Buying a new laptop- Apple?

[357]

http://store.apple.com/us/configure/...co=MTM3NDcyODk
$1699 MacBook Pro:
15" screen
2.53GHz Intel Core 2 Duo
4.0 GB RAM
250 GB SATA Hard Drive 5400RPM
SuperDrive 8x (DVD±R DL/DVD±RW/CD-RW)
Video Card = Specs not listed

OR

http://www.salescircular.com/mi/computer/laptpp.shtml (@ Office Max)
$449 Toshiba Satellite L505-S5998
15.6-in. Widescreen
Intel Pentium T4300 processor (2 Cores @ 2.1 GHz)
4.0 GB RAM
320GB SATA Hard Drive 5400RPM
LabelFlash DVD +-RW drive
Intel® Graphics Media Accelerator 4500M
802.11B/G/N WLAN.
Webcam, Microphone.
Windows 7 Home Premium

+

$102.50 Mac OS X 10.5
http://cgi.ebay.com/Mac-Leopard-OS-X...item2ea9eaf2be

Total = $551.50 vs $1699

[KenS]

Originally Posted by 357

http://store.apple.com/us/configure/...co=MTM3NDcyODk
$1699 MacBook Pro:
15" screen
2.53GHz Intel Core 2 Duo
4.0 GB RAM
250 GB SATA Hard Drive 5400RPM
SuperDrive 8x (DVD±R DL/DVD±RW/CD-RW)
Video Card = Specs not listed

OR

http://www.salescircular.com/mi/computer/laptpp.shtml (@ Office Max)
$449 Toshiba Satellite L505-S5998
15.6-in. Widescreen
Intel Pentium T4300 processor (2 Cores @ 2.1 GHz)
4.0 GB RAM
320GB SATA Hard Drive 5400RPM
LabelFlash DVD +-RW drive
Intel® Graphics Media Accelerator 4500M
802.11B/G/N WLAN.
Webcam, Microphone.
Windows 7 Home Premium

+

$102.50 Mac OS X 10.5
http://cgi.ebay.com/Mac-Leopard-OS-X...item2ea9eaf2be

Total = $551.50 vs $1699

Although I'm sure it's fun to do stuff like this, it's also quite crazy, and is (usually) intentionally biased. Do you really think these are equivalent machines? Hint: they are not.

Anytime somebody asks a "Mac or PC" question, people trot out the same old lines. The absolute best advice is to speak with somebody who actually knows about, has current experience with, and uses both Mac and Windows PCs. Otherwise it's just people quoting the same crap that they've read elsewhere.

As for price differences, the key thing to know is that Apple simply does not have a "low end" laptop, and does not play in that segment of the market. So it's easy to find a cheapo Windows laptop and compare it, but you'd be much more informed by a true comparison of similarly priced laptops. Yes, Dell, Toshiba, HP, etc. do actually sell similarly priced machines, with the level of components and sophistication as the Mac laptops. But it's not as much fun to do a true Apples to apples comparison.

[Blueface]

Originally Posted by KenS

But it's not as much fun to do a true Apples to apples comparison.

Pun intended.

You make some great points.
I happen to use a PC laptop for work (HP), I have a desktop PC I still use, and I have my MacBook.
I am not a one side only person at all.
Given I use all three regularly, I am confident when I say I love my Mac any day over a PC.

Best of all.......................................

This message was posted without any fear of viruses and without utilizing any anti virus software.

[Blueface]

Found an article that contained this and I thought it truly sums it up for me.

most PC users use PCs because they have to, while Mac users use Mac because they want to.

That statement truly says it all.

Here is the rest of the article.
Interesting reading, even if one doesn't agree.

http://www.makeuseof.com/tag/101-und...tter-than-pcs/

Another one.
http://www.pcadvisor.co.uk/news/index.cfm?newsid=115151

There are similarly plenty of these by PC users but will leave it to the other side to find.

[Titan410]

[quote=Blueface;685717]Found an article that contained this and I thought it truly sums it up for me.

most PC users use PCs because they have to, while Mac users use Mac because they want to.


Agreed. Well put.

[goalie204]

Originally Posted by KenS

The absolute best advice is to speak with somebody who actually knows about, has current experience with, and uses both Mac and Windows PCs.

Agreed, and owning both, and using both on a daily basis, i could give my pc up, but i wouldn't give my mac up.

[357]

Originally Posted by KenS

Although I'm sure it's fun to do stuff like this, it's also quite crazy, and is (usually) intentionally biased. Do you really think these are equivalent machines? Hint: they are not.

Anytime somebody asks a "Mac or PC" question, people trot out the same old lines. The absolute best advice is to speak with somebody who actually knows about, has current experience with, and uses both Mac and Windows PCs. Otherwise it's just people quoting the same crap that they've read elsewhere.

As for price differences, the key thing to know is that Apple simply does not have a "low end" laptop, and does not play in that segment of the market. So it's easy to find a cheapo Windows laptop and compare it, but you'd be much more informed by a true comparison of similarly priced laptops. Yes, Dell, Toshiba, HP, etc. do actually sell similarly priced machines, with the level of components and sophistication as the Mac laptops. But it's not as much fun to do a true Apples to apples comparison.

I can take a hint...I get that I'm coming across a little heavy handed and biased. I'm just trying to get the point across that just because it has an Apple on it doesn't mean it was made better. If you like the OS fine use it. I'm just saying don't bother to pay 3 times the price for the hardware. The laptops I quoted aren't 100% identical, but they are 95% the same. The only real difference is the CPU and the outer plastic bezels. Use the money you save and buy 7 or 8 boxes of good cigars.

Some people believe that buying a certain name brand is worth paying a little extra. I would say that often I agree. This however is not one of those circumstances. I've taken apart Macs and PCs. I know they buy the same hardware from the same vendors and put them in their laptops. Years ago that wasn't the case. Apple used SCSI hard drives and RISC based CPUs. Both of which were superior to the IDE hard drives and x86 CPUs that PCs were using. However Apple dropped SCSI a long time ago and dropped RISC based CPUs about 3 years ago to adopt Intel x86 based CPUs. Since they have done that there is no real difference between Apple and PC hardware. Hence there is no real justification for them to charge 3 times the price.

I'm not trying to be rude by my repeated posts. I have worked in computers for about 15 years and I'm trying to help shed some light on the subject.

[goalie204]

Originally Posted by 357

The only real difference is the CPU and the outer plastic bezels.

the mac has an NVIDIA GeForce 9400M which even if integrated is still far superior to the intel graphics media accelerator.

The bottom line and the most important 2 points is that the OP said price was not an issue, and he isn't a fan of windows.

[Blueface]

Did I mention I love my MacBook?
Did I mention I am posting this from my iPhone?
Gotta run. Going to video some stuff with my IPod Nano with video camera.

[JE3146]

Originally Posted by 357

http://store.apple.com/us/configure/...co=MTM3NDcyODk
$1699 MacBook Pro:
15" screen
2.53GHz Intel Core 2 Duo
4.0 GB RAM
250 GB SATA Hard Drive 5400RPM
SuperDrive 8x (DVD±R DL/DVD±RW/CD-RW)
Video Card = Specs not listed

OR

http://www.salescircular.com/mi/computer/laptpp.shtml (@ Office Max)
$449 Toshiba Satellite L505-S5998
15.6-in. Widescreen
Intel Pentium T4300 processor (2 Cores @ 2.1 GHz)
4.0 GB RAM
320GB SATA Hard Drive 5400RPM
LabelFlash DVD +-RW drive
Intel® Graphics Media Accelerator 4500M
802.11B/G/N WLAN.
Webcam, Microphone.
Windows 7 Home Premium

+

$102.50 Mac OS X 10.5
http://cgi.ebay.com/Mac-Leopard-OS-X...item2ea9eaf2be

Total = $551.50 vs $1699

right....

FYI That's a GeForce 9400 in the Mac versus the Integrated Intel chipset.. and you're comparing an inferior CPU with 1/4 the L2 cache to that of the Mac's and also a reduced clock speed.

Give me a flipping break.

This is not even mentioning the unibody construction compared to that of the flimsy plastic frames of cheaper laptops. I don't get a satisfaction in hearing the lid of my laptop creak under stress as I open it.

You're running out of points. And your comparison to the business world means absolutely nothing to a person using a laptop for personal use. And even if it was transitioned over. Guess what. Install windows Vista or 7 on it and call it a day.

Boils down to personal preference. I will never own a Desktop Mac, but right now I see nothing better on the market than a Macbook. Thus I use a Windows/RHEL PC and a Macbook Pro with OS X/Win 7.

[357]

Originally Posted by JE3146

right....

FYI That's a GeForce 9400 in the Mac versus the Integrated Intel chipset.. and you're comparing an inferior CPU with 1/4 the L2 cache to that of the Mac's and also a reduced clock speed.

Give me a flipping break.

This is not even mentioning the unibody construction compared to that of the flimsy plastic frames of cheaper laptops. I don't get a satisfaction in hearing the lid of my laptop creak under stress as I open it.

You're running out of points. And your comparison to the business world means absolutely nothing to a person using a laptop for personal use. And even if it was transitioned over. Guess what. Install windows Vista or 7 on it and call it a day.

Boils down to personal preference. I will never own a Desktop Mac, but right now I see nothing better on the market than a Macbook. Thus I use a Windows/RHEL PC and a Macbook Pro with OS X/Win 7.

Actually you can get identical specs + Blu-Ray for $1099 made by Lenovo (Formely IBM's laptop/desktop division) and save $600.

IdeaPad Y550
Intel Core 2 Duo Processor P8700 (2.53GHz 1066MHz 3MBL2)
4 GB PC3-8500 DDR3 SDRAM 1066MHz SODIMM Memory (2 Dimms)
nVidia Geforce G 210M graphic card with 512MB memory (your post didn't list video memory)
Windows 7 Home Premium 64 Bit
Bluetooth
15.6" HD WLED with 1.3M integrated Camera
250GB Hard Disk Drive, 5400rpm
Blu-ray/DVD-ROM Combo
Integrated WiFi wireless LAN adapters: Intel WiFi Link 5100 1x2 (AGN) WLAN
Battery: 6 Cell Lithium-Ion 2.6Ah


OR

You can smoke the Apple's specs this HP for $1424 and still save almost $300

HP DV6T
Intel(R) Core(TM) i7-720QM Processor (1.6GHz, 6MB L2 Cache, 1333MHz FSB) QUAD CORE
6.0 GB DDR3 System Memory (2 Dimm)
500GB 7200RPM SATA Hard Drive with HP ProtectSmart Hard Drive Protection (Prevents fall damage)
1GB Nvidia GeForce GT 230M
15.6" diagonal High Definition LED HP Brightview Widescreen Display (1366x768)
Lightscribe Blu-Ray ROM with SuperMulti DVD+/-R/RW Double Layer
Webcam + Fingerprint Reader
Intel Wireless-N Mini-card with Bluetooth
6 Cell Lithium Ion Battery
Genuine Windows 7 Home Premium 64-bit


Heck for $300 to $600 you can enjoy a lot of fine cigars while marvelling at the MacBook owners shiny aluminum shell. With all that leftover money you might even be able to buy a laptop bag with some padding incase you drop your "inferior" plastic laptop. Although you may just opt to refrain from dropping it.

[Blueface]

Originally Posted by 357

Heck for $300 to $600 you can enjoy a lot of fine cigars while marvelling at the MacBook owners shiny aluminum shell. With all that leftover money you might even be able to buy a laptop bag with some padding incase you drop your "inferior" plastic laptop. Although you may just opt to refrain from dropping it.

Sure, but in the end, you can still only dream of really owning a Mac.
Sort of like when I use to use condoms. Sure the lambskin costs more. Sure the latex will get job done with plenty of money left over for cigars. However, you just can't beat the feeling of that lambskin. (actually, you can. Snip and it is taken care of).

[KenS]

Originally Posted by Blueface

Sure, but in the end, you can still only dream of really owning a Mac.
Sort of like when I use to use condoms. Sure the lambskin costs more. Sure the latex will get job done with plenty of money left over for cigars. However, you just can't beat the feeling of that lambskin. (actually, you can. Snip and it is taken care of).

Wow, this is a direction I never saw this thread taking. Yikes!!

[Blueface]

Originally Posted by KenS

Wow, this is a direction I never saw this thread taking. Yikes!!

[Blueface]

I just realized, Apple will survive just with me alone.

MacBook
iPod Nano - no video
iPod Nano - video
iPod touch (first generation)
iPhone

Dreaming of moving up to a MacBook Pro 17", once I am done paying my current one on "same as cash" and can find another similar "same as cash" offer.
Waiting on the 4G iPhone to upgrade.
I'd buy a car if they sold one.
Just bought a lawnmower or otherwise would be interested in one from them also.

Forgot to mention, the iPod touch is my 2.5 year old grandson's. I figured I would taint his opinion early on to our side. He uses it all the time. Knows his way around all his applications. Awesome tool with flash card games for him to learn. Apple, so easy even a 2.5 year old can use it. I want to hear Bill Gates say that about Microsoft.

[KenS]

Originally Posted by 357

Actually you can get identical specs + Blu-Ray for $1099 made by Lenovo (Formely IBM's laptop/desktop division) and save $600.

IdeaPad Y550
Intel Core 2 Duo Processor P8700 (2.53GHz 1066MHz 3MBL2)
4 GB PC3-8500 DDR3 SDRAM 1066MHz SODIMM Memory (2 Dimms)
nVidia Geforce G 210M graphic card with 512MB memory (your post didn't list video memory)
Windows 7 Home Premium 64 Bit
Bluetooth
15.6" HD WLED with 1.3M integrated Camera
250GB Hard Disk Drive, 5400rpm
Blu-ray/DVD-ROM Combo
Integrated WiFi wireless LAN adapters: Intel WiFi Link 5100 1x2 (AGN) WLAN
Battery: 6 Cell Lithium-Ion 2.6Ah


OR

You can smoke the Apple's specs this HP for $1424 and still save almost $300

HP DV6T
Intel(R) Core(TM) i7-720QM Processor (1.6GHz, 6MB L2 Cache, 1333MHz FSB) QUAD CORE
6.0 GB DDR3 System Memory (2 Dimm)
500GB 7200RPM SATA Hard Drive with HP ProtectSmart Hard Drive Protection (Prevents fall damage)
1GB Nvidia GeForce GT 230M
15.6" diagonal High Definition LED HP Brightview Widescreen Display (1366x768)
Lightscribe Blu-Ray ROM with SuperMulti DVD+/-R/RW Double Layer
Webcam + Fingerprint Reader
Intel Wireless-N Mini-card with Bluetooth
6 Cell Lithium Ion Battery
Genuine Windows 7 Home Premium 64-bit


Heck for $300 to $600 you can enjoy a lot of fine cigars while marvelling at the MacBook owners shiny aluminum shell. With all that leftover money you might even be able to buy a laptop bag with some padding incase you drop your "inferior" plastic laptop. Although you may just opt to refrain from dropping it.

Don't forget your antivirus subscription and internet "security" At least now you are talking about things that are comparable. I was struggling with comparing a sub-$500 machine to a MacBook Pro.

I wouldn't argue that there is some price premium paid for a difference in "it just works" kind of quality, and the ease of use and tight integration of things like iTunes, iPhoto, iDVD, iMovie, etc.

Certainly a judgement call on the value of that, but again, you are now making a more reasonable comparison for somebody who is genuinely looking for advice. I use both types of machines on a daily basis (they sit side-by-side on my desk), and I would never, ever recommend Windoze over Mac OS.