/2009/08/muscles.jpg


Yea right....

more like:

http://img.thesun.co.uk/multimedia/archive/00072/F_200611_november11e_72402a.jpg

[icehog3]

Looks like your yambag shrunk in the first photo, Dave. Congrats on the 80 mark. :tu

SUS 500 is kicking in for me. :D :ze

[Patrick B]

Great back and bi workout tonight. Better pump than I'm used to getting in my back...

[Da Klugs]

85 push-ups this morning.

[Patrick B]

Looks like your yambag shrunk in the first photo, Dave. Congrats on the 80 mark. :tu

SUS 500 is kicking in for me. :D :ze

Tell me more about the SUS500. I read mixed reviews online regarding it's side effects. I currently take creatine, a good MV, and just eat tons of clean protein. I would love to try something else for muscle/strength gains...

[icehog3]

Tell me more about the SUS500. I read mixed reviews online regarding it's side effects. I currently take creatine, a good MV, and just eat tons of clean protein. I would love to try something else for muscle/strength gains...


Unfortunately, Patrick, SUS 500 has been off the market for over a year. G.E.T. (the same manufacturer) just came out with SUS 500 Black, which I am waiting to hear results on from some of my gym buds. I was resourceful enough to get enough SUS 500 to last me until hopefully a comparable replacement is developed by someone.

[Patrick B]

Thanks, Tom. Keep me in the loop. :)

[icehog3]

Thanks, Tom. Keep me in the loop. :)

I have a couple guys I trust, who seem to have similar results with supps that I do, who are getting ready to do a cycle...I will let you know what they think, Patrick.

[Patrick B]

I'd love something that gave me real gains, but do not want any shitty side effects. Thanks for keeping me in mind.

[BigFrank]

I'd love something that gave me real gains, but do not want any shitty side effects. Thanks for keeping me in mind.

This will not ever happen unless you do it natural.

[GreekGodX]

Nice on the pushups Dave :tu You make me want to try and see how many I can do at one time.

Confirmed that my should sucks still. I can be so hard headed sometimes. Started warming up on some lat pulldowns and could feel the pain starting. Figured it's only a 3/10 on the pain scale we're good. Jack up the weight. 6/10 is uncomfortable but no pain no gain. More weight on. I started to pull on the bar and decided not a good idea. Saved myself some agony. I'm going to try not to aggrivate it for a week.

[PeteSB75]

I'd love something that gave me real gains, but do not want any shitty side effects. Thanks for keeping me in mind.

This will not ever happen unless you do it natural.

I like grilled chicken, pork or steak :tu Sometimes I'll mix it up with some fish :tf

[icehog3]

Hope the time off heals you up, Christos.

[BigFrank]

Same as Tom Christos. Heal up get better. Take care of it, dont let it sideline you forever.

High Carb day today and I'm loving it LOL!!!

[Da Klugs]

Hit 90 push-ups this morning... just barely.

Been using the freeweights a bit. Need to start some cardio.

[Ahbroody]

Nice on the pushups Dave :tu You make me want to try and see how many I can do at one time.

Confirmed that my should sucks still. I can be so hard headed sometimes. Started warming up on some lat pulldowns and could feel the pain starting. Figured it's only a 3/10 on the pain scale we're good. Jack up the weight. 6/10 is uncomfortable but no pain no gain. More weight on. I started to pull on the bar and decided not a good idea. Saved myself some agony. I'm going to try not to aggrivate it for a week.

Definitely rest it. I have permanent shoulder issues from being stupid, not worth the risk of surgery to me so now I deal with it. Take the time let it heal the weights will always be there.

[icehog3]

90 Dave? Awesome! :tu

[Patrick B]

This will not ever happen unless you do it natural.

Care to explain this a little further? I think I'm missing your point.

[GreekGodX]

The issue is my shoulder only hurts when moving in certain directions. I can row no problem but pressing movements kill it. So no pressing for the time being. Anything that aggrivates it I'll just stop. Unfortanetly hockey season isn't very kind to my shoulder issue :td

[Patrick B]

Care to explain this a little further? I think I'm missing your point.

I surely didn't mean this to sound as douchey as it did. My diet is solid - Very low fat, good (but not many) carbs, and I'm eating tons of clean protein, around 200-250 grams daily. Mainly from egg whites, tuna, chicken, skim milk, and some odd steaks and salmon once in a while. Currently using a whey protein supplement, creatine, and a good MV. I'm putting in plenty of hard work on both lifting and cardio and making good progress at exchanging fat for muscle, but I wouldn't mind another supp. in there that made the hard work pay off a little better. Thanks for any advice you all have.

[BigFrank]

Patrick no worries, you didn't sound "douchey". Now onto a long ass post. Your original post...
I'd love something that gave me real gains, but do not want any shitty side effects.

This will be in regards to supplements. Diet is a whole conversation in itself.
You are already taking the few if any (creatine) that is backed some some sort of science. Taking BCAA may help. They have been proven useful. Beta- Alanine which is still under researched have been proven to help. Leucine is good for food uptake also. So, in a nutshell Amino Acids are good.
Some guys take a NO Supplement ( Nitric Oxide ) which is just the amino acid Arginine-alpha-keto-glutarate, or usually a cheaper and crappier form. Most of these "formulas" are loaded with stimulants and high doses of them so you get that "rush etc" there is some promising research in regards to NO products. Do a little research http://www.bodybuilding.com/store/no2.html and http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Nitric_oxide.

You said you wanted to take some supplements to "get real gains". There are really 4 routes to take here. Supplements. Pro-Hormones. Herbal. Steroids.

-You can take what I would consider "magazine supplements" you know the **** that increases your bench and gives you 10lbs in a month etc. All of this is junk. Non of it is backed by science, a lot of it is just crap combined with more crap, with a EXTREMELY small amount of the **** that actually works. No serious side effects here , but you wont get any because they arent really doing anything besides getting you bloated with crap.
--Withing this category there are also fat loss supplements. These are all just junk full of stimulants again...Also many of these contain diuretics (http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Diuretic) these are no good. These supplements are junk junk and more junk.

What you have to be careful of now, is many companies pull bullshit on the label and put everything in a "formula" so many ingredients get downplayed. I.E. you may but supplement X because it has Y which is supposed to be good. But in the formula they say it's contained in the "blend or formula" but there's really on 5mcg of it...

Next we have herbal supplements. Some people think these work, some do not. Don't waste your money. Period. There is little or no science / studies backing the majority of it. Post about herbal test boosters http://www.cigarasylum.com/vb/showpost.php?p=883709&postcount=4147.

Next up are pro-hormones. Junk again. They are nothing more than steroids that have been manipulated in a lab somewhere, to avoid being banned by the FDA or other government agency. They get altered to the point where they become more harm than good. Also, many hormones give the body false signals and create unbalanced swings in testosterone produced if any. Pro-hormones say they help your body produce more testosterone, which doesn't work well. If work at all. Which cause more minor side effects than taking the real thing usually due to the uncontrollable swings in test, free test etc.

Finally steroids. These work. There are side effects. There is not much research in regards to these in practical Gym applications. There is a lot of hear say and media propaganda on them and how "terrible" they are. Bottom line is this, for what you would pay for the crap that is supposed to work like steroids do, you could just buy the damn real thing. It's illegal and a lot of people take them.


So I guess to sum everything up. You were looking for something to take to get gains but would not give you side effects. Anything that you take from the groups has it related side effects. The only way to have no side effects would be to train 100% natural. No drugs. Some side effects are worse than others. But the bottom line here is this. If you have a sound diet, and are training your balls. Then the choice is yours. But the best bang for your dollar will be the real thing. Hope this helps. I don't want to talk about the illegal side too much on the board here, with respect to the community and moderators. If you would like anymore info, please feel free to PM ME.

[icehog3]

Next up are pro-hormones. Junk again. They are nothing more than steroids that have been manipulated in a lab somewhere, to avoid being banned by the FDA or other government agency. They get altered to the point where they become more harm than good. Also, many hormones give the body false signals and create unbalanced swings in testosterone produced if any. Pro-hormones say they help your body produce more testosterone, which doesn't work well. If work at all. Which cause more minor side effects than taking the real thing usually due to the uncontrollable swings in test, free test etc.



I agree with you on the majority of them, Frank, but I have had a couple over the years that definitely worked for me. I had my times with steroids 25 years ago, but obviously am not in a position to posess or use them now even if I wanted to, but I do know their effects. Finding that diamond in the rough pro-hormone (SUS 500 most recently) once in a while is great...although as soon as me and my gym mates figure out it works, the FDA bans it. That is why I jumped on a bunch of it before they banned it.

[BigFrank]

I agree with you on the majority of them, Frank, but I have had a couple over the years that definitely worked for me. I had my times with steroids 25 years ago, but obviously am not in a position to posess or use them now even if I wanted to, but I do know their effects. Finding that diamond in the rough pro-hormone (SUS 500 most recently) once in a while is great...although as soon as me and my gym mates figure out it works, the FDA bans it. That is why I jumped on a bunch of it before they banned it.

I hear you on this Tom. I understand a lot of people want to use them because they are "legal" but like I said, you would be more than better off taking the real crap. The way pro-hormones work is terrible at best. It's not precise and is often not constant. More often than not if they do work the levels of test range and vary greatly, causing a host of issues. Not to mention there are no pro-hormones that I know of that are a 17aa compound. ( altered to endure the first pass through your liver without being destroyed ) which without doing makes any oral worthless in regards to hormones.

[icehog3]

I hear you on this Tom. I understand a lot of people want to use them because they are "legal" but like I said, you would be more than better off taking the real crap. The way pro-hormones work is terrible at best. It's not precise and is often not constant. More often than not if they do work the levels of test range and vary greatly, causing a host of issues. Not to mention there are no pro-hormones that I know of that are a 17aa compound. ( altered to endure the first pass through your liver without being destroyed ) which without doing makes any oral worthless in regards to hormones.

I respect both your knowledge and experience, Brother Frank. I know the real stuff would be 10X more effective and efficient, but I am not in a position to take it because of my job...and I am not sure I would even if I had a different job.

After 25 years of trying countless legal supps, what I do know is what works for me....and the SUS 500 definitely both increases my strength and tightens up my tendon and joint maladies. But you may be absolutely right that the levels are all over the place, but at my age, it's great to have an edge that sure seems to be more than just psychological. :)

[Patrick B]

Wow, thanks for the awesome post. Really informative. At 35 I'm finding the gains I used to get at age 20 much harder to come by. I'm not in any rush and things are going well, I just want to get max results from my work, like anyone else would. Again, thanks a ton guys!

[icehog3]

Wow, thanks for the awesome post. Really informative. At 35 I'm finding the gains I used to get at age 20 much harder to come by. I'm not in any rush and things are going well, I just want to get max results from my work, like anyone else would. Again, thanks a ton guys!

I am glad you are not confused, Patrick, as I think Frank and I have had different results at times. :r

[Patrick B]

Yeah I'm good to go, just been away from all this for a while and learning what is working well these days. Great leg workout today - still wobbly as hell going up and down stairs. :)

4 sets smith machine squats
3 sets leg presses
3 supersets of leg curl, extension, and calf raises. Last one was intense.

Followed by a long stretching routine...

[BigFrank]

I am glad you are not confused, Patrick, as I think Frank and I have had different results at times. :r
:D...Indeed. I have tried pro-hormones and herbal test boosters in the past. I understand the work thing. I used to be in the same field as you brother. I'm all for using stuff that works for someone. But my past experiences have led me to feel I have wasted more money and time using things that give me slightly what the real thing would have.

[bonjing]

I'm slow, forgive me ;s. But the best way to see gains is good nutrition, diet and work your azz off, correct?

[AD720]

I'm slow, forgive me ;s. But the best way to see gains is good nutrition, diet and work your azz off, correct?


You forgot "take your vitamins" and "say your prayers, brother"!


http://www.morningtoast.com/wordpress/wp-content/uploads//2010/01/hulk-hogan-image.jpg

[BigFrank]

I'm slow, forgive me ;s. But the best way to see gains is good nutrition, diet and work your azz off, correct?
yes for someone who wants to do it all drug free.

[icehog3]

:D...Indeed. I have tried pro-hormones and herbal test boosters in the past. I understand the work thing. I used to be in the same field as you brother. I'm all for using stuff that works for someone. But my past experiences have led me to feel I have wasted more money and time using things that give me slightly what the real thing would have.

Trust me, I have wasted a LOT of cash on trying stuff that didn't do squat for me, except maybe give me diarreah or a rash. :r That is why I get psyched when I stumble onto a product that actually seems to work for me. :)

[BigFrank]

Squat n Deads tonight. Squats were definitely lacking. Had a decent round of pulls. Cardio = FML.

[PeteSB75]

Squat n Deads tonight. Squats were definitely lacking. Had a decent round of pulls. Cardio = FML.

Keep rocking that cardio Frank. We'll get you into a spin class soon :ze

Chest/arms for me today. Flat and incline bench, curls and dips. Was only a week off, but still felt odd going back this morning. Definitely feeling stronger though.

[Da Klugs]

Made 100 push-ups this morning. Feel pretty good about it. Going to try and stay here for a while .... until it feels a little less like death for the last 20. :D

In the next few days - cardio. Time to pull out the ancient Schwinn airdyne and get R ready.

Notice a difference in the way I look and feel. Upper body definition is .... well there are hints of some. :D

Cardio, diet and ultimately some more significant weight loss is next on the agenda. 240 this morning.

[Patrick B]

I bought a big ass bottle of BCAA's. It says to take 6 a day between meals. What's the best way to break these up in relation to my workout? A couple before lifting, a couple after, and then a couple later in the day sound alright?

[GreekGodX]

Made 100 push-ups this morning. Feel pretty good about it. Going to try and stay here for a while .... until it feels a little less like death for the last 20. :D

:wo

I bought a big ass bottle of BCAA's. It says to take 6 a day between meals. What's the best way to break these up in relation to my workout? A couple before lifting, a couple after, and then a couple later in the day sound alright?

On training days I go with 5grams in the a.m, 5grams during the workout, 5grams after. Non-training days 3-5 gram servings spread out through the day. Honestly it's up to you though, whatever seems to work best. Play around with it, sometimes I actually take more during the workout seems to help with the later sets.

[itzfrank]

I only take mine in the AM and Pre-Workout. Aside from that, your protein shakes should be supplying you with what else the body needs.

[itzfrank]

Ps. Trying the Jack3d again. We'll see how it goes this time around. I still feel that Trac Xtreme by MHP is my ish.

[BigFrank]

Keep rocking that cardio Frank. We'll get you into a spin class soon :ze

Chest/arms for me today. Flat and incline bench, curls and dips. Was only a week off, but still felt odd going back this morning. Definitely feeling stronger though.

If I come you'll have to be on stand-by with a fire extinguisher from my legs rubbing together!

Dont underestimate planned time off Pete, does wonders.

[PeteSB75]

If I come you'll have to be on stand-by with a fire extinguisher from my legs rubbing together!

:r :r

Dont underestimate planned time off Pete, does wonders.

Believe me, I don't. that's why I make sure and take it every two-three months. If nothing else, it's a week where I get to catch up on my sleep...

Deads and squats this morning. Definitely getting into the swing of things.

Frank, if I want to use the progressions you gave me, but continuing to squat and dead on the same day, can I just offset the weeks, i.e. week 1 dead/light squat, week 2 dead/week 1 squat, etc? Or do I need to make different adjustments?

[BigFrank]

Pete I squat and deadlift on the same day and do not alter my training. Unless you plan on taking a day to dedicate to pulling specifically or hamstrings for that matter, just keep em together. Just squat, then deadlift. Only thing that is different is I really dont warm up on the deadlifts. After warming up for squats then squatting you're already warmed up plenty. I set up the deadlift bar with 225, then 315, then 405 1 rep each time then begin my workload for deadlifting. The single reps are more to get my grip and form in order more than anything else.

[PeteSB75]

Pete I squat and deadlift on the same day and do not alter my training. Unless you plan on taking a day to dedicate to pulling specifically or hamstrings for that matter, just keep em together. Just squat, then deadlift. Only thing that is different is I really dont warm up on the deadlifts. After warming up for squats then squatting you're already warmed up plenty. I set up the deadlift bar with 225, then 315, then 405 1 rep each time then begin my workload for deadlifting. The single reps are more to get my grip and form in order more than anything else.

Hmm, might have to try that. I always start off with 5 mins on an eliptical or other cardio machine for initial warm-up. Then what I've been doing lately is dead, then squat. I do more warm-up sets for the deads. On a 1RM day, will normally do 135x5, 225x3, 275x1, 315x1, then 345/355x1 or wherever I feel I can pull that day. After that is done, I'll squat, doing 45, 135, 225, 315, then from there. I usually try not to do 1RM for both on the same day - it's too much for me and I feel my performance on the second exercise is hurt by the effort I expend with the first. If I am going for a squat 1RM, I will go easier on the dead, but still do it first, laying off after a 275x5.

I've had knee problems in the past, and the squat seems to put more pressure on it, so I like to dead first so I am fully warm when I start squatting.

[AD720]

Getting back to the gym tonight after 10 days of unplanned time off - between being sick and life getting in the way.

Looking forward to just moving around.

[GreekGodX]

I might need to just shut it down for a week :td My shoulder is just not having any kind of activity. Even between icing, heating, pain pills, and stretching I still can't seem to get it to feel better. Sleep is miserable because I'm used to sleeping on that side. :(

[DBall]

Took a small (maybe a week or a bit less) break due to my elbow hating me and some shoulder weirdness. Back to normal today (actually, lifting helped my elbow, oddly enough) and reupped my gym membership another 6 months... I'm set til May now!

:noon

[Patrick B]

Great shoulder workout tonight followed by an unplanned rack of ribs as a protein supplement. Those are low fat, right? :) I'll hit the cardio hard tomorrow morning to make up for it!

[icehog3]

I might need to just shut it down for a week :td My shoulder is just not having any kind of activity. Even between icing, heating, pain pills, and stretching I still can't seem to get it to feel better. Sleep is miserable because I'm used to sleeping on that side. :(

Just wait until you're my age Son, and both shoulders hurt every night. :r

[GreekGodX]

Just wait until you're my age Son, and both shoulders hurt every night. :r

Ugh thanks Pops. Stuff to look forward to :rolleyes:

[Da Klugs]

Did the 100 push-ups again today.


And I curled 1200 Pounds!

50 reps with the 12 lb weights. :D

[icehog3]

Ugh thanks Pops. Stuff to look forward to :rolleyes:

If I could sleep on my back without snoring myself awake they would heal in a week! :r

Congrats on the continued progress, Dave! :tu

[PeteSB75]

Back and shoulders this morning. I'm sore all over today. Chest and arms from tuesday, legs from yesterday. Guessing shoulders and back will be tomorrow, though I didn't go as hard on them this morning as I did chest tues or legs yest. Price we pay, I guess.

[SilverFox]

I have been hard at it for almost 10 weeks now and I am really starting to notice some progress.

The two toughest parts are eating (3500 kcal a day when I spend the better part of a year at 1600 per day is killer)

The other and the reason for my posts is my elbows are sore constantly from all the lifting, I mean in the joint.

Any suggestions from the old pros out there?

[icehog3]

I take Aleve every morning for my joints, good combination of pain relief and anti-inflammatory for me, Shawn.

[itzfrank]

I take Aleve every morning for my joints, good combination of pain relief and anti-inflammatory for me, Shawn.

Should probably introduce some fish oils and Glutamine into the system.

MSM is a natural anti-inflammatory. Glucosamine helps with joint health. Chondriton helps with natural production and health of cartilage. You can find all three in a combination at any vitamin store.

[icehog3]

Should probably introduce some fish oils and Glutamine into the system.

MSM is a natural anti-inflammatory. Glucosamine helps with joint health. Chondriton helps with natural production and health of cartilage. You can find all three in a combination at any vitamin store.

Absolutely Frank....I have done the G/C/MSM and the fish oil in the past, but have been off the first for a while mainly because of cost. I used to find the quality brand (Move Free by Schiff) on eBay for about 1/2 of MSRP, but haven't looked for several years.

[GreekGodX]

Update from the wounded wing corner.

Still hurts but yesterday and today I did some soft tissue work using a baseball. Made a ton of difference. Felt a lot better and gave me some relief for a little bit. I'm going to try and do some lifting tomorrow. I hit legs twice this week so I'd like to do something else ;)

[BigFrank]

I have been hard at it for almost 10 weeks now and I am really starting to notice some progress.

The two toughest parts are eating (3500 kcal a day when I spend the better part of a year at 1600 per day is killer)

The other and the reason for my posts is my elbows are sore constantly from all the lifting, I mean in the joint.

Any suggestions from the old pros out there?

Should probably introduce some fish oils and Glutamine into the system.

MSM is a natural anti-inflammatory. Glucosamine helps with joint health. Chondriton helps with natural production and health of cartilage. You can find all three in a combination at any vitamin store.

Frank gives good advice there Silver. There are many products on the market that combine all into a few pills or a pack. I would be hesitant about taking NSAIDS unless it gets bad.

Might want to search in some of the past pages, there is a lot of talk about elbow sleeves ( which would be worth getting ), icy hot / muscle rubs, tendinitus and overuse issues / injuries. Could be one or more than one of them. Without much detail as to work performed, work load etc. It's hard to go off just "my elbows hurt" you could be performing exercises wrong, or maybe doing to much of one type ( extensions are notorious for elbow pain ).

[hammondc]

set a PR for myself this morning for a 5K. 26:05. Damn good since I have not been running in about 4 months because of an ankle injury. I give all credit to Insanity....that program will get you right.

[Da Klugs]

Did the 100 push-ups again today.


And I curled 1200 Pounds!

50 reps with the 12 lb weights. :D

:tpd:

Did another 25 pushs ups later and some wierd things with the hand weights trying to get more range of motion work on the arms and upper body.

Still resisting cardio but may bring the ol airdyne out tomorrow.

238 a few minutes ago.

[icehog3]

238 a few minutes ago.

You keep taking it off, and I keep putting it on. :r

Tore up a chest / back superset workout today with

Incline bench / Pull ups
Flat bench / T-bar rows
Dips / Wide cable rows

I earned my steak and egg whites lunch today. :)

[BigFrank]

Blasted some back shoulders and biceps friday. Need to either buy a scale or get the owner of the new gym to buy one. Over a month on the diet now and no scale.

[Da Klugs]

102 Push-ups this morning.

Did the curls last night.... but continue to resist cardio. :D

Does Sunny-D count as a "supplement"? :r

[GreekGodX]

102 Push-ups this morning.

Did the curls last night.... but continue to resist cardio. :D

Does Sunny-D count as a "supplement"? :r

Sunny-D does count Dave :tu The vitamin C actually helps in recovery :banger We won't go any further than the vit C in it tho

[Da Klugs]

Sunny-D does count Dave :tu The vitamin C actually helps in recovery :banger We won't go any further than the vit C in it tho


And the donut for breakfast afterward? :D

[GreekGodX]

And the donut for breakfast afterward? :D

I see you're just more advanced then the rest of us. You want to be playing around with your insulin levels to get a step ahead of us :rolleyes: :r

[DBall]

Earned my muscle builder milkshake today... hahaha. I went crazy at the gym.

Quick question... Mondays are the day where I try to max out on bench presses. I started off with the bar x5, 95# x5, 115# x3, 135# x2, tried 150# and failed, tried 135 again and failed. Is it safe to assume that once I fail, I'm pretty much done with benches for the day and I shouldn't try to work my way back down?

I know I can do 135# a few times (I could have done more on my first run, but I wanted to save myself for the 150# attempt).

[Da Klugs]

I see you're just more advanced then the rest of us. You want to be playing around with your insulin levels to get a step ahead of us :rolleyes: :r

:r

Started this process to "get fitter" seem to be having a hard time getting beyond upper body and my simple pushing the floor.

[icehog3]

Does Sunny-D count as a "supplement"? :r

Sunny-Dianabol? :D

[PeteSB75]

Earned my muscle builder milkshake today... hahaha. I went crazy at the gym.

Quick question... Mondays are the day where I try to max out on bench presses. I started off with the bar x5, 95# x5, 115# x3, 135# x2, tried 150# and failed, tried 135 again and failed. Is it safe to assume that once I fail, I'm pretty much done with benches for the day and I shouldn't try to work my way back down?

I know I can do 135# a few times (I could have done more on my first run, but I wanted to save myself for the 150# attempt).

If you want a good idea of your 1RM, you're doing too many reps in your warm-up sets. If going for 150, I would do 45(bar)x5. 95x3. 135x1, 150x1. If you still feel like you have something left after that, try 155 or 160x1. You'll be surprised how much max effort for that short of a time will wear you out. If you fail once, give yourself 2-3 minutes, then try the same weight again. Don't drop weight, IMO. You're still working the muscles in the attempt. Good luck with it, any way you try and slice it.

[BigFrank]

Quick question... Mondays are the day where I try to max out on bench presses. I started off with the bar x5, 95# x5, 115# x3, 135# x2, tried 150# and failed, tried 135 again and failed. Is it safe to assume that once I fail, I'm pretty much done with benches for the day and I shouldn't try to work my way back down?

I know I can do 135# a few times (I could have done more on my first run, but I wanted to save myself for the 150# attempt).

Dball you shouldn't be trying to max out every week. Most people only max out every 2-6 months. If you are trying to max out, you should spend less time using lighter weights. Maxing out also is extremely fatiguing and wrecks havoc on the central nervous system.

For example, instead of doing what you did. 45x5 - 95x5 - 115x3 - 135x2 then 150. You should have done something like this... 45x5 - 95x3 - 135x1 - 150.

Some people may say different when it comes to working back down it weights. If you are training for strength, this is a HUGE NO-GO. If you are doing something for size than maybe, but I still wouldn't do it. There are many reasons why. The biggest in regards to strength is not only is it mentally fatiguing, but your body remembers the weight you did last, and so does your mind.
In the bodybuilding sense I would avoid it also, often after maxing out or really pushing the limits, there is a degree of strength and technique breakdown. Most lifters will then perform sub-maximal weights with bad form or worse. In essence you will teach yourself into worse form. You are better off hitting your weights, and moving onto something else.

[GreekGodX]

Dan everybody hit on it all ready. Too many warm-up reps. Frank and Pete gave you a great guideline. I'd do bar barx8, 95x3, 115x1, 135x1 then 150. All lifts giving max effort to prepare your CNS(pretty much the same as stated above just my personal preference). And you are definitely doing your body a disservice by trying to max out weekly. You need to build the muscles that facilitate the lift and perfect your form on bench to increase your max.

[DBall]

awesome.. thanks for all the advice... how often should I try to max out and what should I be doing in the interim (now that you all know about where I'm at weight wise in my lifting)?

[SilverFox]

Well today was my check in day and I have to say I am pretty damn happy.

So at my last check in I was 228lbs and 18% body fat......representing about 187 lbs of lean mass

Fast forward to today 4 weeks later and I am 243.4lbs and 19.1% body fat.....representing about 197 lbs of lean mass.

I put on 10lbs of muscle and 5.4lbs of fat in 4 weeks, almost a 2 to 1 ratio which is AWESOME I am stoked, I surpassed my own goals and the expectations of my trainer.

Hitting it hard and eating right seems to have paid off dividends.

Now I am going to drop 1200 cal a day and keep up the lifting regimen and drop 10lbs of fat without losing any of that muscle (or at least that is the intent)

10 and 10 from here on in till I hit my goal............so drop 10 in fat then go hard and add 10 lbs (hoping for at least a 1 to 1 lean mass to fat gain ratio) then lose 10 of fat and repeat until I am around 240lbs and 12% I figure between 4 to 6 months and I should be right were I want to be............then I will just change my goals :)

[bonjing]

Had a good week last week.

Monday, Nice solid chest work out that made me sore for a while
Wed, bi's and tri's
Thurs, shoulders and a little chest
With 15min on the treadmill thrown in for a warm up
Tonight will be chest again and maybe some type of arms thrown in.

What's the ideal break time between sets?

[BigFrank]

awesome.. thanks for all the advice... how often should I try to max out and what should I be doing in the interim (now that you all know about where I'm at weight wise in my lifting)?

Once every 2-4 months depending on how your training is set up. A max isnt something you should just walk into the Gym and decide you are going to do that day. Your training should build up to it.

Also, you have to decide if you are training specifically for strength, fat loss or for size / muscle gain. Granted, with strength gains does come some size gains, and vice verse. But in the game of weight lifting / exercise it is very hard to serve more than one master. Most lifters / gym rats can get away with playing to many masters within the first few month of training. What I mean here is, you first get in the Gym your body responds well, you get stronger, some muscle starts coming along, and body fat also drops. But after the first few months, this usually comes to a grinding halt. Many people make the mistake of trying to do everything without really accomplishing anything. I know it's hard without having someone teach you how to lift properly, eat properly, and condition properly. But there are many online databases that can get you off on the right foot.

So I guess my point really is. Figure out where you want to be this time next year...Do you want to be Dball +30 pounds? Dball who benches 200lbs? After you come to consideration with that, it's much much easier to lay a game plan out and get to what really matters, putting in the work.


-Training for me tonight. Worked on some Squat form issues. Problem with my groin is acting up again. Heavy sumo pulls. Some BS, then treadmill.

[DBall]

So I guess my point really is. Figure out where you want to be this time next year...Do you want to be Dball +30 pounds? Dball who benches 200lbs? After you come to consideration with that, it's much much easier to lay a game plan out and get to what really matters, putting in the work.



Lets say DBall who benches 200lbs. I don't need to lose or gain any weight (not that I'll be broken up if I do, but I'm happy where I am)

[PeteSB75]

Lets say DBall who benches 200lbs. I don't need to lose or gain any weight (not that I'll be broken up if I do, but I'm happy where I am)

If you are looking for strength gains, you are going to want lower reps, higher weight. for strength, I generally work in 5 rep sets at about 80-85% of my 1RM, and I do three sets at that weight. So, if 150 is your 1RM, then you should be doing 5 rep sets at 120 or 125.

If that starts to seem to easy, increase the weight. If you are unsure about that weight, get a spotter, but also try upping the weight with each of the three sets, so instead of 125x5/125x5/125x5, do 120x5/125x5/130x5. But get a spotter any time you are trying a new weight/rep combo.

You will also want to vary intensity. If you are doing full body workouts, you can do it by day, but otherwise by week, do heavy, light, and medium workouts, where heavy is 80/85% 1RM, med is 70/75% 1RM and light is 60/65% 1RM. If you do this for a few months and want more of a challenge, change the med week to a heavy week and do heavy/light/heavy/light. Don't drop the light week though. It helps solidify good form, increases blood flow to the muscles you are working, and promotes good recovery.

Chest/arm volume work for me this morning. Flat bench, incline bench, supinating curls, and dips.

[GreekGodX]

So after 5 days rest for the shoulder I hit the gym Monday and this morning. Feels great :tu I've avoided any pressing movements and pull ups but I've been able to do everything else pain free. So I think Saturday I'll attempt some pullups and then a few days after some presses.

Hit legs on Monday and Back this morning. With some abs thrown in as well.

[BigFrank]

So after 5 days rest for the shoulder I hit the gym Monday and this morning. Feels great :tu I've avoided any pressing movements and pull ups but I've been able to do everything else pain free. So I think Saturday I'll attempt some pullups and then a few days after some presses.

Hit legs on Monday and Back this morning. With some abs thrown in as well.

Where exactly is the injury Christos? One of our members is currently going through a partial rear delt tear. He still can bench press off of 3-4-boards and do some minor overheard lifting.

[SilverFox]

Bi's and Tris today all supersets, been finding some good strength gains over the past 6 weeks. In a cutting phase now but going to do it gradually

4 sets of each between 8 and 10 reps ( I usually up my weight after I can hit +10 in a full set)

DB Seated Curls
Decline Skull Crushers

DB Hammer Curls
OH Tri Press

Reverse DB Flys
Military Press DB

Chinups
Tri Bench Dips

[GreekGodX]

Where exactly is the injury Christos? One of our members is currently going through a partial rear delt tear. He still can bench press off of 3-4-boards and do some minor overheard lifting.

Well it feels like it is inside my shoulder if that makes any sense. Pretty much where my arm meets my shoulder straight down in there. Anything overhead hurts or if I reach back (ex. Reaching for my wallet in my back pocket). I imagine I could probably bench off boards. I did limited ROM lat pulldowns (to my forehead) and it was pain free.

I was reading an article the other day that said even with shoulder pain you should just limit your presses to military and bench. Then just focus on other lifts and shoulder rehab. I kinda just shook my head and laughed. I figure if there is a "bad pain" I shouldn't be doing that anymore until the pain is gone. Maybe I just am too logical.

[Secret Santa]

Santa did some squat thrusts this morning before taking a run with the elves.

I need a beer.

[icehog3]

Santa did some squat thrusts this morning

Thanks for putting that mental image in my head first thing in the morning. :r

Off to row.

[SilverFox]

Santa did some squat thrusts this morning before taking a run at the elves.

I need a beer.

fixed it for ya Santa

[BigFrank]

Santa is the ultimate powerlifter. Not only is he fat, but he wears a huge belt which is perfect for squatting. Loves fat guy food, cookies and milk. And be the looks of it, his blood pressure is through the roof due to a lot of test.

[icehog3]

Santa is the ultimate powerlifter. Not only is he fat, but he wears a huge belt which is perfect for squatting. Loves fat guy food, cookies and milk. And be the looks of it, his blood pressure is through the roof due to a lot of test.

Or gingerbread. ;)

Did moderate weight Bent Over Rows today....225 lbs for as many reps as I could get, cutting my rest by 10 seconds after every set until between the last 2 sets I only had time to reset my grip. Just killed my lats.

Followed this up with some heavy cable rows and finally some bodyweight pullups, but I didn't need much more. Must have done over 200 reps of the BORs.

[Secret Santa]

fixed it for ya Santa

That was supposed to stay between you, me and that transgendered elf we shared, Mr. Fox. Maybe you want to sign up to play in the Secret Santa pass and get some real chuckles.

[SilverFox]

That was supposed to stay between you, me and that transgendered elf we shared, Mr. Fox. Maybe you want to sign up to play in the Secret Santa pass and get some real chuckles.

I would Santa but I thought us Canucks were banned from the SS pass

[Patrick B]

Bought some Jack3d tonight as I'm about out of the GNC Pump Fuel. Decided to take it before work tonight and see how it made me feel. I am getting **** done at a record pace. I think I like it. Can't wait to work out on it tomorrow.

[PeteSB75]

Shoulders and back for me today. Bad sleep this week. Wife has been very restless, waking me up. Think she'd mind if I told her to go sleep on the couch? :tf

[BigFrank]

Bought some Jack3d tonight as I'm about out of the GNC Pump Fuel. Decided to take it before work tonight and see how it made me feel. I am getting **** done at a record pace. I think I like it. Can't wait to work out on it tomorrow.
Jack3d is the ****...period.
Shoulders and back for me today. Bad sleep this week. Wife has been very restless, waking me up. Think she'd mind if I told her to go sleep on the couch? :tf
Tell me about it, nothing like a 120lb girl, who snores like I should mind you, hogging the bed from a grown ass man pushing 260lbs. I just "accidently sleep on the sofa" it's firmer than the bed anyways.


Just got home from the Gym. Back, Shoulders and Biceps all done. Didn't go super heavy, wanted to keep the tempo fast and brutal.

[PeteSB75]

Tell me about it, nothing like a 120lb girl, who snores like I should mind you, hogging the bed from a grown ass man pushing 260lbs. I just "accidently sleep on the sofa" it's firmer than the bed anyways.


I would, but I need the cpap for my apnea while sleeping, so I can't just take the couch...

[BigFrank]

ya that blows. I dont need, well dont have the CPAP. I'm afraid to go in for it, I'm sure I need one. Trick is to get into bed, take up as much room as possible, and pass out while the Wife is in the shower.

[icehog3]

I had somnoplasty surgery twice for sleep apnea several years ago. The doctor said it could hold off my need for CPAP by 10 years or so....but the past couple months I just don't feel iike I have slept at all, even nights where I get close to 7 or 8 hours. I am thinking I will be trying the CPAP out sooner than later.

[hammondc]

Finished with Insanity. Start P90X Monday.

[papichulo]

I had somnoplasty surgery twice for sleep apnea several years ago. The doctor said it could hold off my need for CPAP by 10 years or so....but the past couple months I just don't feel iike I have slept at all, even nights where I get close to 7 or 8 hours. I am thinking I will be trying the CPAP out sooner than later.
tom, I stop breathing 47 times an hour with surgery done. Yes, I am a slave to the machine.

[icehog3]

tom, I stop breathing 47 times an hour with surgery done. Yes, I am a slave to the machine.

I was 63 times before the surgery, Brent. I know it was much improved for quite a while, but I am thinking I am getting back to where I started now. :td

[PeteSB75]

ya that blows. I dont need, well dont have the CPAP. I'm afraid to go in for it, I'm sure I need one. Trick is to get into bed, take up as much room as possible, and pass out while the Wife is in the shower.

I was 63 times before the surgery, Brent. I know it was much improved for quite a while, but I am thinking I am getting back to where I started now. :td

Both of you, get thee to a sleep study. Really. Makes a world of difference in everything you do.

Squats, deads and ab work for me today. Starting that month-long leg workout you sent next week, Frank.

[BigFrank]

Both of you, get thee to a sleep study. Really. Makes a world of difference in everything you do.

Squats, deads and ab work for me today. Starting that month-long leg workout you sent next week, Frank.

Good deal Pete. I'll put the sleep study on my to-do list. Right after buy more tobacco and supplements.

I'll have to go back into my notes and check out that routine. I don't remember off hand how it went.

[BigFrank]

Ok nevermind, I found it. Have fun with it. Let me know if you have any last minute questions. Also, when you go to max out or work at the higher %'s wearing knee wraps will be fine. But if you don't have a pair or do not feel comfortable wrapping your knees just do the routine sans the wraps.

[dogface_313]

Howdy fellas, haven't been around these parts in a while.

I am normally a crossfit guy. However since I am overseas I have decided to see how big I could get while being here. First couple of months i followed a 4 day split Legs, Chest, Back, Shoulders, rest day, start over again. Saw some great strength gains.

For the last couple of weeks i have been following a program called Growth Stimulus training. It revolves around a 7 day cycle with four weight training days per cycle. the weight training days are broken down into Squat, Pull, Lift, Press days. On each of these days you do a "core" lift that is a compound movement, and additional supplement exercises. My days look like below:

Squat: BB Back Squat(core), BB front Squat, Isometric Leg extension, Leg Press, Calf Extensions

Pull: Weighted Pullups(core), Bent Barebell Row, Lat Pulldowns, Hang Power Cleans

Lift: BB Deadlift(core), Lying Leg Curls, Weighted Hyperextensions, Kettle Bell Swings

Press: Incline BB Bench(core), Weighted Dips, super set flat Flyes + DB press, Push Press

I throw Biceps in on pull day, tris in on press day. the other 3 days are cardio and abs. Since starting i have seen huge strength improvements on almost every core lift, except bench. I have searched every where to try to find out what I am doing wrong. I think one of the problems i am having is that I don't lift with a partner, hence I am not confident to try to bang out that last rep on bench i.e. don't want a bar stuck on my chest.

Sorry for the book. Cliff notes: Not seeing improvement on bench even though i am seeing physical changes to my chest. think it is because i don't use a spotter, what say you?

[icehog3]

Both of you, get thee to a sleep study. Really. Makes a world of difference in everything you do.



Had one years ago before my somnoplasty, Pete, that's how I knew I had 63 episodes per hour. I am guessing they are going to make me have another one before prescribing the CPAP for me.

[BigFrank]

My brother had the same surgery Tom, actually twice now, and it hasn't really done **** for him beside make him look like his nose is broken constantly.

[icehog3]

My brother had the same surgery Tom, actually twice now, and it hasn't really done **** for him beside make him look like his nose is broken constantly.

They only give it a 40-60% success rate when they recommend it, Frank...it was a lot of pain for little reward.

As far as the other part goes, I wasn't that pretty to begin with. :r

[PeteSB75]

Since starting i have seen huge strength improvements on almost every core lift, except bench. I have searched every where to try to find out what I am doing wrong. I think one of the problems i am having is that I don't lift with a partner, hence I am not confident to try to bang out that last rep on bench i.e. don't want a bar stuck on my chest.

Sorry for the book. Cliff notes: Not seeing improvement on bench even though i am seeing physical changes to my chest. think it is because i don't use a spotter, what say you?

It's hard to tell what you might be doing without seeing you lift. Do you hold your shoulder blades together on the bench? Are you pushing into them with your legs? Are your arms too far apart or too close together?

Personally, once I got the basic technique down, I realized the main reason why I was stuck was psychological. I was afraid of that weight over my head. As soon as I legitimately started challenging myself - I actually got my girlfriend, now wife, to spot for me pretty frequently - I made a significant amount of very quick progress. She never had to do anything but stand at the top of the bench and watch me.

As far as a spotter, now I don't train with anyone, I just ask whomever is around, usually the guy on the next bench over, for a quick spot, and offer to do the same if he needs it. I generally only do that for 1RM attempts. On other heavy days, I want the little adrenaline boost I get from knowing that if I don't get the bar up, it's coming down on my chest. Use that fear to make you stronger, but don't stop listening to your body. If you struggle a lot and barely get the 4th rep up, don't try a fifth unless you are sure you can get it up.


Ok nevermind, I found it. Have fun with it. Let me know if you have any last minute questions. Also, when you go to max out or work at the higher %'s wearing knee wraps will be fine. But if you don't have a pair or do not feel comfortable wrapping your knees just do the routine sans the wraps.
Never used knee wraps. Can I use a similar progression for bench?

[BigFrank]

Never used knee wraps. Can I use a similar progression for bench?

Yes. The cycle I set up for you is more like a short meet style prep for maxing out. Run the 4 weeks. Push yourself near the end. Then take a week off. After maxing out on all lifts, it will give you more of a concrete idea as to where you really are. It will give us insights as to where muscular weaknesses are or technique breakdown.

During the week off will be the ideal time to set up a program, conditioning, diet, and training for the next 3-4 weeks of time.

[dogface_313]

Sipping Jac3D right now, Pull day tonight.
Weighted pullups 4 sets of 3(45# plate), then AMRAP of body weight
Bent BB Row (135 x 8) x 3
Hang Power Cleans (135 x 10) x 4
Lat Pulldowns (90# x 10) x 3

then Bicep Curls and hammer curls

Go PATS!

[potlimit]

It's hard to tell what you might be doing without seeing you lift. Do you hold your shoulder blades together on the bench? Are you pushing into them with your legs? Are your arms too far apart or too close together?

Personally, once I got the basic technique down, I realized the main reason why I was stuck was psychological. I was afraid of that weight over my head. As soon as I legitimately started challenging myself - I actually got my girlfriend, now wife, to spot for me pretty frequently - I made a significant amount of very quick progress. She never had to do anything but stand at the top of the bench and watch me.

As far as a spotter, now I don't train with anyone, I just ask whomever is around, usually the guy on the next bench over, for a quick spot, and offer to do the same if he needs it. I generally only do that for 1RM attempts. On other heavy days, I want the little adrenaline boost I get from knowing that if I don't get the bar up, it's coming down on my chest. Use that fear to make you stronger, but don't stop listening to your body. If you struggle a lot and barely get the 4th rep up, don't try a fifth unless you are sure you can get it up.



Never used knee wraps. Can I use a similar progression for bench?

I agree with the above that it's hard to tell without having seen you lift. However, with all due respect of course, I believe that fear of the bar coming down on your chest is a poor substitute for a spotter. When you have a spotter you will in all likelihood bang out at least one more rep than you would have without one. Even if the spotter helps some it's better than not having pushed yourself at all. Not to mention, you REALLY don't wanna be that guy that thinks he's got one more in him, gets it half way up and then has to call out for help in between hyperventilating.

This isn't to say you should only lift with a spotter (I don't really any more but I'm really just maintenance these days)... I just don't think you're going to make the same strength gains without one. And as he mentioned above, there's no shame in asking the guy next to you (as long as he looks capable) for a spot.

Obviously just my :2

[GreekGodX]

I might re-introduce some light pressing this week. Shoulder is pain free but I'm not sure where the my strength is at. I'll probably just keep it really light on chest and shoulders for the next couple weeks until I feel 100% comfortable challenging my shoulder.

Also seems that I've stopped gaining weight at 232lbs. Even with taking some days off and eating more calories my body wasn't having it. Looking to cut until December 25th then get back to bulking. I would love to get down to 200lbs but realistically I see myself getting to 215.

[DBall]

Today I went for sets. Benches were in use (that's usually the first thing I do). Here's what I did today in order:

Low Rows: 3 sets of 10 @ 140#

High Rows: 3 sets of 10 @ 200#

Bench: 115# x10/x7/x5

I also did a bunch of stuff I don't know the names of... I just watch people do things and try to mimic their movements for some stuff. all I know is that I'm spent. I think my next goal will be 3 sets of 10 at 115 on bench.

[icehog3]

I took after Dan and rowed the AM away as well. Upped the weight from my last barbell row workout by 20lbs and did sets with decreasing rest periods between each. Then I upped the rest a bit and went heavy on T-bar rows. Ended the session with pullups, and let me tell you, I was lucky to get 9-10 reps a set.

Shoulders and legs tomorrow, just light legs as I have hockey games tonight, tomorrow, Thursday and Friday. I should be good and ready to herf and drink by Saturday. :r

[BigFrank]

I agree with the above that it's hard to tell without having seen you lift. However, with all due respect of course, I believe that fear of the bar coming down on your chest is a poor substitute for a spotter. When you have a spotter you will in all likelihood bang out at least one more rep than you would have without one. Even if the spotter helps some it's better than not having pushed yourself at all. Not to mention, you REALLY don't wanna be that guy that thinks he's got one more in him, gets it half way up and then has to call out for help in between hyperventilating.

This isn't to say you should only lift with a spotter (I don't really any more but I'm really just maintenance these days)... I just don't think you're going to make the same strength gains without one. And as he mentioned above, there's no shame in asking the guy next to you (as long as he looks capable) for a spot.

Obviously just my :2
Just bench inside of a power rack, and set the safety catches to the proper point where you can safely dump the weight.

[PeteSB75]

Heavy chest/arms for me today. Cranked out 195x5, 205x5 and 215x3 with failure on the fourth rep on flat bench. Realized I'd been lifting below where I should have to challenge myself on the bench, so recruited myself a spotter and upped my weight. Figure at 85% of 1RM for 5 reps, I should be pushing 210 or 215 and I've only been pushing 195.

Frank, should I follow the squat progression for bench, the deadlift or a different one?

What I'm looking at starting tomorrow based on the numbers you gave me:
Squat ( 1RM 365 )
-Week 1 265 x 1 295 x 1 320 x 1 265 x rep out (6-10)

-Week 2 285 x 1 310 x 1 335 x 1 285 x rep out (6-10)

-Week 3 300 x 1 330 x 1 355 x 1 300 x rep out (6-10)

-Week 4 320 x 1 345 x 1 375 x 1 whatever you want x 1 (105%-110% depending on gas in tank)

Deadlift ( 1RM 355 )
-Week 1 265 x 1 290 x 1 320 x 1 285 x rep out (6-10)

-Week 2 275 x 1 305 x 1 335 x 1 300 x rep out (6-10)

-Week 3 290 x 1 320 x 1 350 x 1 skip rep out set

-Week 4 (Max Out) 300 x 1 335 x 1 370 x 1 whatever you want x 1 (110% if you go for it)

[Da Klugs]

Me posting in this thread is like the guy who comes to one of our herfs estoling the greatness of Gurkhas. :)

Been almost 2 months and I have not missed a day of pushups. Do 105 now but modified from the try for 100 all at once. 85 - then 10 deep breaths - then 20 more. 20th is near the point of failure. The 20 I try to do "perfectly" with slow full extensions.

Been using the 12 lb hand weights 50 reps of varying type 2x a day now.

Feel better about things. Stonger, firmer and well it shows in the mirror. Did the maintenance on my Airdyne and tonight is the night to start cardio/legs/weight loss/ more sensible diet.

235 LBS this morning. The goal is going to be 205 in 3 months - we will see.

[PeteSB75]

Me posting in this thread is like the guy who comes to one of our herfs estoling the greatness of Gurkhas. :)

Been almost 2 months and I have not missed a day of pushups. Do 105 now but modified from the try for 100 all at once. 85 - then 10 deep breaths - then 20 more. 20th is near the point of failure. The 20 I try to do "perfectly" with slow full extensions.

Been using the 12 lb hand weights 50 reps of varying type 2x a day now.

Feel better about things. Stonger, firmer and well it shows in the mirror. Did the maintenance on my Airdyne and tonight is the night to start cardio/legs/weight loss/ more sensible diet.

235 LBS this morning. The goal is going to be 205 in 3 months - we will see.

As long as you are working at it and committed to making improvements, that's all that matters. Strength comes with time and effort, just as a friendship does, and both take years to build.

You've made a good start, more than most ever attempt. Now we just need to get you working on more than just the beach muscles :noon

[BigFrank]

Frank, should I follow the squat progression for bench, the deadlift or a different one?

Everything looks good Pete. Yes you can follow the same percentages for the bench. It's what I would do, max out in 4 weeks on all 3 lifts...Remember this is just a 4 week ( mock meet style ) routine. Challenge is to get yourself ready to push out some serious weight. Only thing I would change would be skip the rep out on week #3 for squats.

After you finish this up, we'll have to get something set up for the next 3-4 months...

[GreekGodX]

So started a diet and my my partner in my team for class brought in butterfingers for us. Butterfingers are one of my favorite candy. I will resist!

Did incline bench, regular bench and military press yesterday and my shoulder has no pain today :wo Hit legs hard today. Very happy minus the whole Butterfinger situation.

[BigFrank]

So started a diet and my my partner in my team for class brought in butterfingers for us. Butterfingers are one of my favorite candy. I will resist!

Did incline bench, regular bench and military press yesterday and my shoulder has no pain today :wo Hit legs hard today. Very happy minus the whole Butterfinger situation.

Try that shake recipe I sent ya. It's got a good "sweet" fighting taste to it lol...Try doing a scoop of chocolate whey if you're a big chocolate fan...

For everyone else. Here is the shake recipe that I told Christos about...It's low carb...

1 cup water
4-5 ice cubes ( can add more or less to your liking )
1 tbsp Sugar / Fat Free Butterscotch instant pudding mix
2 scoops vanilla whey ( feel free to do 1 choc 1 vanilla or 2 scoops choc )
2 tbsp peanut butter

Blend on high...

[GreekGodX]

Try that shake recipe I sent ya. It's got a good "sweet" fighting taste to it lol...Try doing a scoop of chocolate whey if you're a big chocolate fan...

For everyone else. Here is the shake recipe that I told Christos about...It's low carb...

1 cup water
4-5 ice cubes ( can add more or less to your liking )
1 tbsp Sugar / Fat Free Butterscotch instant pudding mix
2 scoops vanilla whey ( feel free to do 1 choc 1 vanilla or 2 scoops choc )
2 tbsp peanut butter

Blend on high...

Went out and bought some pudding mix earlier. Looking forward to trying it tonight :tu

This chick is waving the Butterfingers in front of my face but I'm not caving in. Although the more she bothers me about taking one you guys might hear about a "enraged calorie deprived student" punching a middle aged woman in the face. With a youtube video to follow :r

[BigFrank]

I would just take it from her, and smash it up and stomp on it. Then walk away like nothing happened.

[PeteSB75]

Sounds like a good recipe Frank. I do something very similar but with frozen strawberries or frozen bananas instead of the ice, sugar and pudding mix. I'll sometimes throw a scoop or two of plain greek yogurt in as well, to give it a nice creamy texture.

So, started that progression this morning. Added a few warmup sets for each lift.

Deadlift - 135 x 5 225 x 3 265 x 1 290 x 1 320 x 1 285 x 6 (grip was giving me trouble - will bring chalk for the singles and straps for the reps next time. I'm not used to doing more than 5 reps of a heavy dead.)

Squat - 45 x 8 135 x 5 225 x 3 265 x 1 295 x 1 320 x 1 265 x 10

[Da Klugs]

As long as you are working at it and committed to making improvements, that's all that matters. Strength comes with time and effort, just as a friendship does, and both take years to build.

You've made a good start, more than most ever attempt. Now we just need to get you working on more than just the beach muscles :noon

:r Hey it's nice to feel like I have any muscles.

Finally hit the cardio last night. Half hour on the Airdyne. 15 minutes at 3.5 and some arm and leg only things for another 15. Lord I hate this thing but it makes the sweat pour like shots at the Freshman mixer. :D

Avoided the nightime candy binge - had a apple and some pretzels. Maybe eliminate the icecream soon.... maybe.

[PeteSB75]

:r Hey it's nice to feel like I have any muscles.

Finally hit the cardio last night. Half hour on the Airdyne. 15 minutes at 3.5 and some arm and leg only things for another 15. Lord I hate this thing but it makes the sweat pour like shots at the Freshman mixer. :D

Avoided the nightime candy binge - had a apple and some pretzels. Maybe eliminate the icecream soon.... maybe.

Refined sugar is very addictive. If you cut it out completely, after a few days or a week, you will no longer crave it. And after a few months, you can have a little at a time without overindulging. At least that has been my experience. But if you do want to indulge occasionally, night-time is the worst time to do it. Your body is getting ready to sleep and consume calories much slower, so those extra calories go straight into storage.

[PeteSB75]

Shoulders and back today. I need to get some sleep, exhausted today, not sure why.

[icehog3]

Off day....well, sort of. Game tonight, 5 games in 7 nights actually. I'm with Pete. :r

[BigFrank]

Shoulders and back today. I need to get some sleep, exhausted today, not sure why.

Tore yourself a new one with that 4 week program lol!!! Make sure you eat a little extra cals while pushing yourself hard Pete. Also, Squat before deadlift.

Did some benching last night, felt like crap. No soreness just felt rather gassed.

[PeteSB75]

Tore yourself a new one with that 4 week program lol!!! Make sure you eat a little extra cals while pushing yourself hard Pete. Also, Squat before deadlift.

Did some benching last night, felt like crap. No soreness just felt rather gassed.

:tu Just did the first workout though, and it didn't seem that hard while I was doing it. Well, repping out at the end was hard, but the single rep stuff wasn't, really. I expect it will start to be tougher next week, and only get more so from there. I'm pretty good when it comes to getting enough calories. My problems stem more from getting too many... :tf

[BigFrank]

:tu Just did the first workout though, and it didn't seem that hard while I was doing it. Well, repping out at the end was hard, but the single rep stuff wasn't, really. I expect it will start to be tougher next week, and only get more so from there. I'm pretty good when it comes to getting enough calories. My problems stem more from getting too many... :tf
The weights should become more difficult as you go heavier. The key is to start hard-wiring yourself to perform that 1 rep with good form and firing every muscle. So that way when you go to perform a good max, all of that work will be ingrained in you.

Assistance work tomorrow.

[hammondc]

Hey guys....

I need a suggestion for a good protein powder. I am doing combination of Insanity/P90X so I want to try to keep the Cals down. My goal is building very very lean mass, not just simply bulking up.
I hear Syntha6 is really good stuff, but the cals seem high (around 225 for just the powder) and for some reason, it has a lot of cholesterol (which could be problematic for me). Optimum Gold Standard has been suggested as well and come in at only 124 cals.

[icehog3]

Optimum Nutrition 100% Whey....the Rocky Road flavor is absolutely delicious.

[BigFrank]

I just stick with chocolate...ON is a good one. I use Dymatize.

[icehog3]

Insomnia last night, didn't fall asleep until 5AM after my hockey game....so the gym is a no-go today. I will do a double tomorrow morning before the MoB Herf.

[DBall]

My new goal is 3 sets of 10 at 115lbs on the bench. Did 9/8/8 today... I should have this in no time. I can't wait for the day when I can walk into the gym, throw a 45 on each side and bust sets of those out... :D

[MiamiE]

A 45# plate on each side is not that much. You will be there in no time! :tu

[DBall]

A 45# plate on each side is not that much. You will be there in no time! :tu

it is when you are 5'9" and weigh 142lbs... hahaha :r

[bonjing]

jacked up my knee on the treadmill wed night, that kinda ended my work out week. hopefully it'll get better by Monday, thinking the gout is kicking in.

[BigFrank]

That sucks Greg. Treadmill gives my knees and ankles a fit sometimes. Nothing serious but some joint pain that is for sure. But then again, 260 lbs isn't kind on the joints either.

Back, Shoulders and Biceps on Friday. Nothing special.

[icehog3]

Started on Glucosamine/Condroiton/MSM and Fish Oil today, my shoulders are just raw lately. :hn

[BigFrank]

Started on Glucosamine/Condroiton/MSM and Fish Oil today, my shoulders are just raw lately. :hn

Give Universal's Flex a shot Tom. I've been using it for years now. Everything comes in a nice pack and at 24$ for 44 days worth it's decent.

[icehog3]

Give Universal's Flex a shot Tom. I've been using it for years now. Everything comes in a nice pack and at 24$ for 44 days worth it's decent.

Where do you find that at, Frank? Thanks. :)

[BigFrank]

Where do you normally order from Tom?

http://www.bodybuilding.com/store/univ/flex.html

That's about as far as I go with joint supplements. Anything more and I'd just be better off buying some Deca... :tu :r

[icehog3]

Where do you normally order from Tom?

http://www.bodybuilding.com/store/univ/flex.html

That's about as far as I go with joint supplements. Anything more and I'd just be better off buying some Deca... :tu :r

The reviews look great, I will be picking this up Monday...wish I hadn't already opened the $30 bottle of G/C/MSM.

Thank you Frank! :tu

[Da Klugs]

Same old same old... 105 push-ups this morning. Have 2 months of uninterrupted daily floor pushing now.

Doing 100 reps of various ilk with the 12lb hand weights. About a month into this and it is ... kinda fun. Do them in 5 uninterupted sets of 10 from various angles and positions 2 times a day. Looking for lean strength vs adding mass.

[area51]

I can't believe I didn't stumble into this thread earlier.

[icehog3]

Give Universal's Flex a shot Tom. I've been using it for years now. Everything comes in a nice pack and at 24$ for 44 days worth it's decent.

Picked up a can and started today...hoping it lives up to the great reviews. :)

[BigFrank]

Picked up a can and started today...hoping it lives up to the great reviews. :)

To be honest Tom, I think the joint support combination takes time before it starts to work. I'm not 100% sure exactly why, maybe I'll do some more research later, but it took some time before I started noticing change. Biggest thing I noticed was when I got up in the morning, there was a chinese fire cracker going off down the hall as I limped into the shower.

Busted some easy Squats tonight. Did some leg presses, hammy curls, leg exts, cardo then rolled out. Been feeling a little under the weather lately. Hacking crap up, but no fever so playing it safe for now.

[SilverFox]

Still hammering away.

Today was my mixed day (hit a little of every muscle) on a 5 day rotation.

I am down 6lbs in just over 2 weeks so I am pretty sure I am keeping my muscle up.

Pull ups (still my least favourite exercise) however my reps are coming up so I guess I am getting better at it.

Also upped my single arm DB rows to 100# (first time ever at that weight) OMFG it is heavy but manage 4 sets 8/9/8/7.

Over all I still have my motivation up, but man results are slow and painful compared to losing weight.

Also have been doing legs as part of the rotation, another thing I never did in the past.........I am sticking to the routine.

Keep hammering it D'Ball hell it wasn't that long ago I was around 115 on my bench and I am nowhere near 5'9 142. It comes up in fits and starts..........I felt I had plateaued forever then it shot up 20lbs in a couple of weeks.

I figured out why my elbows were killing me, it was over extension on my DB flies, corrected my form as well as glucosomine 2 times a day and pain is gone.

[icehog3]

To be honest Tom, I think the joint support combination takes time before it starts to work. I'm not 100% sure exactly why, maybe I'll do some more research later, but it took some time before I started noticing change.


Reading the reviews I figured at least 3 weeks for any noticable results....think it will be longer Frank? I don't care, I will stay with it at least 90 days, but hope to get some results much sooner.

Biggest thing I noticed was when I got up in the morning, there was a chinese fire cracker going off down the hall as I limped into the shower.

Not sure what this means, but it doesn't sound good. :r

[Patrick B]

Backing off the cardio and the super strict diet for a while. It was boring me to death. Upping the protein and concentrating on lifting heavier. I much prefer this type of working out. I feel awesome after a heavy (for me) workout. I'll stick with this through the end of the year and then maybe switch back to a fat-loss program for a while beginning in 2011. As long as I stay around 250 I'll be happy, but I expect some strength and muscle gains as well. I seem to be stuck at this weight and around 26% bodyfat. I'd like to be about 225 and a lot leaner, but we'll worry about that later. I want to pack on some muscle right now.

[PeteSB75]

Started Frank's four week regimen on bench this morning, so a few warmup sets, then one rep each of 175, 195 and 210, then 175x10. Followed up with arms - curls and dips.

[BigFrank]

Reading the reviews I figured at least 3 weeks for any noticable results....think it will be longer Frank? I don't care, I will stay with it at least 90 days, but hope to get some results much sooner.



Not sure what this means, but it doesn't sound good. :r

I meant to say there "wasn't" lol

[icehog3]

I meant to say there "wasn't" lol

Whew...I feel better now Frank. :r

[area51]

I'm doing a 5x5 program so today was

225 bench 5x5
Dips
295 Deads
305 Squats
and 3x8 curls

[DBall]

Anyone got any program suggestions for me? :)

I fell like I've learned how to do some exercises now and know what amount of weight I can do, but I don't really know what I should be doing, how often I should be doing it, etc.

Also, I have no clue how to do squats or dead lifts, but I could ask the owner and he'd definitely show me.

[BigFrank]

Anyone got any program suggestions for me? :)
I fell like I've learned how to do some exercises now and know what amount of weight I can do, but I don't really know what I should be doing, how often I should be doing it, etc.
Also, I have no clue how to do squats or dead lifts, but I could ask the owner and he'd definitely show me.
Poke around this site for a bit. http://www.exrx.net/
Also check out youtube. Just type in squat. http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=dbxxs1PErLQ

For now I would do something simple. Much like area 51 is doing. I'm not a fan of total body workouts for various reasons. I would Squat on Monday 5sets of 5 reps, Bench on Weds, and Deadlift on Friday. Do 2-3 assistance exercises during each training day. If you want to add a 4th day I would do the overhead press.

[PeteSB75]

Second week of four on squats/deads this morning.

Three warm-up sets on Squat, then 285x1, 310x1, 335x1 285x10. Deads, two warm-up sets, then 275x1, 305x1, 335x1, 300x5 - was running late this morning and failed to bring straps or chalk with me. Got through five with resetting my grip once, but would have needed to do it a second time and my hands were raw. The singles were good though, had good form and good effort throughout.

Looking forward to pushing/pulling more next week. Followed the workout with my normal shake, 2 1/2 scoops 100% whey vanilla, peanut butter, frozen strawberries, flax seeds and milk.

[hammondc]

I just stick with chocolate...ON is a good one. I use Dymatize.

Quick quesiton as I am about to head out for the day and plan on grabbing some protein powder. GNC has a $19.99 sale on some of the protein. Does anyone here recommend any of THESE (http://www.gnc.com/family/index.jsp?categoryId=10935573&ab=CMS:HOMEPAGE:CMS:A-2-1:111610:Protein) over Optimum Nutrition?

[PeteSB75]

Quick quesiton as I am about to head out for the day and plan on grabbing some protein powder. GNC has a $19.99 sale on some of the protein. Does anyone here recommend any of THESE (http://www.gnc.com/family/index.jsp?categoryId=10935573&ab=CMS:HOMEPAGE:CMS:A-2-1:111610:Protein) over Optimum Nutrition?

Never tried most of em. Used to use muscle milk, but it's got way too many calories, and not as good quality protein. Tried a few others, none that I liked as much as the ON. Most of em have lots of crap in them, including most of the ones in that promotion. I tend to shy away from any protein powder with High Fructose Corn Syrup, or with Sucralose or any sugar alcohol.

I just get my ON at the Vitamin Shoppe - They have the 2lb jug for 19.90, or a 5+ lb jug for just over $40. Prices in the store are very similar to online, maybe a buck or two more, without having to pay shipping, or you can just wait for one of the free shipping deals they run every couple of months.

http://www.vitaminshoppe.com/search/en/query.jsp?x=0&y=0&q=100%25+whey&intsource2=main&tab_selection=sports

[hammondc]

Never tried most of em. Used to use muscle milk, but it's got way too many calories, and not as good quality protein. Tried a few others, none that I liked as much as the ON. Most of em have lots of crap in them, including most of the ones in that promotion. I tend to shy away from any protein powder with High Fructose Corn Syrup, or with Sucralose or any sugar alcohol.

I just get my ON at the Vitamin Shoppe - They have the 2lb jug for 19.90, or a 5+ lb jug for just over $40. Prices in the store are very similar to online, maybe a buck or two more, without having to pay shipping, or you can just wait for one of the free shipping deals they run every couple of months.

http://www.vitaminshoppe.com/search/en/query.jsp?x=0&y=0&q=100%25+whey&intsource2=main&tab_selection=sports

ON at vitamin shoppe it is. Thanks!

[icehog3]

Does anyone here recommend any of THESE (http://www.gnc.com/family/index.jsp?categoryId=10935573&ab=CMS:HOMEPAGE:CMS:A-2-1:111610:Protein) over Optimum Nutrition?

Not a single one of them. ;)

[icehog3]

New sleep study scheduled for Saturday, might be on CPAP by Sunday....hoping for some increased energy levels and some potential gains down the line.

[hscmit]

be careful with those protein powders many have recently been found to have large amounts of heavy metals, which are toxic, in them

here is a link to a snapshot the whole article was well done

http://news.injuryboard.com/consumer-reports-on-protein-powder-plus-metals-.aspx?googleid=281896

[icehog3]

Everybody's gotta die sometime. ;)

[mosesbotbol]

Anyone take Pregnenolone as a supplement? It’s inexpensive and you’ll notice an increase in testosterone.

**********

from web: Pregnenolone is a naturally occurring metabolite that is made in your body. It is often referred to as the ‘mother steroid compound’ because it is the basic raw material for all steroid hormones in the body. This includes cortisone, Progesterone, estrogen, testosterone and DHEA.

Although it’s the precursor of all steroid hormones, Pregnenolone itself is not a steroid hormone. Instead, Pregnenolone is made from cholesterol in the cells of both the adrenal gland and the central nervous system. Inside each cell there are 1000’s of mitochondria (tiny power plants) and it is inside these mitochondria that Pregnenolone is produced.

Pregnenolone has been studied since the 1940’s. Experiments conducted in the 1940's and 1950's found Pregnenolone could not only increase the productivity levels and reduce the stress of factory workers, but was also an excellent anti-inflammatory medication for conditions such as arthritis and allergies.

[PeteSB75]

be careful with those protein powders many have recently been found to have large amounts of heavy metals, which are toxic, in them

here is a link to a snapshot the whole article was well done

http://news.injuryboard.com/consumer-reports-on-protein-powder-plus-metals-.aspx?googleid=281896

That article has been discussed at length here. Normally I like Consumer Reports, but when they refuse to disclose testing methodology and also use sample sizes that are larger than what 99% of users consume, I really have to question the results. And please, at least make an attempt to differentiate between meal replacement shakes and supplemental shakes.

In any case, if you look at their results, ON 100% Whey was not flagged for anything.

[Da Klugs]

110 push-ups this morning.

Been supplementing with chocolate chip cookies the past few days. :)

[hscmit]

That article has been discussed at length here. Normally I like Consumer Reports, but when they refuse to disclose testing methodology and also use sample sizes that are larger than what 99% of users consume, I really have to question the results. And please, at least make an attempt to differentiate between meal replacement shakes and supplemental shakes.

In any case, if you look at their results, ON 100% Whey was not flagged for anything.



Sorry, wasnt posted to cause a problem, I didnt read far enough back and please dont feel like I want to encourage anyone to do or not do anything they want to their body

[icehog3]

Anyone take Pregnenolone as a supplement? It’s inexpensive and you’ll notice an increase in testosterone.



Is this something that requires a prescription, Moses?

[hammondc]

That article has been discussed at length here. Normally I like Consumer Reports, but when they refuse to disclose testing methodology and also use sample sizes that are larger than what 99% of users consume, I really have to question the results. And please, at least make an attempt to differentiate between meal replacement shakes and supplemental shakes.

In any case, if you look at their results, ON 100% Whey was not flagged for anything.

I will likely only be doing one serving a day blended with 1% milk and a banana or berries of some sort as a recovery drink. 2 servings MAX if I do a meal replacement which would be infrequently.

[hammondc]

110 push-ups this morning.

Been supplementing with chocolate chip cookies the past few days. :)

I see you keep upping this pushup #. Seems like a good program. Are you doing them all at once or broken up into sets?

[BigFrank]

Anyone take Pregnenolone as a supplement? It’s inexpensive and you’ll notice an increase in testosterone.

**********

from web: Pregnenolone is a naturally occurring metabolite that is made in your body. It is often referred to as the ‘mother steroid compound’ because it is the basic raw material for all steroid hormones in the body. This includes cortisone, Progesterone, estrogen, testosterone and DHEA.

Although it’s the precursor of all steroid hormones, Pregnenolone itself is not a steroid hormone. Instead, Pregnenolone is made from cholesterol in the cells of both the adrenal gland and the central nervous system. Inside each cell there are 1000’s of mitochondria (tiny power plants) and it is inside these mitochondria that Pregnenolone is produced.

Pregnenolone has been studied since the 1940’s. Experiments conducted in the 1940's and 1950's found Pregnenolone could not only increase the productivity levels and reduce the stress of factory workers, but was also an excellent anti-inflammatory medication for conditions such as arthritis and allergies.

To be honest, if I want to go that route I'll just buy the real thing. That why I'm not blowing my money and I know exactly what is going in. Problem is it is the precursor for as stated "cortisone, Progesterone, estrogen, testosterone and DHEA" so...If I'm reading that right the body pretty much gets the raw material and can make what it wants from it...Could be bad could be good. Too risky.

[mosesbotbol]

To be honest, if I want to go that route I'll just buy the real thing.

What's stopping you? That is not to knock Pregnenolone. Anything that prevents inflamation should be consider a plus and that is just one benefit. Pregnenolone is pretty inexpensive, on par with a daily multi or fish oil pill.

[mosesbotbol]

Is this something that requires a prescription, Moses?

Not at all. Most online vitamin retailers carry it.

[icehog3]

Problem is it is the precursor for as stated "cortisone, Progesterone, estrogen, testosterone and DHEA" so...If I'm reading that right the body pretty much gets the raw material and can make what it wants from it...Could be bad could be good. Too risky.

Couple quotes from different manufacturer's own descriptions:

Pregnenolone is the starting point from which all steroid hormones are manufactured in our bodies. Its conversion in the body follows different pathways, depending on individual needs.

Using pregnenolone (PREG) may elevate your DHEA levels, and DHEA can increase estrogen and testosterone levels.

[Da Klugs]

I see you keep upping this pushup #. Seems like a good program. Are you doing them all at once or broken up into sets?

Was 80/20 per the below. Started below today.

100 at a blur pace.

10 deep breaths. (ok gasping)

10 full extension with a pause at the bottom.

[hammondc]

I may jump on board with that. Although, I can only get through about 30-40.

[Mugen910]

saw this and thought of you gents.


Jack3d for 29.90 shipped anywhere in US
For anyone looking for a fairly decent deal on pre workout products. SimplyCheapSupplements.com is offering Jack3d 8.8oz for 29.90 shipped anywhere in the US. The best price I've seen Jack3d selling for is around 34 shipped to my address.

Here's the link to the product http://simplycheapsupplements.com/Jack3d-Tropical-Fruit-Punch-8.8-oz

To get the deal you'll need to use coupon code vivai88 which takes 5% off the price.

P.S. looks like the code works for any product on the site.

[icehog3]

saw this and thought of you gents.


Jack3d for 29.90 shipped anywhere in US
For anyone looking for a fairly decent deal on pre workout products. SimplyCheapSupplements.com is offering Jack3d 8.8oz for 29.90 shipped anywhere in the US. The best price I've seen Jack3d selling for is around 34 shipped to my address.

Here's the link to the product http://simplycheapsupplements.com/Jack3d-Tropical-Fruit-Punch-8.8-oz

To get the deal you'll need to use coupon code vivai88 which takes 5% off the price.

P.S. looks like the code works for any product on the site.

$24.95 at FitRX, Bao, and they have free shipping promotions all the time if you sign up for their e-mails. :)

http://www.fitrx.com/fitrx/fitrx_result.asp?pid=16574481193111201051431811&operation=Find&i_desc=jack3d&i_brand=0&i_pagesize=10

[mosesbotbol]

saw this and thought of you gents.


[I][B]Jack3d for 29.90 shipped anywhere in US
For anyone looking for a fairly decent deal on pre workout products.

You really find them to be that beneficial vs. just having a coffee before a workout?

[BigFrank]

What's stopping you? That is not to knock Pregnenolone. Anything that prevents inflamation should be consider a plus and that is just one benefit. Pregnenolone is pretty inexpensive, on par with a daily multi or fish oil pill.

Ibuprofen prevents inflammation so why not take a ton everyday? High estrogen levels promote bloating and water storage with may be what helps this with inflammation. Like Tom quoted, it's too varying. You're dumping the building blocks for pretty much whatever your body feels like making. Having a shitty day and your body is loaded with cortisol and stress levels are sky high, what you think is going to happen when your body has instant and easy access to make more.Test and estrogen play a delicate balance inside of our bodies. Problem is testosterone aromatizes into estrogen, estrogen just stays as estrogen. So if you were to take it with the hopes of jacking your tests levels up, you would need to be on Estrogen blockers and inhibitors. And with that were talking using prescription grade drugs here. Unless you go the full chemical route, I'd just stick to the basics.

My main concern is I fear that people will take said supplement, with the hopes of being some miracle pill. But in reality it may create more issues than intended.

[icehog3]

You really find them to be that beneficial vs. just having a coffee before a workout?

Coffee before a workout makes me jittery, Moses...with this form of caffeine and its other ingredients, I get a boost of energy and additional focus without the jitters.

[BigFrank]

I just snagged some Jack3d. The new flavor Raspberry Lemonade is decent. Jack3d is the only Pre-workout stimulant drink mix that I have used that I did not get accustomed too. Most other mixes I find I need to cycle, not the case with Jack3d..

[Mugen910]

You really find them to be that beneficial vs. just having a coffee before a workout?

I drink so much coffee that it doesn't do much for me..

[DBall]

I've never tried any caffeine before a workout... do you find it helps?

[alwayslit]

http://www.prosource.net/site/top_50_products.aspx.....prosource also has jack3d at 24.95 with free shipping on orders over $200.

[BigFrank]

I've never tried any caffeine before a workout... do you find it helps?

big time...next time grab a cup of coffee or an energy drink. Just make sure you drink it with time to spare before you get to the gym.

[BigFrank]

http://www.prosource.net/site/top_50_products.aspx.....prosource also has jack3d at 24.95 with free shipping on orders over $200.

23.95 from DPS
http://www.dpsnutrition.net/get_by_209.htm

these guys are my go to supp place.

[DBall]

big time...next time grab a cup of coffee or an energy drink. Just make sure you drink it with time to spare before you get to the gym.

OK... I usually have a very minimal amount of caffeine anymore since my stomach was jacked all last year... I usually wait until I'm out of the gym and have my coffee and cigar (after the protein shake).

I'll give it a try and report back.

[mosesbotbol]

I drink so much coffee that it doesn't do much for me..

Yikes. I am sure your drinking 4x the amount of coffee in water to balance it out, right. ;)

It's easy to get in the coffee trap.

[mosesbotbol]

Ibuprofen prevents inflammation so why not take a ton everyday?

I'd take Wobenzym instead. Talk about naturally kicking down inflamation! Whenever I get back pain, that Wobenzym works wonder in a few days. Totally natural and not too expensive.

Worth looking into.

[icehog3]

I'd take Wobenzym instead. Talk about naturally kicking down inflamation! Whenever I get back pain, that Wobenzym works wonder in a few days. Totally natural and not too expensive.

Worth looking into.

That has bromelain in it, just like the Animal Flex I just started taking. Some believe that's the key. :tu

[mosesbotbol]

That has bromelain in it, just like the Animal Flex I just started taking. Some believe that's the key. :tu

Wobenzym is a wonderful supplement, but has to be taken on an empty stomach twice a day. If you can plan your day around it, you'll reap benefits for sure.

"In addition, Wobenzym acts as a natural and safe alternative to anti-inflammatory drugs such as Ibuprofen.

Furthermore, some Olympic teams have used Wobenzym to reduce injuries by as much as 50% and to enhance healing after injury. This is partly due to the bioflavonoids ability to prevent the discoloration and local pain associated with traumatic injuries. For these same reasons, leading surgeons now routinely prescribe Wobenzym to prevent bruising and edema and the associated pain for their post-surgical patients."

[BigFrank]

That has bromelain in it, just like the Animal Flex I just started taking. Some believe that's the key. :tu

Told ya that Flex is no joke. For the price, and conveinence ( the packs ) it can't be beat really.

[PeteSB75]

No lifting yesterday or today, went rock wall climbing last night instead. Never tried it before, and it was a load of fun. It's also a heck of a workout, lifting my 250lb carcass up a 50ft wall, even with regular hand and foot holds. I think I will have to do it again, and soon. Will do wonders for my grip strength, my forearms were tight as I've ever felt them by the time I was done. Also helping with legs and core strength. Great stuff! :tu

[mosesbotbol]

I think I will have to do it again, and soon. Will do wonders for my grip strength, my forearms were tight as I've ever felt them by the time I was done. Also helping with legs and core strength. Great stuff! :tu

Stretching hips, legs, and glut's before getting too involved will help you out a lot with climbing.

[icehog3]

Told ya that Flex is no joke. For the price, and conveinence ( the packs ) it can't be beat really.

Only 4 days in and my joint pain is probably down 50% already....hoping for more improvement over the next few weeks. Thanks again for the tip, Frank. :tu

[Da Klugs]

I may jump on board with that. Although, I can only get through about 30-40.

I started in September at 10. :)

We are minor leaguers compared to what this thread is focused on but hey... whatever works for you is good. I'm greatful for this ongoing discussion. It has helped stimulate me to get started and most importantly keep with a program that has been good for me.

The addition of the 12 lb hand weights has been a nice dimension. Keep them in the family room and toss off various types of 10 set reps as a nice break to TV watching.

Still resist cardio. One session on the airdyne and none since. Need to add something.. thinking about jumping jacks and maybe squat thrusts.

[icehog3]

Still resist cardio. One session on the airdyne and none since. Need to add something.. thinking about jumping jacks and maybe squat thrusts.

Come to Chicago for 60 days and I'll put you on the hockey team, Dave. :D

[GreekGodX]

23.95 from DPS
http://www.dpsnutrition.net/get_by_209.htm

these guys are my go to supp place.

Not sure how much shipping is from DPS but I find Jack3d between $20-$25 on Amazon.com. I have a free prime account so 2-day shipping is free.

In diet news.. Following my diet to a T. Parents had pizza last night I passed and had my salmon filet, brown rice and spinach salad. A few days, I haven't had enough carbs and went loco on a few people :r Got that fixed now so all is good. Down 4 pounds in 2 weeks.

Following up with the forecast on the workout.. Shoulders and maybe some triceps today. I've been doing a lot of rest/pause work on rows(single arm and bent over). Basically just making sure the weight touches the ground and comes to a complete stop before I do another rep. On single arm rows I did 3 sets of 105x8 and I'll definitely be going heavier next workout. It gives me a good stretch on the bottom and the split second of rest is enough to give me an extra breath to get out more reps.

[icehog3]

Sounds like you are kickin' ass in all directions, Christos! :tu

[SilverFox]

Bi's and Tri's yesterday

Seated DB Curls
Skullcrushers
Standing DB Hammer Curls
OH Tri Press
Chinups
Tri Dips
Concentration Curls
Single arm DB tri Extensions

4 sets of each on a superset basis............about an hour to hammer through it all. This is slow slow going but I am still seeing results so I keep at it.

[icehog3]

Have my sleep study tonight after work....hoping that CPAP is the miracle that a lot of my friends are telling me it is.

[BigFrank]

Not sure how much shipping is from DPS but I find Jack3d between $20-$25 on Amazon.com. I have a free prime account so 2-day shipping is free.
They are 1 state away from me, so I usually get my stuff in about 48hours. They UPS ground ship for the same rate anywhere in the CONUS 48. Plus they offer discount by how much you spend. Right now they have a 15% off anything over 150$ which for me ended up being free shipping and a few bucks off. Plus ya get free **** when you order over 100$ too...

[bonjing]

Knee is feeling better, guess it was the gout.

Any of you guys have on of those days where it seems you can't throw up the weight that you've been doing.

I started out good on Monday doing incline db's, nothing out of the ordinary, then when it came time to do the flat db's I just couldn't throw up the weight. I started out at 75's on the first set thinking I'll end with the 90's or 95's but when I jumped to the 85's for the second set, nothing :sh. I pushed it up 5 times or so then my arms just felt weak, I dropped down to 65's and even those felt heavy.

What gives? Can I just chalk it up to having "one of those days?" REst of the week went fine. I'm going to start adding the Da Klugs routine to my work out soon :ze

[icehog3]

Absolutely Greg....if we could all go at "100%" every workout we would all be Hurculean....just doesn't work that way, and a lot of factors (diet, rest, mental state, and a multitide of others) can affect our strength and endurance from day to day.

[BigFrank]

Your Central Nervous System can also take a beating from training.

Worked some assistance work on Friday and got a new tattoo. Looking to do a meet in the late winter but there isn't anything close to me. I'm thinking of running my own meet, maybe a bench for cash meet so I get a decent turn out. We'll see.

[PeteSB75]

Nothing for me this weekend. Woke up yesterday with a nasty bug that took me down for yesterday and today. Tomorrow is a normal off-day for me, so we'll see how it goes on Tuesday.

[SilverFox]

Chest and Legs today

You know, no matter how long I do them I absolutely hate doing squats. About the 7th rep in every set I am in pass out mode. I can push anything too the max to the point of failure.............squats............just not my exercise. I keep doing them though............:sh

[Da Klugs]

Same ol same ol over the weekend. The 100 consecutive push-ups is starting to get easier so maybe upping it this week. No cardio yet. :(

[icehog3]

Same ol same ol over the weekend. The 100 consecutive push-ups is starting to get easier so maybe upping it this week. No cardio yet. :(

Hockey team needs a left wing. ;)

[PeteSB75]

Have my sleep study tonight after work....hoping that CPAP is the miracle that a lot of my friends are telling me it is.

Never heard back on how the sleep study went, Tom?

[icehog3]

It was miserable, Pete. :hn

Took me about 2 hours to fall asleep once I was all hooked up. Then I woke up about 2 hours into sleep with an intense migraine. I asked them for something to kill the pain and they said since there were only techs in the lab and no doctors, they couldn't give me anything.

I stuck it out because I already had a couple hours of sleep and didn't want to start again another night. But I bascially laid there in agony, falling asleep for 5 minutes here and 5 minutes there once I was totally exhausted, then waking back up in pain.

I will definitely be bringing some of my own pain killers to the next study just in case.

[DBall]

did 3 sets of 10 at 115lbs on the bench today... woot! I hit my goal. Next goal should be with 45s on each side... 3 sets of 5, maybe? :banger

[PeteSB75]

It was miserable, Pete. :hn

Sorry ;s Hope the next one goes better.

[Mugen910]

Squats at home :ze

[cort]

Squats at home :ze

on the toilet?

[icehog3]

Sorry ;s Hope the next one goes better.

It couldn't be worse, Brother. I am wondering if something in the adhesive they used all over my head and face for the electrodes gave me the headache. I will definitely bring some pain killers to the next one.

[PeteSB75]

Squats at home :ze

I am afraid to ask more...

It couldn't be worse, Brother. I am wondering if something in the adhesive they used all over my head and face for the electrodes gave me the headache. I will definitely bring some pain killers to the next one.

I'd check with your doctor about it, pain killers might skew the results, especially if they have any type of muscle relaxant in them. If it is the adhesive, they might be able to use a different one?

Second workout of the bench progression this morning. Wasn't sure I'd be able to get it done, energy levels still not at full after the fever I had this weekend, but I was able to get through it. Tomorrow will be fun though :ze
Today was 185x1, 205x1, 220x1, 185x10 on the bench, followed by curls and dips. I was shot by the end.

[GreekGodX]

Hit back yesterday. Used the rest/pause technique on DB Rows and was able to do 3x8 with 110 pounds. I definitely feel a big difference in my energy when I have more carbs, which really helps keep my strength up even with a deficiency in calories.

[icehog3]

I am afraid to ask more...



I'd check with your doctor about it, pain killers might skew the results, especially if they have any type of muscle relaxant in them. If it is the adhesive, they might be able to use a different one?



The second study should be with the mask on, the decide what pressure of CPAP is right for my prescription.

I agree that the pain killer might have some effect on my sleep, but there is no way I would lay there again for hours with a migraine that severe, Pete...it was horrible. Not sure if there would be anyway to tell for sure if it was the adhesive without it happening again. I will ask the techs about the pain killers and their effects, though. :tu

[mosesbotbol]

did 3 sets of 10 at 115lbs on the bench today... woot! I hit my goal. Next goal should be with 45s on each side... 3 sets of 5, maybe? :banger

The climb to two plates a side is pretty quick unless you are older. After two plates, most people plateau or slow their rate of increase significantly.

[PeteSB75]

Frank, this workout is kicking my azz :tu Almost lost it on repping out the squats. That was brutally hard.

3rd week of training for a 1RM on squat and dead.

Squat 300x1, 335x1, 355x1, 300x10
Dead 295x1, 320x1, 350x1

Stretched and went home to shower and go to work. Think I'll use the foam roller tonight when I get home from work.

[icehog3]

Keep kickin' arse, Pete! :tu

[BigFrank]

Stick with it Pete. Just remember when you perform those 1 reps you should be trying to push it as fast as humanly possible with every muscle, prep you for that big 1RM.

[PeteSB75]

Stick with it Pete. Just remember when you perform those 1 reps you should be trying to push it as fast as humanly possible with every muscle, prep you for that big 1RM.

I'm already looking forward to the off week after it's done... I'm normally fast on lighter squats, and as they get heavier, I still keep the actual exercise as quick as I can. If I don't, I will wind up getting stuck and having to dump it. I've not made the intensity a focus in that way in the past though. I will try it next week for both bench and squats.

[BigFrank]

I'm already looking forward to the off week after it's done... I'm normally fast on lighter squats, and as they get heavier, I still keep the actual exercise as quick as I can. If I don't, I will wind up getting stuck and having to dump it. I've not made the intensity a focus in that way in the past though. I will try it next week for both bench and squats.

You want to be fast with squatting, that way you get some natural rebound out of the bottom. Trust me, I used to squat very slow and it killed my squats.

[Ken]

did 3 sets of 10 at 115lbs on the bench today... woot! I hit my goal. Next goal should be with 45s on each side... 3 sets of 5, maybe? :banger
No need to try such a jump. Just move up to 120lb. You may not think you're feeling it, but your body does notice the difference in load. 3 5's just isn't much volume and going from 3 10's to 5x5 might be a quick switch. Small steps make the longest continued progress.

I'm normally fast on lighter squats, and as they get heavier, I still keep the actual exercise as quick as I can.
It'll all about intent isn't it? Even if I can't move a weight fast I'm trying.

[BigFrank]

Bench last night. Worked with some chains, keep the weight light at the bottom due to some shoulder issues ( nothing major, slept on it wrong )...

Hope all the lifting crew has a good thanksgiving. I'm going to stuff myself retarded. With sweatpants in hand!

[DBall]

Holy crap.

Went to the gym this morning with my friend who power lifts. He taught me legs.... did (for the first time ever) squats (3x8x135), deads (1x8x135 & 2x8x185) and good mornings (2x8x95) followed by a couple sets of leg extensions at 150. As for the squats, deads and gm's, I find it nearly impossible to keep my back straight (except gm's... I actually like those because I feel like I can engage my core more)... it's such an odd movement. He said I did pretty good for my first time, but I could feel myself being sloppy. I'll get better with practice.

Aside from that, I almost fell down walking home. :r

Happy turkey day, workout crew.