LOST Notes

[TheBeard]

Bao, I shouldn't have read your "hints and such" post right there. Now I want to flail about and scream because I have to wait so long for my Lost! :r

[kaisersozei]

My wife's as big a fan as I am--and she reminded me that February 2 is our anniversary. Guess we'll be eating in & watching Lost this year! :banger

[Mugen910]

Did I post this yet? Hmmm

Lots of hints and such regarding season 6. These are not necessarily spoilers, but hints and things to look forward to. However, if you don't want to know stop reading now.

Comic Con is a conference that showcases sci fi, comics, fantasy-genre games, tv, movies, and books. The LOST producers were there to answer questions and show some videos.

Points of interest:

1. Season six of will be reminiscent of season one in that there will be a lot of running through the jungle and emotional development for the characters.
2. Faraday WILL appear in season 6.
3. They also mention that Season 6 won't have time travel or flash forwards, but "something different."
4. The marketing graphic for season 6 included all our favorite characters (even some dead ones!) but the important thing is that the last character added to the animation was Locke, and he was very obviously facing backwards, while all the other characters were facing forward. Creepy! (see attached poster)
5. They confirm that Richard Alpert will be finally getting his flashback in the final season. And Richard himself, actor Nestor Carbonell, is there on video, looking at himself in the mirror backstage. "Richard Alpert isn't ageless. YOU are," he says to himself. He then throws a fit over being handed the wrong eyeliner. So funny!
6. Juliet will appear, in some fashion, in season 6 and her survival is contingent upon Jack's plan working (bomb exploding).
7. The mystery of the food pallet drops will be uncovered in season 6.
8. The show's producers say that Jacob always looks like Jacob. By this, they mean that we won't learn later that people that have come in and out of the lives of our characters was in fact Jacob in disguise.
9. According to Josh Holloway in the press room, Sawyer will be destroyed by the tragedy of Juliet, pushing him back towards his original, more "salty" character. He'll still carry around season five's character growth, but he'll be rejecting it.
10. We learn that Libby's last name was Smith (Elizabeth Smith).
11. Three videos are shown:
1. An Oceanic Airlines video which says that the airline has had a perfect safety record since 1979.
2. A Mr. Cluck's Chicken commercial where Hurley is announced as the owner and CEO and says that ever since he won the lottery he's had nothing but good luck.
3. An "America's Most Wanted" clip that shows Kate as a fugitive who meant to kill her stepfather but accidentally killed the wrong man.
4. All three hinted that Season 6 will see some form of alternate time line. It doesn't literally mean that these things happen in the future, but the show now wants us to start thinking about the fact that Jack, with a major assist from Juliet, actually pulled off his plan.
12. Jorge Garcia (Hurley) is in the audience and notes that the videos just shown heavily hint that the previous five seasons will be wiped away if Jack was successful. He calls such a move a "cheat." The producers ask that he trust them, to which Jorge delivers the line: "Last time I trusted you guys, you said Nikki and Paulo were going to be awesome."
13. Lastly, Dominic Monaghan (Charlie Pace) crashes the stage. Onlookers noted the words, "Am I alive?" written on his hand as he waves to the audience.


https://mail.google.com/mail/?ui=2&ik=95e7713c8c&view=att&th=122e5657d1f1d9ae&attid=0.1&disp=inline&zw

[Mugen910]

http://tvbythenumbers.com/2010/01/19/video-the-onion-takes-on-annoying-lost-fans/39394

:D

[TheBeard]

With the much-anticipated day rapidly approaching, I just thought I'd drop this off for any interested parties: http://www.myspace.com/theoceanicsixmusic

The Oceanic Six is a Lost fandom band.

[Mugen910]

tomorrow is the big night! :wo

[TheBeard]

tomorrow is the big night! :wo

Wednesday is the big day for me. It's what I get for getting all my TV on the internets. :)

[Mugen910]

UPDATE

The ultimate list of unanswered questions.

THE ISLAND

 Was Locke really healed by the island? Or was he healed by Jacob or the Man in
Black?

 Jack, Kate, Sawyer, Hurley, and Michael once saw an enormous green-colored bird
swoop out of a tree towards them, and Hurley thought that the bird said his name.
What kind of bird was this, and did it really say Hurley's name?

 Were there any permanent consequences to the island when the Swan's failsafe was
activated and the sky turned purple? Was the electromagnetic pocket of energy
beneath the island destroyed by the failsafe, or made dormant?

 What does the frozen wheel do, mechanically-speaking, to make the island move?
Does it access the electromagnetic energy pocket somehow? What's behind the wheel
that generated the bright yellow light? Why is it so cold in the underground chamber
where the island-moving wheel is housed? The wheel looks like a man-made device,
so who made it and put it there?

 Since turning the wheel beneath the Orchid station sends one to the Tunisian desert,
it stands to reason that the polar bear Charlotte found in Tunisia wearing a Dharma
Initiative collar must also have turned the wheel at some point, and that's how it
wound up there. What and when were the circumstances surrounding the polar bear
that turned the wheel and moved the island? Who was responsible for this, and why?

 Why were the Oceanic survivors, the Freighter Folk, and Juliet affected by the island's
time jumps, yet the Others were not?

 Why was Sun left behind in the present on Ajira 316, when all of the other Oceanic 6
were transported through time to the past?

 Why would the island let Ben come back after he left, but not Widmore?

 Who built the Tunnels under the island? Do the Tunnels run all over (or rather, under)
the island? What else is down there?

[Mugen910]

JACOB & THE MAN IN BLACK

 Who is Jacob, and how did he come to be on the island?

 Who is the Man in Black, aka Jacob's Nemesis?

 How did Jacob and the Man in Black come to be on the island?

 What's the nature of Jacob and the Man in Black's yin/yang-type relationship? And why can't they kill each other?

 Can Jacob see the future? (He went to Ilana's bedside and asked her to help him, and he also ordered the Hydra Island runway built. The logical conclusion is that the runway was needed because he knew Ilana would be coming to the island via Ajira 316.)

 Jacob is apparently responsible for bringing everyone to the island that gets to it. How does Jacob bring people to the island?

 Why did Jacob touch so many of the castaways in the past? Why did he choose them, and what did his touch cause to happen? Is he the reason they escaped the crash of Oceanic 815 without harm?

 Did Jacob touch anyone else in the same way?

 Why did Jacob give Hurley a guitar case to bring back to the island? What's inside it?

 Why does the Man in Black want to kill Jacob?

 If Jacob hasn't been living in the cabin, who has? The Man in Black? Is this who Ben and Locke encountered the day they visited the cabin?

 How did the Man in Black take on Locke's form? Can he assume the form of anyone he wants, or does it have to be a dead person?

 What all did the Man in Black "go through" to get to Jacob?

 Who was Jacob referring to when he warned the Man in Black that "they're coming"?

 Who or what is Christian Shephard? Does he really speak for Jacob, or is he an instrument of the Man in Black?

[Mugen910]

THE SMOKE MONSTER
 What is the smoke monster?

 Is the monster technological or supernatural?

 Why does the monster kill certain people -- like Mr. Eko, Captain Norris of Oceanic 815, and Nadine of the French science expedition -- while leaving others it encounters alive? What's different about those it kills?

 The monster sometimes calls up images of peoples' pasts before it passes judgment on them. (We've seen it do this with Eko, Juliet, and Ben.) How is the monster able to do this?

 What exactly happened to Montand and the other Frenchmen beneath the Temple? Did the monster change them, as Danielle believed? Did it kill them and take their place?

 How did draining the water out of that tiny hole below Ben's house summon the smoke monster? Who built the monster-summoning water hole there to begin with?

 Since we've seen other dead people (like Locke) on the island before, such as Alex Rousseau and Yemi, who very likely were the smoke monster taken human form, does this mean that the Man in Black is the smoke monster? Could they be one and the same?

THEEGYPTIANSTATUE
Why are there Egyptian-style hieroglyphs all over the island? Who put them there?

 Why was an enormous statue of an Egyptian fertility goddess (Tawaret) erected on the island? And why did Jacob choose to live beneath it? Did Jacob build it, or was someone else responsible? When was it built, and when & how was it destroyed?

 Is there a link between the Exit's location in Tunisia and the island's Egyptian influences?

THE"ADAM&EVE" SKELETONS


Who are the Adam & Eve skeletons? Are they characters we know?

 How did they die? Was it, as the castaways guessed, forty to fifty years ago?

 Why was one of them carrying two stones, one white and one black? THE NUMBERS (4 8 15 16 23 42)

 Are the Numbers really cursed? Do they have power?

 Who sent the transmission from the island heard by Leonard Sims and Sam Toomey at the Navy listening post in the Pacific? And why? (This was the same transmission heard by Danielle's science team, which lured them toward the island.)

THE WHISPERS
 What are the Whispers?

 The Whispers always seem to precede an appearance by the Others or the smoke monster. What's the connection?

[Mugen910]

SORRY FOR MAKING YOU READ ALL THIS!


THE BLACK ROCK
 How did the Black Rock get beached so far inland on the island?

 A journal belonging to the Black Rock's first mate found its way to Madagascar after the ship wrecked on the island. How did it get there?

 Tovard Hanso found the Black Rock journal in Madagascar and kept its contents secret for over a century. Is this journal how Alvar Hanso found out about the island, and decided to send the Dharma Initiative there?

 Why did the Hanso family suddenly decide to sell the Black Rock journal (which Charles Widmore purchased at auction) in 1996, after years of keeping it a family secret?

 Richard Alpert constructed a model of a ship in a bottle that looked like the Black Rock. Does he have a connection to the Black Rock? Was he one of its crewmembers?

THE INCIDENT
 Does "the Incident" refer to the electromagnetic pocket being breeched, or the hydrogen bomb being detonated? Or both?

 What happened when Juliet detonated the hydrogen bomb? Did it reset time? Did it destroy the island?

 How did Richard watch Jack, Kate, Hurley, Jin, Sawyer, Juliet, and Miles die? Did he witness the hydrogen bomb explosion?

THETEMPLE

 What is the purpose of the Temple? What happens there? Is it for worshiping something or someone?

 Who built the Temple, and when?

 Why is the Temple a secret to be kept from outsiders?

 What happened to young Ben when Richard carried him inside the Temple? Why did it cause Ben's memory to be erased and his innocence to be lost?

THE PURGE

 Why did the Others wipe out the Dharma Initiative? Relations between the two groups were always tense, but what pushed the Others to take an action as extreme as massacre?

THE DHARMA INITIATIVE

 Does the Dharma Initiative still exist today, off the island?

 Who is the "very clever fellow" working for the Dharma Initiative who figured out how to find the island and built the Lamp Post station?

 Is it mere coincidence that the Dharma Initiative built the Barracks over the place where the Others buried the hydrogen bomb?

THE DHARMA FOOD DROPS

 Who made the Dharma food drop?

 How often do the food drops take place?

 The Swan station went into lockdown mode coinciding with the timing of the food drop. Why would the Swan need to be locked down when a food drop was being conducted?

 Locke suggested that the Swan was locked down so that the Dharma workers couldn't see who was dropping the food palette. Is this the reason for the lockdown? If so, why would the source of the food drop want to remain anonymous?

 Was Eko right about the salted circle on the ground above the Pearl station being made a visible target for planes to see? Could the circle be the intended target of the Dharma food drops?

[Mugen910]

ISLAND PREGNANCY
 What's causing pregnant women to die on the island?

 Amy Goodspeed was able to carry her baby to full term and deliver successfully, so the problem that present-day Others have with bearing children is something that started after 1977. When did this pregnancy problem start?

[THE VOLCANO


 Where is the island's volcano?

 When in the island's past did it erupt?

 Is the volcano now dormant?

CLAIRE

 According to psychic Richard Malkin, "danger surrounds" Aaron, and he requires her protection and influence as he grows. Why? What did Malkin see in Claire's reading? What was so dire about Aaron's future that Malkin would go to extreme lengths to arrange for Claire to be on Oceanic 815, to ensure that she alone would raise her son?

 Why was Miles so interested in Claire? Did something about her set off his abilities as a medium? Is Claire dead, having not survived the explosion of her house at the Barracks?

 What's become of Claire? Why did she go with Christian to Jacob's cabin, and leave her baby behind?

 Why didn't Christian want Locke to tell anybody he saw Claire at the cabin? Why does Claire's status need to be kept a secret?

 Why did Claire tell Kate not to bring Aaron back to the island?

RICHARDALPERT
 How and when did Richard originally come to the island?

 What did Jacob do to Richard to cause him to stop aging?

 How old is Richard?

LIBBY
 Why was Libby a patient at Santa Rosa Mental Hospital?

 Why did Libby hide the fact that she was at Santa Rosa from Hurley -- and that she remembered him from there? Did she have ulterior motives for her budding relationship with him?

 Was Desmond's chance encounter with Libby really so random? She was awfully trusting and willing to believe in a man she didn't know and give him her husband's boat. Was there more to this meeting than it seems?

ILANA

 Who is Ilana? What is her history with Jacob?

 What happened to Ilana in the past, that gave her a severe head wound? How did she fully recover? Jacob?

 What did Jacob need Ilana's help with?

PIERRE CHANG

 Why does Dr. Chang go by a different name in every Dharma Orientation video?

 Chang selected the site of the Orchid station, based on his knowledge of the pocket of
"unlimited power" beneath the site. How did he know ahead of time where to build
the Orchid?

 Did Chang recognize the wooden wheel buried beneath the Orchid station when he saw it on the sonar? Does he know what it is, and who put it there?

 Is Pierre Chang really dead in the present? Did he die on the island? Did he die in the Purge?

ELOISE HAWKING

 How is Eloise able to know the future?

 Why was Eloise in a photo on Brother Campbell's desk? How do they know each other?

 What did Eloise mean when she said the island "isn't finished yet" with Desmond?

 Eloise was once the leader of the Others, so why did she leave the island?

 Why does Eloise now live at the church where the Lamp Post station is housed?

 Why would Eloise send her son to the island, knowing that he would die by her own hand? What could be so vitally important to the fate of the island that Eloise would sacrifice her own son to see it done?

 Eloise said to Penny, "For the first time in a long time, I don't know what's going to happen next." If she's able to see the future, why has she suddenly lost that ability?

CHARLES WIDMORE
 If Matthew Abaddon is the reason Locke went to Australia for his walkabout, and Abaddon works for Widmore... does this mean that Widmore knew Oceanic 815 was going to crash on the island, and he arranged for Locke to be on it?

 The Oceanic Airlines employees take orders from Widmore. Does he own Oceanic?

 Charles Widmore knew of Paik Industries and even mentioned that he played golf regularly with Sun's father. Are these two powerful men merely business associates, or do they share a deeper connection (such as an interest in the island, perhaps)?

SAYID'S VENDETTA

 Who is responsible for Nadia's death? Widmore? Ben? Was it just a random crime?

 Who was the man stationed outside of Santa Rosa Mental Institute, watching Hurley? Who did he work for?

 Who were the men waiting at Sayid's hotel room, intent on killing him and Hurley? Who did they work for?

MISCELLANEOUS
 How is Walt "different "? What's the extent of his abilities?

 What became of Ben's childhood friend Annie? Was she killed during the Purge, or had she left the island by then?

 Harper insinuated that Juliet was favored by Ben because she "looked just like her." Which "her" was Harper referring to? Ben's mother? His childhood friend Annie?

 If Frank Lapidus was originally supposed to be the pilot of Oceanic 815, why was he replaced by Seth Norris?

[kugie]

That was Awesome :tu:banger

[Mr.Erskine]

I'll be honest, I wasn't real thrilled with last seasons writing, and with the exception of a couple instances last night, the jury is still out on this season

[BigCat]

I thought it was pretty good. I didn't realize it was a two hour episode until the first hour was over. I was going to be very disappointed if the first hour had stood alone, but I liked where the second hour went.

So do you think Jacob is in Sayid now?

[mosesbotbol]

I delayed my trip to Switzerland to see last night's episode on time. It was worth it too. So many questions. Just love Lost. Everyone is so striking looking.

[Mugen910]

So do you think Jacob is in Sayid now?
Great question...Was it me or did Sayid have an accent when he spoke to Jack?

I delayed my trip to Switzerland to see last night's episode on time. It was worth it too. So many questions. Just love Lost. Everyone is so striking looking.

Baller!

I actually am sad to see Juliet gone. :(

[Skywalker]

I have last nights episode recorded at home... so nobody give away big plot points yet!!!

[Mugen910]

Well it looks like we can check off a few questions on that list I posted. :wo

[rack04]

Well it looks like we can check off a few questions on that list I posted. :wo

Are you going to update the list with all the new questions after last nights episode? Good lord, that was painful.

[Mugen910]

Are you going to update the list with all the new questions after last nights episode? Good lord, that was painful.

No....gawd it was difficult enough to copy and paste it all over..

[TheBeard]

I actually am sad to see Juliet gone. :(

I'm not. I liked the Juliette character at first, but she just became so stagnant and 2-dimensional. I'm glad to see that the actress can express more than two emotions now that she's in V.

[TheBeard]

So do you think Jacob is in Sayid now?

I do not think so. I think that Sayid is being set up to become a savior, and possibly to be some sort of envoy or vessel for Jacob's rebirth. At the moment, he's still Sayid.

[Goldie]

I hate this show, but I love it at the same time. Drives me crazy every time I watch it.

I just hope that all the questions are finally answered about the island, and pretty much the entire show in general. None of this, Sopranos ending sh*t.

[Mr.Erskine]

I hate this show, but I love it at the same time. Drives me crazy every time I watch it.

I just hope that all the questions are finally answered about the island, and pretty much the entire show in general. None of this, Sopranos ending sh*t.

+1

[Mugen910]

Final season Episode 1

As always MY FRIEND collects info from interviews, blogs, message boards and conversations with other LOSTiacs.

1. I think I need to manage my expectations for this season. I thought that we would get all unanswered questions answered last night and then sail through the rest of the season on character development. Leave it to LOST to create a thousand more questions!

2. Items to ponder from the producers:

"...These little clues [might help you] extrapolate when the Island may have sunk. Start to think about it. A couple of episodes down the road, some of the characters might even discuss it. We will say this: season 6 is not about time travel. It's about the implications, the aftermath, and the causality of trying to change the past. But the idea of continuing to do paradoxical storytelling is not what we're interested in this year."

Flash-sideways... "When our characters posited the "What if?" scenario, they neglected to think about what the other effects of potentially changing time might be and we're embracing those things." Lindelof (producer) then explains the show has replaced the trademark "whoosh!" sound effect marking the segue between Island present story and flashbacks or flash-forwards, thus calling conspicuous attention to the relationship between the Island world and the Sideways world.
3. The Oceanic 815 flight:

* Desmond is on the plane! The book he was reading is Haroun and the Sea of Stories by Salman Rushdie. It's a story, set in a city so old and ruinous that it has forgotten its name, about a father who loses his ability to tell stories after his son questions what the point of fictional stories is. Then, the son embarks on a fantastic adventure concerning someone who wants to destroy the ocean using machines powered by electromagnetic induction. The boy returns home to tell his father of his amazing adventure and restores his father's faith in stories.

Desmond, season 2, "SEE YOU IN ANOTHER LIFE BROTHER"... yes you will! :)

* Jack ... on the original flight 815 Cindy had given him 2 bottles of liquor. Maybe she knows Jack won't be needing the other one to disinfect his side wound this time around...
* This time Rose was calm and Jack was nervous... opposite of last time.
* Hurley... no longer cursed.
* Sawyer... still a con man? Too soon to tell.
* Charlie... Examine Charlie's many deaths a little more closely, and they all have one thing in common: not breathing. Desmond saw him drown (once in a dream, once in reality), Ethan hangs him to asphyxiation, and we see a vision in which he gets shot in the throat with an arrow. Now, in this episode, Charlie's choking on a big bag of heroin. Whatever happened to kill Charlie must apparently happen again and again, in the same basic way, no matter where, when or what universe he happens to be in.
* Kate... Kate stole Jack's pen! Jack didn't have a pen in the "Pilot, Part 1" episode. Remember? Boone was trying to do CPR on Rose, Jack comes over to help her and sends Boone off to get a pen. He comes back with a bunch of different pens.
* Some original 815ers were not on the plane this time (Shannon, Michael, Walt). Frogurt (still an a-hole), Artz...
* From the producers... The temptation will be to dismiss the sideways story as ''What if...?'', but we should trust that we're being shown this story for a reason, and so we should take the leap of investing in its reality.
* Jack's nicked neck was similar to the moment when Jack excused himself to the jungle in the pilot episode to patch up the ugly gash on his side. One wonders if the entire season 6 sideways story line will model the general thematic thrust of the castaway story, but with different incidents and events - a gritty, more down-to-earth version of the mythic, larger-than-life Island epic, like how Dorothy's adventure in Oz was a fantastical extrapolation of her life in Kansas.

4. The Island:

* Everyone on the island is now in 2007. The plane we saw in tonight's episode is travelling in 2004. We know that it is 2007 for everyone on the island because when the guy at the temple shoots the flare Richard sees it (and he is still in the same place we saw him at the end of Season 5....on the beach with everyone else...again...in 2007).
* Juliet "it worked"... what does she know at death that we do not? She said "let's get coffee"... was her conscious travelling to the alternate reality where she and Sawyer meet in the outside world? Wherever Juliet now "is", she's totally aware of the reset.
* The group at the hatch said that they were back at the hatch after Desmond blew it up. If you recall back from season 2, when they destroyed the Swan hatch equipment, time ran out, and everything metallic in the hatch was pulled to that spot, then Desmond inserted the fail safe key, and blew it up to stop it. It's as though Jughead never exploded when Juliette hit it with a rock....
* Theory: Are we going to see the 2004 real world people back on a plane again sometime soon? Jack will need to go back to Australia to find his father's coffin, Locke will have to go back and find his knives, Kate may have to go back for some reason, Claire gave up her baby in LA and will be on her way back to Australia, Charlie will be deported back to Australia, Hurley will have to go check on his Chicken Shack business etc...etc...etc... Maybe that is how they will catch up to where they are now on the island??? I don't know.

[Mugen910]

5. The Temple:

* Hurley picked up a book in the Temple tunnel by Søren Kierkegaard titled Fear and Trembling. This book challenges true believers to embrace the absurdity of faith. The book takes its title from a Bible quote, "Try to work out your own salvation with fear and trembling." Kierkegaard wrote the book under a pseudonym: Johannes de silentio - John The Silent. :(
* The guitar case... it's an ankh. We've seen it before... the statue holds one and Horace's wife had one which belonged to Paul. The symbol means eternal life. Jacob's lists have always been critical to LOST's story. Some theorize that the people listed by Jacob are the ones integral to the end game - without every single one of them, Jacob's final ending cannot be realized.
* We were told that the Dharma Initiative built the sonic fence to keep Smokey out, so we assumed he was on the side of the Hostiles/ Others. That does not seem to be the case, now. Why did Smokey become their enemy? What happened?
* Sayid coming back to life... we've always been told on this show that DEAD IS DEAD. So... ???

6. The Statue:

* Bram was impaled. The guy with the Dracula writer's name got a vampire death.
* Maybe now that Jacob is dead Richard will start aging? Flocke (fake Locke) says to Richard "Nice to you see you out of chains"... was Richard a slave on the Black Rock or was Flocke referring to Jacob's authority over Richard? Probably both.
* Ashes... from the episode "The Man Behind the Curtain" were the ashes around Jacob's cabin to protect Jacob who was allegedly inside or keep Flocke/ Smokey inside as a prisoner? Perhaps when the man inside the cabin said "Help Me" to Real Locke, he was manipulating Locke to help him escape. The first of the man times he uses Locke.

7. Remember when:

* When dripping wet, backwards talking Walt appeared in the jungle... does that now seem to suggest that he was coming from an alternative time line... The Sunken Island time line... to give the warning?
* So, season 2, after Walt is taken and Sawyer is shot, Sawyer's in the hatch with a fever. He says in his sleep "I loved her." Later, he grabs Kate and says "Why'd you kill me?" Perhaps he is speaking from a different time line that coincided with that one? Maybe when he said "I loved her" he was speaking of Juliet, and when he asked "why'd you kill me?" he was thinking of how Kate kills him... in the alternate reality we are now seeing in 2004???
* Richard told Sun that he saw the 1977 Losties all die? Will that ever be further explained or did he just see one of the realities in this whole mess?


8. A theory:

* From Doc Jensen, I believe. I thought this was interesting "The Island: the original and purest expression of the God idea, of God power. These ruins? The remains of those zealots who've attempted to claim, name, and tame this place over the centuries - those people the Man In Black spoke of last year: ''They come. They fight. They destroy. They corrupt. It always ends the same.''"

[TheBeard]

None of this, Sopranos ending sh*t.

Back in the beginning of the show (somewhere between the beginning of Season 1 and the end of Season 2, I forget when exactly), the producers promised not to cop out or do cheesy $h*t like that. So far (although they have warped reality in interesting ways), they have kept to their word :pi

[white_s2k]

The writers have a ton of questions to answer, hopefully they start doing that soon and don't try to cram it into the last couple of episodes.

So I wonder what the letter in the guitar case really said. Did it say to kill Sayid so Jacob could take over his body to get revenge? If so, how did Jacob know he would die when he gave the guitar case to Hurley?

I love this show!! :D

[TheBeard]

So I wonder what the letter in the guitar case really said. Did it say to kill Sayid so Jacob could take over his body to get revenge?

No way. The Others in the temple were legitimately surprised when Hurley told them that Jacob was dead. If the letter said anything about Jacob's death or return, they would have had that reaction (the scramble to get the defenses up) immediately.

It stands to reason that they did not intend to kill Sayid. They warned Jack that there would be risks in doing this, since the spring water was no longer clear (and, apparently, did not immediately heal the cut on the Japanese man's hand). They did what they were supposed to do and it did not work immediately. I'd like to believe that the spring water had enough power to heal Sayid but not enough to do it quickly; and so, the water kept Sayid's brain alive while it healed the rest of his body. His outward signs of life were gone, but he wasn't quite dead yet. Then again, what was the Japanese man sensing when he put his hand over Sayid's face and passed it down over his chest? And, did Miles sense that Sayid was or was not dead?

I'm looking forward to an awesome season :D

[weak_link]

^ is Sayid going to go 'Pet Cemetary' on 'em?

I love this show, totally addicted and have no idea how I missed this thread last year!

[dannysguitar]

No way. The Others in the temple were legitimately surprised when Hurley told them that Jacob was dead. If the letter said anything about Jacob's death or return, they would have had that reaction (the scramble to get the defenses up) immediately.

It stands to reason that they did not intend to kill Sayid. They warned Jack that there would be risks in doing this, since the spring water was no longer clear (and, apparently, did not immediately heal the cut on the Japanese man's hand). They did what they were supposed to do and it did not work immediately. I'd like to believe that the spring water had enough power to heal Sayid but not enough to do it quickly; and so, the water kept Sayid's brain alive while it healed the rest of his body. His outward signs of life were gone, but he wasn't quite dead yet. Then again, what was the Japanese man sensing when he put his hand over Sayid's face and passed it down over his chest? And, did Miles sense that Sayid was or was not dead?

I'm looking forward to an awesome season :D

Good points. I re-watched the episode and realized that Miles did sense something. I think he knew that Sayid was still alive...

[Mugen910]

I have a feeling the letter in the guitar box was a list of people, like a manifest, that would help solidify Jacob's intent and Jack, Sayid, Kate, Hugo's purpose there to the Other Others :D

[Waynegro1]

Thanks again, Bao!! This is the only show that has me thinking hours later. Looking forward to a great final season.

[ucla695]

I hate this show, but I love it at the same time. Drives me crazy every time I watch it.

I just hope that all the questions are finally answered about the island, and pretty much the entire show in general. None of this, Sopranos ending sh*t.

Read this (http://online.wsj.com/article/SB10001424052748704320104575015120676261064.html?m od=WSJ-hp-editorsPicks). :)

[TheBeard]

I woke up this morning with a thought:

Before Richard took young Ben Linus to the Temple to heal him, he warned that healing him would remove his memory (at least some of it) and he would be forever "one of them." I've been curious as to what this "one of them" is all about, but I just happened to think: How much has Sayid's memory been affected? I look forward to seeing in tonight's episode (which I will get to watch tomorrow) what the heck is going on with Sayid.

Perhaps this is what Ben has meant all along when he said that he was "born on the island."

[TheBeard]

I also had a thought strike me last night:

From what we've been shown of the Temple previously (that is to say, the area underneath the outer walls that surround the Temple), we've been lead to believe that the Temple is either where the smoke monster lives or is under the protection of the smoke monster, or something along those lines. Yet when the Others inside the Temple found out about Jacob's death, they immediately went into "lockdown mode" and made a point to draw a barrier of ash about their Temple's inner walls.

We saw the same ring of ash encircling Jacob's cabin, and every time we saw this ash we were also shown a gap in the ash. Ilana and her crew pointed out that this meant that Jacob had not been in that cabin for some time (which, now makes me wonder if it's been the smoke monster who's been leading everyone on the island along, especially Locke, with visions of dead people). The reason for this ash was shown to us when the smoke monster attacked Brahm and the others: Apparently, Smokey can't cross that barrier.

Now, my question: If Smokey had been so near the Temple for so long, why wasn't there an ashen barrier in place to begin with? What was keeping him out of the Temple? What power does (did) Jacob have to keep Smokey at bay? If Jacob's cabin needed to be protected by ash, was his room "in the shadow of the statue" any different?

[MikeyC]

Now, my question: If Smokey had been so near the Temple for so long, why wasn't there an ashen barrier in place to begin with? What was keeping him out of the Temple? What power does (did) Jacob have to keep Smokey at bay? If Jacob's cabin needed to be protected by ash, was his room "in the shadow of the statue" any different?

I think it's quite clear after last week's episode that John Locke (or at least current living Locke) is also the smoke monster. Smokey/Locke is also the same guy that's sitting on the beach with Jacob in last season's finale watching Black Rock find the island.

Apparently, there are "rules" involved in the interaction between Jacob and Smokey/Locke/man in black. At least that's what they say in one recent episode. One of these rules is that Smokey/Locke/MIB cannot kill Jacob which is why he had to get Ben to kill him. So, I guess Jacob never really needed any protection from Smokey.

[Skywalker]

I'm all caught up now!!!:tu

[JE3146]

Sucks with this whole living apart from my wife thing while she's working up North. She leaves on Tuesday nights so I have to wait until the weekend to watch Lost with her :r

[woops]

We saw the same ring of ash encircling Jacob's cabin, and every time we saw this ash we were also shown a gap in the ash. Ilana and her crew pointed out that this meant that Jacob had not been in that cabin for some time (which, now makes me wonder if it's been the smoke monster who's been leading everyone on the island along, especially Locke, with visions of dead people). The reason for this ash was shown to us when the smoke monster attacked Brahm and the others: Apparently, Smokey can't cross that barrier.
Now, my question: If Smokey had been so near the Temple for so long, why wasn't there an ashen barrier in place to begin with? What was keeping him out of the Temple? What power does (did) Jacob have to keep Smokey at bay? If Jacob's cabin needed to be protected by ash, was his room "in the shadow of the statue" any different?

I've thought for some time that "Smokey" may have been trapped inside of Jacob's cabin, BY THE ASH. Perhaps he was confined to the cabin. ???

[TheBeard]

I think it's quite clear after last week's episode that John Locke (or at least current living Locke) is also the smoke monster. Smokey/Locke is also the same guy that's sitting on the beach with Jacob in last season's finale watching Black Rock find the island.

That was never in question. :) But my references and questions stem from the time in the show when we only knew him as the smoke monster.


Apparently, there are "rules" involved in the interaction between Jacob and Smokey/Locke/man in black. At least that's what they say in one recent episode. One of these rules is that Smokey/Locke/MIB cannot kill Jacob which is why he had to get Ben to kill him. So, I guess Jacob never really needed any protection from Smokey.

This is true; there are some interesting rules governing the interaction of Jacob and Smokey. Although Jacob (apparently) cannot be killed by Smokey, Jacob's cabin still needed to be protected by a ring of ash. We also know that Jacob's cabin (apparently) isn't always visible and isn't always in the same place, so perhaps that was an added security measure. Even so, what was protecting Jacob's shelter under Taweret, and what was protecting the Temple when they did not ring the inner walls with ash? This was not explained, so I think it's something more than simple "rules" about "killing Jacob." Remember that Smokey (as Locke) had to be taken to Jacob by Richard; he did not know where Jacob was and could not find Jacob on his own.

[TheBeard]

I've thought for some time that "Smokey" may have been trapped inside of Jacob's cabin, BY THE ASH. Perhaps he was confined to the cabin. ???

I actually thought, for some time, that Jacob was malevolent and was trapped in the cabin by the ash. It seems that things are the other way around. Then again, we're being told that Smokey is evil by the followers of Jacob. "No man is evil in his own mind"-type of scenario.

And now that I think about it, we've heard Ben (and maybe others?) refer to Smokey as a defense system designed to protect the Temple. I wonder what that's about...

[TheBeard]

So, Claire is alive and on the island. This makes a lot of sense, since she seemed to just vanish into thin air. I'm looking forward to an explanation.

What Dogen said about Claire and Sayid in this episode does give a bit more credence to a theory that started forming during last season's finale: When Ilana went to Jacob's cabin and noticed the break in the ashen barrier, she said that Jacob had not been there for quite some time. We saw the same break when Ben took Locke to the cabin in season 3 (The Man Behind The Curtain). If Jacob wasn't in there, who was? Smokey (the smoke monster, the man in black). I think that every dead/missing person that's appeared to our heroes (Christian Shephard multiple times, Claire with Christian saying that she was safe or "home" or something, Walt when Locke had been shot and was in that mass grave, ...) has been Smokey. When Ben went under the Temple walls and fell through the floor and met up with Smokey, we saw that Smokey does have the ability to produce the image of dead persons (Ben's "daughter" told him to follow "Locke").

There are two problems with this theory. 1) Where is Christian Shephard's body? His casket was discovered on the island, but his body was missing. I'd rather there not be a mundane explanation for this. Also, in the "flash sideways" in the season premiere, Oceanic said that his coffin was not on the plane. 2) This theory does not explain Christian's appearance to Jack after Jack left the island.

[TheRiddick]

Does anyone think that Jacob's order to Hurley to take Sayid to the Temple is in some way leading to Jacob being "reincarnated" in Sayid's body? It happened to Locke somehow with Jacob's nemesis, and I am guessing that Jacob will use same trick now to get back at the Man in Black.

[TheBeard]

Does anyone think that Jacob's order to Hurley to take Sayid to the Temple is in some way leading to Jacob being "reincarnated" in Sayid's body? It happened to Locke somehow with Jacob's nemesis, and I am guessing that Jacob will use same trick now to get back at the Man in Black.

Well, it appears that Locke is very dead (on the island) and that the nemesis is simply taking the form of Locke in order to use his pull and gain Richard's trust (obedience?) in order to get an audience with Jacob.

I don't think that Jacob has set up Sayid to be his new body; I had entertained that thought prior to this most recent episode, but what Dogen said about Sayid being "claimed" makes me think otherwise. I do, however, think that Sayid is being set up to be some sort of savior for the island, and he may well end up being an envoy of Jacob's return.

[TheRiddick]

Well, it appears that Locke is very dead (on the island) and that the nemesis is simply taking the form of Locke in order to use his pull and gain Richard's trust (obedience?) in order to get an audience with Jacob.

I don't think that Jacob has set up Sayid to be his new body; I had entertained that thought prior to this most recent episode, but what Dogen said about Sayid being "claimed" makes me think otherwise. I do, however, think that Sayid is being set up to be some sort of savior for the island, and he may well end up being an envoy of Jacob's return.

Well, claimed could mean a number of things, another person taking over th body is one of them, IMO. Also, Sayid has the military training that may be required to confront the "new" Locke.

[MikeyC]

Remember that Smokey (as Locke) had to be taken to Jacob by Richard; he did not know where Jacob was and could not find Jacob on his own.

I don't think finding Jacob was a problem for smokey. I think he was just trying to maintain the illusion that he was Locke by pretending not to know where Jacob was. He had to keep everyone convinced he was Locke so that no one would warn Jacob and so that Ben could be convinced to kill Jacob.

[Mugen910]

Missed this from last week: In the airport Sun is called Ms. Paik, rather than Mrs. Kwan, by the security guards and Jin doesn't appear to have a wedding band on.
******
Final Season Episode 2


1. Sayid's torture:

* What if the pill was just a test for Jack to see if he would do the right thing for his friends and not put Sayid in harms way again? After all, Dogen said "here is your chance to redeem yourself." (I don't actually believe this as I think Dogen is just playing on Jack's guilt, that his actions continue to get people hurt, to get Sayid to take the pill, but thought it was an interesting theory)
* The ash test? To see if Smokey has taken over Sayid? What about the electricity (or was it sonic like the Otherville fence?) and hot poker?
* Think about how Sayid cried/ moaned/ pleaded while he was tortured. The old torturer-Sayid would have maintained composure (like when Rousseau tortured him). This is not our beloved Sayid.
* Sayid's only frame of reference for his experience with Dogen was one he knew from his past: torture. He told Dogen that he had no information to share, nothing that he was hiding. Was that the ''tell'' Dogen was looking for? Remember last season, when Richard indicated that one of the side effects of the healing water at the Temple was forgetfulness. Maybe Sayid remembers too much; maybe if the spring had worked, he wouldn't have processed his experience through the lens of his old, damned life. Regardless: Sayid said "failed."
* Sawyer's comment about Sayid being allowed a second chance, insinuating that Juliet wasn't allowed one but would have been more deserving of it... maybe the Island was done with Juliet, she reconciled her past and was allowed to move on, but maybe Sayid has more to do, like Michael. Michael couldn't die until the island was done with him.


2. The flash-sideways:

* Some events seem fated to happen whether on the island or in this alternate reality:

o Ethan Rom/Goodspeed being involved with Claire pregnancy and the birth of Aaron ("I don't want to stick you with needles if I don't have to." Yeah, we've heard THAT before! Literally.)
Kate being there/helping to deliver Aaron.
Aaron being cared for by Claire, not given away.
Kate becoming friends with Claire.

* Kate looks out the taxi window and sees Jack. They share a lengthy glance that tells us she clearly remembers him from more than just their run-in in the airplane bathroom.
* The mother who was supposed to adopt Aaron (Lindsey Baskum) was similar to pre-island Claire. Same back story! (Or at least the Island-Claire back story.) FLASHBACK to season 1 episode ''Raised By Another.'' Claire got pregnant and was initially wary of being a young mom, but Boyfriend Thomas was all ''We can do this!'', which got Claire all psyched to have the baby. Then Boyfriend Thomas got cold feet and dumped her, and Claire decided to give the baby up for adoption.
* Kate gave the alias Joan Hart when checking Claire in to the hospital. FLASHBACK to season 1 episode ''Born To Run,'' in which Kate - sporting dyed blonde hair - used the Joan Hart alias to check into a motel, then sneak into a hospital to visit her dying mother. This was also the episode where Kate and her childhood friend dug up the time capsule (inside: toy airplane, baseball), as well as the episode where Kate and Sun conspired to poison Jin so that he wouldn't leave the Island on the raft. We saw all those beats mirrored and referenced in last night's episode (hospital visit, poisoning, baseball, Sawyer's time capsule/ box).
* The stuffed whale in Claire's luggage. In the original island time line... it was Kate who gave Aaron that killer whale in season 4 episode ''Something Nice Back Home."

3. Infected/ darkness:

* If Claire (Jack's half-sister) is "infected" with the "darkness" and now looks Rousseau-ish, does this mean it's possible it was Rousseau who was infected, and not her team?
* Remember Season 4 finale when the mercenaries blew up some Dharmaville houses, Claire luckily survives such an explosion and a few minutes later meets Miles. Claire says something like "Wow, we're lucky to be alive!" and Miles answers something like: "I wouldn't be too sure." Maybe Claire was already dead and taken over by the sickness (as Miles seemed to notice there something was different with her or at the very least he looked at her suspiciously).
* When Ben and the Others used a poison gas attack on the Dharma compound during The Purge, perhaps they were actually preventing the "darkness" from spreading to the rest of the island, as the "darkness" had already claimed the Dharma encampment???
o Also, Daniel and Charlotte prevented a large amount of poison gas from being released by Ben at The Tempest. Perhaps Ben had anticipated that the "darkness" had already spread to some of the inhabitants?
* How did Sayid catch the sickness? We've known his whereabouts almost the entire time he's been back on the island, and he never encountered the Smoke Monster. I guess going into the Spring/ healing pool could have something to do with it (on account of the water being murky), but Dogen and a couple Others went in there, too, and I'm assuming they're not sick.

[Mugen910]

4. The Others:

* The Other who accompanied Kate is Aldo, guard from Room 23 (where Karl was brainwashed). Apparently he's been holding a grudge against Kate for knocking him unconscious three years ago.
* Deciphering the Others' hierarchy has been a goal of Lost fans ever since Benry Gale claimed that bearded Tom was not the leader. That was four seasons ago. One would think we'd stop running into people claiming to be in charge of the Others by now.
Tom, Ms. Klugh and Isabel were possibilities a long time ago. Stronger contenders included Charles Widmore, Eloise Hawking, Benjamin Linus and John Locke, who have all claimed to be the leader. And when finally it's looking like the guy with the real authority has been Richard Alpert (on Jacob's behalf) all along, Dogen appears. We need to see an Other org chart.
* Dogen's techniques were reminiscent of the scene at the Hydra Station (season 3), when Ben and Juliet tried to break Jack down and ''change his perspective'' in order to get him to save Ben's life by removing that tumor on his spine. The Others would like you to think they believe in free will (see: Lennon praising Jack this week for voluntarily coming to them), but it's a rigged game; they have no problem with telling half-truths, outright lies, or just plain nothing to get you to do what they want you to do. Which is interesting. The Others manipulate our Losties but make them think everything is their own idea. How can Jacob profess the benefits of free will if he and his group of Others have been guiding/ nudging/ guilting the Losties into doing things all along!? Technically, that's not free will.
* Notice how Aldo won't let Justin tell Jin about the Ajira flight. The Others seem to be prohibited from sharing info with the Losties because doing so might tamper with them in some way - as if it's absolutely necessary that the castaways either discover stuff on their own, or are denied info that they don't need to know, or don't need to know yet.
* Justin's cryptic last words to Aldo regarding Jin also seemed important: "He might be one of them." We already know Jin is on Jacob's list, and both Aldo and Justin should know it too. So what else does "one of them" mean? Is there an ultimate purpose these people need to stay alive in order to accomplish? Seems like it. Might be nice if someone shared that with them, though.
* Think back to season two, where Ms. Klugh was asking Michael to lure four of his friends to The Others' encampment. "Why don't you just get them yourselves?" Michael had asked her, to which Klugh replied "It doesn't work that way, Michael". The Others could've taken these people by force any time that they wanted, but for some reason they didn't. They even had three out of four of them at gunpoint, on the day Tom/ Mr. Friendly drew a line in the sand. Yet somehow, for some reason, they needed these people to come on their own. Just like Jack did this week.
* Now think back to season three, where Ben was trying to convince Jack to do his spinal surgery. "You want me to save your life?" Jack had asked him incredulously. "No", Ben responded. "I want you to want to save my life."
* A good theory! "Not only do the temple-dwellers need Sayid to effectively kill himself, but they need Jack to act as the accomplice. You could argue that Dogen used Jack because Sayid inherently trusts him, but that's not the sole reason. Jack, and Jack alone, must be the person who gets Sayid to take the poison. And the reason for this is simple: Jack must clean up his own mess.

Go back to last episode. Right before they dipped Sayid in the spring, Dogen says "Who did this to him?" Jack steps up and claims responsibility. "My fault. I didn't shoot him, but it's my fault." This seemed pretty out of place back then, but Dogen puts the same question to Jack right now. He asks again how Sayid got shot, and Jack tells him what happened. "So, he was helping you?", Dogen asks, very specifically. "Yes", Jack says again. And from here, two things become brutally obvious.

First, Jack has to be the one to give Sayid the pill. It can't be Hurley, it can't be Miles... because Jack was the person directly responsible, he must also be the one to clean up his own mess. This very line is used more than once in past seasons, and we've already seen the theory in action:

During season three, Ben tried to make Locke kill Anthony Cooper. He even made it seem as if it were some strange test he had to pass. The truth of the matter however, is that Ben couldn't kill Cooper for a much different reason: Ben wasn't the person who brought the man from Tallahassee to the island in the first place. He thought it was Locke, and therefore needed Locke to commit the murder. But Ben turned out to be wrong here, because it was actually Sawyer who had brought Cooper to the island - a manifestation of his intense desire to find the man responsible for the death of his parents. Even Locke realized this, when he somehow couldn't even bring himself to kill the man who had caused his paralysis. Instead, Locke lured Sawyer to the Black Rock, where he strangled Cooper."

5. Otherville:

* Sawyer in Otherville continuing to mourn Juliet. He even digs an engagement ring out the floorboards of his old house and, like Desmond in "Flashes Before Your Eyes", he chucks it into the ocean. I loved Kate's disappointment. It's like she always thought that Juliet was Sawyer's consolation prize for losing Kate, but Sawyer really loved Juilet and has no romantic feelings for Kate at all at this point. Hahahahaha! She followed him thinking they were going to be a team but he seems to want nothing to do with her. Again, hahahahahaha!

6. Although, for me it was a boring-ish episode one blogger had an interesting perspective: It was an episode about people trying to ditch burdensome, painful baggage (like Kate and her shackles, heartbroken Sawyer and his ring) - or learning to embrace it (like Claire and her baby; like Jack and his failures/ accountability).


7. A fun theory from the web:

"Opening scene of last year's finale:

MIB: It always ends the same. They come, they fight, they kill, they destroy. It always ends the same.

Jacob: Yes but it only ends once. Anything before that is progress.

Here's the thought: The alternate reality is just one itteration of many alts and Jacob and Smokey can experience all of them. Jacob has the ability to leave the island and choose which alt universe or dimension he enters. Each one ends the same. No matter what he does to try to bring people to the island to save humanity it always ends up failing. But every time there is progress.

THE ALT OF SEASON SIX IS THE FINAL PROGRESSION WHERIN THEY SUCCEED IN SAVING HUMANITY.

This also means that the version in which we are currently on island is one of the failures so all of those people in that reality are doomed to fail and humanity will be destroyed. But this brings a whole new meaning to "it worked".

In each dimension the incident is what creates the alt reality. The entire first five seasons are us seeing the itteration before the final itteration. The one that finally made success possible.

"IT WORKED" MEANS THEY ALL FINALLY GOT THEIR DESTINY RIGHT.

Rewatching LA X and when Rose says to Jack "It's ok. You can let go now." You could take that as, "You can give in to youre destiny. We got it right this time."

Jacob believed they were making progress. Meaning there was eventually something he was trying to get right. He did, but he didn't understand what was happening until after he died. He had to die and the island had to not exist at all during these people's lifetimes for them to get their destiny right. The final solution to Jacob's ultimate goal was to take himself and the island out of play."

[TheBeard]

Well, claimed could mean a number of things, another person taking over th body is one of them, IMO. Also, Sayid has the military training that may be required to confront the "new" Locke.

Do you mean to say that Jacob would want to take over (or inhabit, or whatever) Sayid's body so that he may gain Sayid's military training for his own use? I would think that someone like Jacob would already have all that and more.

If "claimed" (I need to figure out what Dogen said in Japanese) meant that Jacob was taking over Sayid's body, then two questions: 1) Why does Dogen say that a "darkness" is growing within Sayid? Jacob is supposed to be their savior/protector ("ille qui nos omnes servabit"). 2) Why did Dogen say that the same thing happened to Claire (unless Jack has another sister)? Jacob's only been dead for a few hours--a day at the most--and Jacob's nemesis is on the other side of the island hauling Richard through the jungle. If Claire had been "possessed" by either of these two entities, how did Dogen find out so quickly? Claire had 3 years or so on the island in which she could have been "claimed" and the Others learn of it. I don't think that Sayid is being set up to be Jacob's new body.

[TheBeard]

I don't think finding Jacob was a problem for smokey. I think he was just trying to maintain the illusion that he was Locke by pretending not to know where Jacob was. He had to keep everyone convinced he was Locke so that no one would warn Jacob and so that Ben could be convinced to kill Jacob.

Hmm, I might have to go back and re-watch the last few episodes of last season. The more I think about it now, the more I'm remembering little glimpses that seemed to say that Ben knew exactly where they were going without Richard telling him. If this is true, then there's a lot more here going on than meets the eye. Then again, when is this not true?

[white_s2k]

Hmm, I might have to go back and re-watch the last few episodes of last season. The more I think about it now, the more I'm remembering little glimpses that seemed to say that Ben knew exactly where they were going without Richard telling him. If this is true, then there's a lot more here going on than meets the eye. Then again, when is this not true?

Ben was all too "shocked" during the last few episodes of last season about all that was transpiring. I found that very weird, Ben is ALWAYS in control.. especially when we think he's not. Ben has basically disappeared these first two episodes of the season, and I get the feeling the writers want it that way. I think they have something big planned for Ben this season. What that is? Hell if I know :D

[weak_link]

Pretty clear by the level of detail in this thread I need to go back and review a few episodes to get back up to speed on this show. Great analysis here!

Since I'm not quite up to speed I'm going to stick with "Oh Kate, let me count the ways I love thee." Except for the murdering psycho female part.

[TheBeard]

* Deciphering the Others' hierarchy has been a goal of Lost fans ever since Benry Gale claimed that bearded Tom was not the leader. That was four seasons ago. One would think we'd stop running into people claiming to be in charge of the Others by now.

I've been pondering this for a little while now. I think that the Others are split into two groups: Those in the Temple, and those outside the Temple. The Temple is a stronghold--Ben called it the last safe place on the island--it's a beacon, it's stationary. Dogen is the one (currently) charged with protecting the Temple. Dogen definitely holds sway over the Others who are within the Temple. Outside, we've seen many people proclaimed the leader of the Others (Ellie and Charles, Ben, the real Locke for a time). Is their command absolute? I don't think so. There might be interesting power struggles if one of them came to the Temple. As for Richard, he's always been an adviser and leader of the Others, but I don't think he has desires to lead the Others in any grand or overly-direct way. He's the Others' direct line to Jacob; think of him as a shaman or a mystic. He has great respect and great pull amongst the Others, but he only uses then when necessary.


Some of the other notes about the Others' manipulation of people and talk of free will and destiny is really giving me a lot to think about :)

[BigCat]

Interesting thing that was highlighted in a recap article I read yesterday was kate's name at the hospital, Joan Hart. The article I read suggested it was a reference to Melissa Joan Hart. There was no further explanation in the article, but some around my age may recall that Melissa Joan Hart starred in "Clarissa Explains it All". Clarissa = Claire?

[TheBeard]

Ben was all too "shocked" during the last few episodes of last season about all that was transpiring. I found that very weird, Ben is ALWAYS in control.. especially when we think he's not. Ben has basically disappeared these first two episodes of the season, and I get the feeling the writers want it that way. I think they have something big planned for Ben this season. What that is? Hell if I know :D

Agreed: Ben was uncharacteristically out of control at the end of the last season. Then again, can we blame him? "Dead is dead," and yet there he is, standing right there after Ben choked the life out of him with his own two hands. Even Richard didn't know what to make of the situation. That would be enough to shake anybody, I'd say. Also it seems apparent that Ben had never seen an apparition of a dead person on the island, unlike the Losties who see Christian Shephard et. al. from time to time. So when the smoke monster showed Ben his dead daughter and that vision told Ben to follow Locke, I wouldn't really blame Ben's pants for being a little brown, nor would I be surprised at how much of a loss Ben finds himself.

I did like what I saw in Ben's eyes last episode (LAX, part 2) after the smoke monster killed Brahm et. al. Ben finally had enough pieces to start putting enough of it together to make a plan. We definitely haven't seen the last of this manipulator. :pi

[TheBeard]

Since I'm not quite up to speed I'm going to stick with "Oh Kate, let me count the ways I love thee." Except for the murdering psycho female part.

The "murdering psycho" part caught my mind last night as I was trying to drift off to sleep. In the flash "sideways" scenes, in this parallel universe or time line or whatever it is, things are different. Things are the same, but there are little differences. The differences started when the stewardess handed Jack one bottle of booze, not two. I think we saw the gravity of the situation when Hurley said that he was the luckiest man in the world and that nothing bad ever happened to him. Double you, tea, eff, my friend.

We get to this episode, and Claire asks Kate what she did to be hunted by the authorities. Kate asks Claire if Claire would believe her if she said she was innocent. Kate never tells Claire what happened, but I have to wonder if it's the same as it was in the original storyline; is "What Kate Does" different from "What Kate Did?" (Sorry, I just had to play on the episode titles like that :)). I'd like to think that it is.

[weak_link]

Just watched the last episode again. I have nothing to base this on but I think Aaron is going to be a key figure when this thing wraps up.

[TheBeard]

Just watched the last episode again. I have nothing to base this on but I think Aaron is going to be a key figure when this thing wraps up.

I think Aaron's significance lies more in how he ties Claire (and Jack) to Kate.

I'm still waiting to see why Mr. Friendly called Walt "special." Walt >> Aaron in my book. :pi

[Skywalker]

I'm... Lost!!!:confused:

[Mugen910]

I'm... Lost!!!:confused:

:r So much for explaining everything this season.

[Mugen910]

LOST season 6, ep #3 "The Substitue"


1) Richard: Previously calm, his fear shows that some serious stuff if going down. He also seemed confused by almost everything Flocke was telling him, most importantly the whole concept of ''candidates.'' Flocke: ''Jaocb didn't tell you? He never said why? I never would have done that to you! I never would have kept you in the dark! I would have treated you with respect!'' Interesting...

2) Smokey: A theory! Were there two smoke monsters at the beginning of tonight's episode? People have been theorizing for a while that there are 2 smoke monsters, but I never bought into it that much. This week we saw a smokey point of view, zooming through the jungle to Otherville to the reflection in the window outside of Sawyer's house ....
Then we saw more smoke monster perspective zooming through the jungle to the machete, which Flocke picks up ...
Then a little later, Flocke shows up at Sawyer's. Wouldn't he have manifested as Flocke upon his first run through the jungle when he stopped outside of Sawyer's place, and not later? I mean, why go to the house, go back to the jungle for the knife, then return to the house? That is, unless the first smoke monster was NOT Flocke but Jacob (who then manifested as the boy)!
**Perhaps there have been TWO smoke monsters since the series premiere. Watch the first night on the beach scene again....The first monster is coming toward them on the beach, knocking down trees. Another loud sound is made to the right, and the people in the scene turn 120 degrees to the right to see what it was. Then they hear a sound again to the left, turn back 120 degrees to the left, and the monster is now retreating. The black smoke monster coming after the corpses was run off by the white smoke monster.
***In Episode 4 of the first season, Locke looks up at a monster, but we are never shown it. He later comments, "I have looked into the eye of the island and it was beautiful." It was the white smoke monster of life, contrasted with the black smoke monster of death.
***The Black smoke monster can only assume the form of the dead. The white smoke monster can assume the form of the living. This explains why in Season One, a form of John Locke appears so many times so abruptly, but with no sound, surprising those nearby. It was the white smoke monster at that time. You may notice in those surprise moments, it is the confident, wise Locke offering counsel and advice to those in need.

3) Boy in jungle - Richard couldn't see him but Sawyer could? Was it a young Jacob? Only those whom Jacob touched can see him??? Flocke seemed disturbed by the fact that Sawyer could see the boy. The first time we see the boy his hands are bloody, the second time there is no blood on his hands.

4) For the third straight episode, the episode's lead character was given a conspicuous moment with a bathroom mirror.

5) Flash sideways:

* Surprised by Locke's glee in the sprinkler? That scene was similar to the first season, Locke sitting on the beach smiling peacefully as the rain came down on his face.
* Flocke's alarm clock sounded a lot like the "button" sequence alarm in the hatch.
* Flocke's flash-sideways self is more confident, has a sense of self, not afraid, not a loser, loved... so I'm guessing Sideways Anthony Cooper had nothing to do with crippling his son.
* Fun thought: We know from season 1 that Boone Carlyle's mother, Sabrina Carlyle, owned a massively successful wedding business, and that Boone served as the company's chief operating officer. Maybe the Carlyle family biz will play a role in solving Helen's catering crisis.
*
It was interesting the way he described the walkabout in the episode LA X. He called it ''an adventure'' about ''man versus nature.'' By contrast, when Island Locke described the Walkabout in the classic season 1 episode of the same name, he called it ''a journey of spiritual renewal, where one derives strength from the earth and becomes inseparable from it.'' Island Locke wanted to be feel connected to the world, to something bigger than himself; Sideways Locke wanted to feel his own strength, to feel whole again - to feel like a man. Sideways Locke isn't as spiritual as Island Locke.
*
The pictures in Locke's cubicle (see attached photo): There was a photo of Locke (with hair) with his father, Anthony Cooper; they looked to be hunting, as we saw them in a past episode. There was also a photo of Locke with Helen in a tropical setting, presumably Hawaii. The curious thing about both photos: Locke appeared to be standing. When and how did Locke become dependent on a wheelchair? Island Locke got thrown out of that eighth-floor window by his dad (Anthony Cooper) leaving him paralyzed. Sideways Locke's accident must have been a trauma that he experienced after meeting Helen.
*
Randy called Locke ''colonel.'' Remember that Island Locke played a military strategy board game Axis and Allies during his lunch break with a friend/colleague (not seen last night) and liked to be called ''colonel.''
*
Locke was fired and left with his box of belongings. Inside the box was a polar bear figurine.
*
Locke and Jack always butted heads via man of faith vs. man of science. It appears that now in the flash sideways Locke is a man of science. Literally. He accepted a job as substitute teacher. Subject: Biology. First lesson: the human reproductive system. It also looked like he was either teaching physical education or coaching basketball. There were some deeply embedded ironies here. Remember the season 4 episode ''Cabin Fever,'' in which Teenage Locke was encouraged by a teacher to cultivate his natural talent for science by attending a summer camp run by Mittelos Biosciences, the Others' company that recruited Juliet Burke to The Island. But Locke didn't want to hear that. He wanted to drive fast cars and play sports. When he was told his dreams were unrealistic, Young Locke bellowed, ''Don't tell me what I can't do!'' In the Sideways world, Locke is teaching science, teaching sports, and looking very much like a man who just found his niche. Of course, there's still ample time for his born again life to go horribly wrong. After all, he's now working with Benjamin Linus..
*
The woman interviewing Locke at the temp agency looked familiar. She was the "psychic" that Hurley's dad paid to tell Hurley he was no longer cursed. According to ABC press release, both appearances constitute the same character.

6) Was that a spider or a crab on Locke's dead body? Spider - like the Nikki/ Paolo paralyzing spider???

7) Revelations regarding Flocke: He is old. He told Sawyer that he was a reader - but that Steinbeck's Of Mice and Men, published in 1937, was after his time. He used to be a man.

8) The cave:

* Jacob's end game is to get a replacement island protector. Flocke's end game is to get off the island, to go home. He's recruiting people to assist him. It appears he had to eliminate Jacob as a necessary step.
* When Sawyer asked why the Island would need protection, Locke snapped: ''From nothing, James. That's the joke. There's nothing to protect it from. It's just a damn island!'' yeah right! The island boasts: (1) The Temple's magic healing spring. (2) Frozen donkey wheel time travel magic. (3) Smokey. Bottom line: The Island is totally special.
* The Fake Locke/Sawyer story line - in which the Monster led Sawyer to a remote cave which he promised would contain answers echoed previous episodes. I'll cite just two in particular. (1) ''The Brig,'' in which the real John Locke led Sawyer across the Island to the Black Rock for a bloody date with Anthony Cooper; and (2) ''Every Man For Himself,'' in which Ben snowed Sawyer into thinking he'd implanted a killer pacemaker in his chest, then hiked him up a hill to reveal he was no longer stuck on the Island, but actually trapped on another.
* I thought Jack was never on any list?? Remember when Ben brought Jack to the small island to perform his spinal surgery...someone confronted Ben about the fact that Jack wasn't on the list....so why is his name written in the cave?
* Do you think Alex might have been a candidate, which would be why it was "breaking the rules" for Keamey to kill her? No killing candidates?
* Is Sawyer conning Flocke???

9) Cave names: See the attachment for an example of how the smart people on the internet created this list.
Kate is noticeably absent from not just the numbers, but the wall. Names on the wall go back to at least the 1950's as evidenced by Cunningham and Jones, two soldiers on the island in 1954

Some crossed out names:
4 - Locke (John)
8 - Reyes (Hurley)
10 - Mattingley - Other
15 - Ford (James)
16 - Jarrah (Sayid)
23 - Shephard (Jack)... Psalm 23: The Lord is my shepherd
31 - Rutherford (Shannon)
42 - Kwon (Jin or Sun)
56 - Burke - (Juliet)
64 - Goodspeed (Ethan, Horace, Olivia, or Amy)
70 - Faraday (Daniel)
73 - Costa - ?
90 - Troupe - ?
115 - Bargas - ?
117 - Linus (Ben, Roger)
119 - Almeida - Maybe Paulo's last name?
142 - Lewis (Charlotte)
171 - Straume (Miles)
195 - Pace (Charlie)
222 - O'Toole - U.S. Military
233 - Jones - U.S. Military
291 - Domingo - U.S. Military
313 - Littleton (Claire or Aaron)
317 - Cunningham - U.S. Military
337 - Martin (Karl) - Other
346 - Grant - U.S. Military

Partial writings:
20 - Rous (Possibly Rousseau)
25 - ___
30 - ___
33 - Martin?
49 - Cha (Possibly Chang)
62 - ___
251 - ___
260 - ___
272 - ___
285 - Jen (Possibly Jenkins)
__ - Reynolds
__ - Sullivan (the guy from season 1 who had a rash)
__ - Lacombe (from the French science team)
175 - Costa

*
#42, only said Kwon. Flocke said he didn't know if it was Jin or Sun...... maybe it's neither. Jin and Sun's daughter, Ji Yeon, is one of a few children conceived on the island to live. Maybe she is #42... After all, Jacob touched both Jin and Sun at their wedding because at that point in time, Ji Yeon was in both of them. :O

[dannysguitar]

I thought Jack was never on any list?? Remember when Ben brought Jack to the small island to perform his spinal surgery...someone confronted Ben about the fact that Jack wasn't on the list....so why is his name written in the cave?

Maybe Shepard refers to Christian...? What do you think?

[weak_link]

When was the list created? Is it possible Jack made the list after his arrival and proved himself to be a worthy candidate is is that just not the way things work around there?

[TheBeard]

Maybe Shepard refers to Christian...? What do you think?

Unlikely. The show was uncharacteristically heavy-handed in showing us that the names corresponded to persons whom Jacob had personally visited and touched (specifically, the scenes from The Incident episode). Jacob was never shown to have touched Christian Shephard.

Oh numbers, you just love to prey upon us :D

[dannysguitar]

Unlikely. The show was uncharacteristically heavy-handed in showing us that the names corresponded to persons whom Jacob had personally visited and touched (specifically, the scenes from The Incident episode). Jacob was never shown to have touched Christian Shephard.

Oh numbers, you just love to prey upon us :D

This is true, but Kate was not on the list and Jacob came to her. We'll see what happens with that...

[ucla695]

Good stuff guys. :tu

[JE3146]

My head hurts....

[cort]

Get a life guys:D

[TheBeard]

This is true, but Kate was not on the list and Jacob came to her. We'll see what happens with that...

Yes. The show showed us that Jacob touched people who were on the list. Kate shows us that the reverse implication is not true (i.e. Jacob only touches/influences those whose names are on the list).

[dannysguitar]

I've been checkin the thread all day for the notes! :-)

[kaisersozei]

Great episode this week! Among the things I noticed:

Jack doesn't have the tattooes he picked up in Thailand;
There were an awful lot of names around that compass device, including (I think) Kate's (#51).

Here's an interesting site I found:

http://www.olivierlacan.com/projects/lostintime/

[okieRob]

and I thought the guys at work had it bad...

:tf

[Mugen910]

I have the Notes..but no interzweb at work right now..so be patient.
Posted via Mobile Device

[Mugen910]

LOST season 6, episode #4 "Lighthouse"

1) This episode was the 108th hour of LOST.

2) Jack's flash-sideways:
"Mom, when did I have my appendix taken out?" Jack asks. And Mom answers, "Why, day 99 of course. You passed out after realizing that Faraday and Charlotte were lying about wanting to rescue you and your friends and..." No just kidding, that didn't happen. Margo Shephard tells Jack that it was removed when he was a kid.... But we know that it happened a different way on the island. Jack noticing his appendectomy scar hints that his subconscious in some way remembers or is aware of the other reality. When Jughead exploded in 1977, off-island Jack would have been around 8-9 years old (when his mother claims he had the surgery) ... maybe when Jughead went off that's when the flash-sideways reality started...
''Something Nice Back Home'' was the episode about Jack's ruptured appendix. Jack's then-love interest, Juliet, performed the surgery, and if you recall, Jack initially wanted to perform the surgery on himself, and even when Juliet talked him out of it, he still tried to coach her through the process by... watching her in a mirror. So many mirrors!
Jack's son David. This name has been used for other LOST characters - Hurley's dad, Libby's deceased husband.
David's mother, who wasn't revealed in the episode, could be Sarah, island-Jack's ex-wife. For one thing, we know that she also plays the piano. But what if it's Juliet? And why wasn't she home the night David had his audition... maybe she was going dutch on coffee with Sawyer?!?!
Jack lets himself into his (ex?) wife's house by using the key under the rabbit statue - an obvious reference to the White Rabbit of Alice in Wonderland, a frequent subject of Jack episodes. Jack even tells his son that he used to the read the story to him when he was a kid, just as he did in the island time line with young Aaron, after they left the island.
Dogen in the flash-sideways... "They are too young to have this kind of pressure," he says, referring to their kids. And then, "It's hard to watch and be unable to help." Free will theme, yet again!
At the piano auditions Jack found the right room by following a sign directing ''the candidates'' to the auditorium
The piece David was playing: ''Fantasia Impromptu in C-sharp minor'' by Chopin. Last season on LOST, another child prodigy played the same number for us... Daniel Faraday in ''The Variable.''
We're seeing a very distinct pattern in the flash-sideways time lines... the circle can be broken. People can change. Mistakes don't need to be repeated, over and over again. Some examples so far:

* Kate is a fugitive on the run, only looking out for herself. She glances into a garage mirror and... BANG! Kate heads back to bring pregnant Claire her stuff, help her through false labor, and befriend her during a major crisis... all at great risk to her personal safety. * John Locke .... still struggling with his handicap he calls Jack's phone number, looks into a mirror and... BANG! Locke suddenly hangs up the phone and embraces his condition, along with Helen's love. * Jack Shephard is a workaholic surgeon neglecting a son he only sees once a month. He looks in the mirror and... well, you get the picture.
This is some exciting news, actually. It may be proof that Jacob is right. People don't always have to fight, corrupt, and destroy. By stopping to take a good look at what they've become, people can actually reverse bad behavior and start making positive changes to their lives. Maybe broken people can be fixed after all.
3) Flash-sideways in season 6:

In an interview from a few years ago the producers remind us that redemption has been an overriding theme of the series since Day 1... "Kate blew up a house with a man inside, Sayid is a torturer, Sawyer has done all sorts of nasty things. That's the space the show lives in. Michael was one of the few characters who was a victim before he came to the Island. He was a good guy, and his wife took his son away from him. He didn't have anything to be redeemed for until now." Perhaps the flash-sideways are the redemption that the producers have been hinting at the entire time. The characters are "fixing" their mistakes.
4) Claire:
It appears that Claire didn't time travel with the LOSTIES during last season's time flashes... she has been there for the 3 years (like Richard and the Others).
Claire said the Others captured and tortured her (even showed the scar). Based on this, and what Dogen said about Claire being infected, it seems that she underwent a test like Sayid.
Wondering how Claire became friends with Flocke... after all, she said "That's not John, that's my friend!" She seemed to list him separately than her dad because she said she had been out in the jungle with her dad AND a friend.
5) Jack and Hurley's adventure:
Shannon's inhaler (didn't they accuse Sawyer of taking that?), the caves, the skeletons, the coffin... it was nice to have some Season 1 nostalgia.

6) The lighthouse:

The mirror... I think the only purpose of this in the episode was to show the LOSTIES that Jacob has been watching for a long time...we already knew that. But, now they finally do.
The dial # 108- Wallace. Who is that and is it important? The theory is that it's Desmond. Wallace is a Scottish name, the name of a Scottish hero in fact, and Desmond is Scottish.
"Paradox Lost" WRITTEN BY WALLACE is a book that extrapolates on the properties on magnetic/electromagnetic fields in relation to light, mass and time by a few physicists, but primarily by a scientist named Michael Faraday.
In the mirror, we see the church from Sawyer's parents funeral... ... the building where Jin and Sun got married... the house where Jack grew up.
See attached for Kate's name... #51 - Austen
I think it looks like Jack's name has been written over another name or is at least bolder than the other names (see attached).
Hurley has stepped into Richard's shoes... guiding others to follow Jacob's "orders."
7) At the temple:

In the hallway when Hurley was looking for a secret door, he instructed Dogen to return to the courtyard. Dogen replied in Japanese (roughly): "If you weren't a candidate I'd..."
8) Perhaps the cave that Flocke took Sawyer to isn't Jacob's? Jacob already has the lighthouse dial. Maybe the cave is where Flocke has been listing names trying to figure out who is on Jacob's candidate list and he crosses them out during his process of elimination...

9) Interesting that smoke and mirrors are used a lot in this show.... Probably means that we've been theorizing all wrong and the writers have totally duped us!

https://mail.google.com/mail/?ui=2&ik=95e7713c8c&view=att&th=1270aa209e3ac852&attid=0.1&disp=inline&zw

https://mail.google.com/mail/?ui=2&ik=95e7713c8c&view=att&th=1270aa209e3ac852&attid=0.2&disp=inline&zw

[Mugen910]

Fun for the next episode!

https://mail.google.com/mail/?ui=2&ik=95e7713c8c&view=att&th=1270ac8e538d38f8&attid=0.1.1&disp=emb&zw

[BigCat]

Great episode this week! Among the things I noticed:

Jack doesn't have the tattooes he picked up in Thailand;
There were an awful lot of names around that compass device, including (I think) Kate's (#51).

Here's an interesting site I found:

http://www.olivierlacan.com/projects/lostintime/

That's a nice link, thanks! It reminded me of a few things that happened in the first seasons that I forgot about.

[mosesbotbol]

Can't get enough of Lost. There's just so much to it.

[ucla695]

Another great update Bao!! Certainly helps tie stuff together!!

[TheBeard]

The enhanced version of Lighthouse was great: They translated what Dogen said to Hurley. Basically, it was "You're lucky I have to protect you, otherwise I'd remove your head from your body and feed it to the boars." :r

But here's an interesting question about Dogen: Why was he in LA in the flash sideways when he was a business man in Japan? Obviously, there are large differences here in the flash sideways.

I keep meaning to sit down and write out a lot of my thoughts (some spurred by Bao's collected notes postings). Maybe one day I'll get around to that...

[TheBeard]

3) Flash-sideways in season 6:

In an interview from a few years ago the producers remind us that redemption has been an overriding theme of the series since Day 1... "Kate blew up a house with a man inside, Sayid is a torturer, Sawyer has done all sorts of nasty things. That's the space the show lives in. Michael was one of the few characters who was a victim before he came to the Island. He was a good guy, and his wife took his son away from him. He didn't have anything to be redeemed for until now." Perhaps the flash-sideways are the redemption that the producers have been hinting at the entire time. The characters are "fixing" their mistakes.


I don't like this theory. Two large reasons that I do not like this theory are Sayid and Hurley. Whether in the past or in the present, on the island or off, in this story or in the flash sideways, Sayid just can't catch a break. Sayid's past never leaves him. Sayid is always the one you go to when there is going to be a direct physical confrontation. No matter what Sayid tries, his past will continue to haunt him.

Hurley, on the other hand, doesn't have the dark/troubled past that lead him to the island. Hurley is ... just being Hurley. He's got confidence in himself, which indicates that he's not considered (by himself or others) to be crazy or haunted or anything. He won the lottery, and what he's doing with the money in the flash sideways mirrors what he was doing with the money originally.

Hurly is just being Hurley. Sayid is just being Sayid. Jack is just being Jack. Kate is just being Kate. Whatever happened, happened. In the flash sideways, the Island never happened to these people. The Island sank after the Jughead was detonated, presumably, as evidenced by the underwater Dharmaville shots in the episode LA X. They're just living their lives.

[weak_link]

But here's an interesting question about Dogen: Why was he in LA in the flash sideways when he was a business man in Japan? Obviously, there are large differences here in the flash sideways.

...

When they are at the audition he made a comment to Jack, something to the effect of 'it's hard to just stand by and watch, you feel so helpless.'

Is he there to observe Jack while trying to influence others to guide Jack in the direction 'they' want?

[dannysguitar]

:-(

[Mugen910]

LOST season 6, ep #5 "Sundown"

1) Nadia
Nadia's necklace this episode consisted of a circle within a circle. Maybe this represented the alternate time line being a subset of the larger story we've been watching for the past five years?
Her back story... she also lived in Iraq and Sayid was ordered to torture her for information. Instead, he orchestrated her escape and even killed a fellow soldier to secure her protection. As she ran away, Nadia showed her feelings for Sayid to be genuine by writing a message on a picture of herself in Sayid's dossier: ''You will find me in the next life, if not in this one.'' *gasp!*
The minivan in Nadia's driveway had the same license plate as Jack's jeep from last week (see attached photos)
Nadia no longer bears scars on her arms from scalding water and burns as a result of Sayid's torturing. That implies that in this sideways-world she was never tortured by Sayid.

2) Dogen
Dogen's son... yet another car crash (add it to the list: Kate's friend Tom, Matthew Abbadon, Claire and her mom, Kate and the farmer, Michael in NY, Locke while chasing his mom, Sarah Shepherd and Shannon's dad, the marshall dodging the black horse, Juliet's ex-husband hit by bus, Hurley crashes his hot rod, Emily Locke hit while pregnant with John, Nadia in crosswalk)
Jacob's offer is similar to Ben's promise back in season three... Made ironically enough under the pretense of "Jacob's word", Ben promised to cure Juliet's sister's cancer if she herself were to stay on the island. Stuck there, unable to leave, Juliet was miserable from that point forward... just as Dogen was miserable throughout his duty as temple leader.
Dogen explained to Sayid that the machine he zapped him with back in ''What Kate Does'' was designed to ''tell us how the scale is balanced. And yours... tipped the wrong way.'' Should we note that Dogen didn't say ''tipped toward evil?'' Should we be wondering if LOST wanted to invite debate what the ''right way'' might be?
Jacob gave Dogen a specific job on the island in order to save his son. In their contract, Dogen CANNOT kill any of the candidates. Dogen was about to kill Sayid, but the baseball crashed to the floor, reminding Dogen that if he killed Sayid, he would break his contract (and maybe his son's safety?).

3) Sayid's flash-sideways
As we've been seeing, the flash-sideways seems to be where our Losties can break their cycles of bad behavior and move forward with hope of a different outcome.
This is the second time we've seen Jin in a food pantry (In "Everyone Hates Hugo" Jin appeared in Hurley's dream set in the swan hatch food pantry). Actually, this is the second time we've seen Sayid in one too (In "Enter 77" Sayid was questioned inside a French restaurant's food pantry).
At dinner with his family Sayid claims that his job is taking him next to Toronto, and whenever someone on LOST mentions Canada, they're lying: Ethan claimed to be from Canada, Bonnie and Greta (from the Looking Glass station) claimed to be on assignment in Canada, Anthony Cooper claimed to be from Canada, Sawyer claimed to have a Canadian business partner as part of a con. Weird, huh?

4) Keamy
Omar (from Widmore's freighter mercenary team) picks Sayid up and forces him to meet with the money-lender who harmed his brother - none other than island Omar's mercenary team leader, Martin Christopher Keamy! (see attached photos of Omar)
Jin is working for Mr. Paik, and we know that Keamy has worked for Charles Widmore, and we know that the two (Paik and Widmore) are connected. Maybe Jin is being held prisoner due to a feud between the two? Is Keamy wearing the gold watch that Jin was supposed to deliver? Looked like it!

5) Jacob's bargain
Could this explain why Richard is ageless? Jacob made him an offer he couldn't refuse, much like Dogen's?
Is it possible that after Nadia was hit by the car, Jacob offered Sayid to save her life but Sayid would have to go to the island too, and that when Jack's father died, maybe he bargained for the same thing, but they just haven't shown us that yet? Maybe even Sawyer bargained for his parents? Just a thought!

6) Flocke's bargain
Flocke promised Claire that he'd get Aaron back for her in exchange for her faithful service. What if I told you could have your heart's desire? It's hard to hear Flocke's enticements and not wonder if what he's offering the castaways is a ticket to Sidewaysville... that if they do what he asks he'll get them to this flash-sideways where they can redeem and start over!
"Anything at all"... And what Sayid wants is Nadia (though I should mention it's conceivable that he was referring to Shannon). Sure, it's free will, but does free will really matter when one choice is so undesirable? Does Sayid really have a choice to do the things he does if he believes not doing them will harm the people he cares about?
Maybe the Others are more like the 815 survivors than we previously thought. They can't leave the island, even if they want to, they've long since given up on asking questions because people like Dogen, Richard and Ben don't give out answers, and all they want to do now is survive as best they can.

7) Kate
Recruiting Kate into his army may be one of Flocke's biggest mistakes, because even though Austen-51 may not be one of Jacob's favorite six numbers, Kate is definitely still a candidate.
It seems that Kate may be the one recruit who hasn't made a deal with Flocke, taken anything from him, or chosen to join him of her own free will. This could be dangerous for Flocke.

8) The infection
What if the "infection" isn't really an infection but is someone exercising their free will???

9) From last week's episode "Lighthouse":
Did the chains that Hurley pulled in the lighthouse sound like the smoke monster's "clanging/ clicking?"

10) Interesting theories/ comments I found:

"In fact, think about the wondrous things associated with Jacob. Richard's eternal youth. The resurrection hot spring. And, if you believe Ben from season 3, a cure for cancer. Jacob isn't ''good,'' per se - he's just capable of giving life. Put another way: Jacob is the god of beginnings. He is The Alpha. The Man in Black? Not evil - he's the god of endings. He is the Omega. The beginning and the end. Polar, warring opposites, but absolutely necessary for life to bloom (Alpha) and to have form (Omega). Both are necessary for anything to have meaning. Jacob unchecked leads to chaos; Man In Black unchecked leads to annihilation. Both need to exist in balance; both need to be equally weighted rocks on the scale."

"The narrative of Lost has always been one of opposed factions. Dharma, the Others. The fuselage, the tail section. The beach, the caves. Man of science, man of faith. Fate, free will. John's group, Jack's group. The Oceanic 6, those left behind. 1977, 2007. Good, evil. Light, dark. Black, white. Jacob, the Man in Black. But it's past sundown now, and wherever our characters have aligned could very well be where they stay for the rest of the story."

"This is supposed to be a show about redemption and choice. Maybe the off-island lives are the redemptive part of making the right choices and the reward for those choices. Perhaps what we are seeing is the Losties somehow having the opportunity to change their FATE and are rewarded with happier lives."

https://mail.google.com/mail/?ui=2&ik=95e7713c8c&view=att&th=1273da6c371e0f76&attid=0.1&disp=inline&zw


https://mail.google.com/mail/?ui=2&ik=95e7713c8c&view=att&th=1273da6c371e0f76&attid=0.2&disp=inline&zw

https://mail.google.com/mail/?ui=2&ik=95e7713c8c&view=att&th=1273da6c371e0f76&attid=0.3&disp=inline&zw

https://mail.google.com/mail/?ui=2&ik=95e7713c8c&view=att&th=1273da6c371e0f76&attid=0.4&disp=inline&zw

[weak_link]

We are running out of episodes and we still don't have jack and or s&*! for answers. I don't think the writers have an end point and they are still making this stuff up as they go along. :(

The good news is that Kate is still the love of my tv life.

[Jack Straw]

Getting geared up for tonight's episode, we have company over to watch with us here. I'm pumped!

[Mugen910]

Sadly I am not all that impressed with Kate. Got to talk to her while in Paris last year at the Louvre. She was def cute but I will take Juliet anyday!!! :dr
Posted via My kick@$$ Mobile Device

[Jack Straw]

http://img.moronail.net/img/9/0/2790.jpg


:D:D

[weak_link]

Sadly I am not all that impressed with Kate. Got to talk to her while in Paris last year at the Louvre. She was def cute but I will take Juliet anyday!!! :dr
Posted via My kick@$$ Mobile Device

I never was much for blonds.

http://images.fanpop.com/images/image_uploads/Evangeline-Lilly--Kate--lost-34290_1024_768.jpg

[weak_link]

Wow that's big.

[kugie]

http://img.moronail.net/img/9/0/2790.jpg


:D:D

:r:r
That's funny

[white_s2k]

Hmmm.. I'm a bit torn about this last season of Lost. It's very... BLAH to me.

Been a die-hard fan since season two. Seems like the writers are just making stuff up as they go along now. I know there's 9-10 episodes left.. but I definitely don't think we're going to be getting the "perfect ending" we're all hoping for. Nothing has made my jaw drop this season, like in the past.

Just my 2 cents, hopefully it gets better :tu

[Mugen910]

LOST season 6, ep #6 "Dr. Linus"

1) Jack, Richard, Hurley:
Hurley waking up in the field of flowers was reminiscent of the poppy sequence in The Wizard of Oz (add it to the list of Oz references from this show... here's a link to all the Oz references http://lostpedia.wikia.com/wiki/The_Wizard_of_Oz).
"I can't kill myself", Richard explains. It doesn't explain his agelessness, but it does explain a lot of other things we've seen these past years. Namely, it tells us why Jack couldn't kill himself on the sixth street bridge, why Locke couldn't hang himself in that hotel room, and ended up needing some help from Ben. Maybe it even suggests that Michael was touched by Jacob at one point too, because his repeated attempts at suicide in season four were all thwarted (until the island was done with him).

2) Ben's flash-sideways:
Arzt complained that got formaldehyde on his shirt, a funny reference to the season 1 episode when Arzt blew up and Jack got some Arzt on his shirt.
Until this week's episode, it had been safe to assume that both the Island and Sideways worlds shared the same history until 1977, which is when the time-traveling Losties detonated Jughead. Now we know differently. The flash-sideways revelation that Ben and his Dad were a part of Dharma means that Sideways Roger and Ben left the Island prior to its sinking. But Island Roger and Ben were still on the Island when Juliet banged the bomb. Implication: If the two worlds share a common history, the fork in the road is sometime before 1977.

Funny that in the scene with Roger, Ben went in to a closet filled with gas tanks to replace an oxygen tank for his Dad. When Dharma was purged Ben gassed his Dad to death.

Principal Reynolds vs Charles Widmore... both exposed by Ben for cheating... in position of power that Ben wanted.

Reynolds in turn threatened to ''torch'' Alex's chances at getting into Yale and thus destroy her future, just as Widmore sent his goons to ''torch'' (Widmore's word) the Island and kill Alex unless Ben bent to his will.
Donald Lawrence Reynolds is an anagram for 'a cloned world nearly ends'
Ben was teaching about Napoleon and Elba are good metaphors for the island and its various leaders. Like Elba, the island is a sort of prison for larger-than-life entities. Being sent to Elba was, as Ben pointed out, the end of Napoleon's power. I know this parallel was supposed to hint at the losses of power and exiles of Ben and Widmore (in their cases, from the island, not to it), but Elba could also refer to the Man in Black, who views the island as a sort of prison.

3) Widmore:
Widmore/ Ben/ Others history:
When Widmore was the Others' leader he ordered Ben to ''exterminate'' both Rousseau and Alex. Ben refused and Widmore dismissed Ben's ''idealism'' as sentimental and self-serving - about him needing to feel needed (much like Principal Reynolds accused Ben of needing History Club more than the students did). When Ben uncovered the truth about Widmore's off-island affair (with, presumably, Penny's mother), he staged a coup and forced Widmore into exile. Ben then moved the Others out of the jungle and into Dharmaville (after the Purge). But Ben's dream of settling down and playing house - modifying Others culture in such a way to service and fulfill his own desires - was surely antithetical to the Others' true purpose, and was most likely what earned the Others' their fertility curse from the Island/Jacob. Richard said as much when he encouraged Locke to make a play for Ben's job. ''Ben has been wasting our time with novelties like fertility problems,'' Richard said. ''We're looking for someone to remind us that we're here for more important reasons.''
Widmore ordered Keamy to kill Alex, if needed, to remove Ben from the island. Ben visited Widmore off-island and threatened to retaliate by killing Widmore's daughter, Penny.

Widmore/ Miles history:
Widmore recruited Miles, with the mercenaries, to come to the island. At one point, Miles and his taco were kidnapped by Bram (from Ilana's crew) who tried to talk Miles out of taking the job and being on the wrong side.
Widmore/ Eloise Hawking's allegiance:
Ms. Hawking made sure Locke's corpse went back to the island, that he was a proxy for Christian Shephard. But by doing so, she helped Smokey use Locke's body.

Widmore also wanted Locke to return to the island. Are Widmore and Ms. Hawking working together? Maybe Widmore wanted Smokey to take the form of Locke so that he would recognize him once he arrived? Fighting is easier if you recognize the enemy, no?
We've believed that Ilana's people are pro-Jacob and the freighter/ mercenaries were pro-Widmore. If Widmore's in cahoots with Smokey, wouldn't it make sense that he's Smokey's way off the island, and if Flocke wasn't lying to Ben, that someone will lead the island when he leaves, perhaps he promised Widmore, if Widmore helped him, that he would get him back to the island and have him be the leader.

I guess what I'm trying to say here, whose side is everyone on?
Jacob told Hurley "someone's coming to the island and I need you to help them get here." Was Jacob referring to Widmore or someone else? Why would Jacob want Widmore to come to the island if Widmore facilitated Locke's body returning to the island, which in turn, gave Smokey a body to use? Remember that Widmore told Locke (after Locke turned the frozen wheel and ended up in the Tunisian Desert) "if you don't return, the wrong side will win."

4) Ilana:
She revealed that she is charged with protecting the candidates who will replace Jacob.
Ilana facilitated Ben's redemption by forgiving him/ accepting him into her group. This time, Ben made the right choice- fulfilling, perhaps, Jacob's dying hope that Ben had the capacity for change. Ben became the first person this season to turn down Flocke's bargain.

5) Flocke:
Perhaps Flocke wanted Ben to kill Ilana. He probably can't kill her himself, just like he couldn't kill Jacob or the candidates. Ilana is probably off limits, too, so Flocke was trying to manipulate Ben into killing her.
Did Ben kill Locke in the hotel room because he knew Locke couldn't kill himself? (Remember that Ben needed Locke dead to convince the other Losties to go back)
Flocke told Ben he was needed to guard the island after Flocke leaves... interesting because Flocke told Sawyer that it's just an island and doesn't need protecting.

6) Miles:
Reveals that Jacob knew Ben would kill him ("No, he cared. He was hoping he was wrong about you"). This goes against the original theory of Jacob knowingly accepting his own demise.

7) The Beach:
The "girlie" magazine from Sawyer's old tent had something about "mirrors" written in the bottom corner and also something about "getting to the bottom of things" (haha)

The Chosen (book from Sawyer's tent) - About father/ son relationships. Some themes: a son rebelling about taking his fathers place as rabbi, the validity of Faith in a world moving toward science, mankind's total destruction. One defining part of the book where the two main characters (young boys) first meet is at a baseball game where one boy tells the other boy that he "wanted to kill him" after a baseball injury.

Lapidus overslept and missed flying Oceanic 815
The reunion moment at the end - This moment was staged to deliberately echo the scene from the season 3 episode ''One Of Us,'' when Jack, Kate, and Sayid returned from Otherville, bringing Juliet with them. When the beach crew saw her everyone gave her the stink-eye (especially, ironically, Sawyer) - just like Jack and Ben traded suspicious looks in this week's episode.

[kaisersozei]

Two thoughts on last night's episode:

1) Awesome!


2) Holy hell, Charlotte is hot!

:tu

[Mr.Erskine]

The only reason I'm sticking with this series is because I've watched it from its inception... I'm still among the non-thrilled.

[OLS]

Seems like the writers are just making stuff up as they go along now. I know there's 9-10 episodes left.. but I definitely don't think we're going to be getting the "perfect ending" we're all hoping for.
I mentioned this type deal to a friend of mine yesterday, or day before. I told him that I had a sinking feeling that the real intent is to take a bunch of craps in a pile and light it on fire with gasoline and laugh as we all try to figure out what it means. Based on the episode earlier this week, I do not think they are going to have me locked in where they want me. I no longer feel like this is going to be must watch stuff. I watched this program since the second episode, and by ABC's skill at retro'ing everything, got to see what I had missed in the first episode almost immediately the next week. So I have seen it all and it just makes me angrier and angrier the deeper I get. The only thing making me watch now is that they moved it into the one desert night I had in the week, so I watch Lost or turn the TV off and watch the fish tank. LOST can cup my nuts.

[Skywalker]

I'm still lost but another hot chick appeared so I'm staying!!!;)

[OLS]

I used to frequent a Lost forum (4815162342.com) but the number of people there ......
Hehe, I remember back in Season 1 when I thought I had better get into a lost forum so I could float
my theories and have them on paper (cyberly-speaking) so that in the end when I turned out to be
right it would have a date stamp onit, lol. I shudder to think what a Lost forum is like nowadays.
It was a giant mess back THEN. I am afraid I couldn't contain myself.

[newcigarz]

LOST can cup my nuts.


:r

[OLS]

:r But did I mention I will watch every episode? Nut-cupping does not imply
not-watching, although they are spelled similarly.

[weak_link]

Frank Lupitas called, he said the plan is to load everyone up in the plane on Hydra Island, climb 30,000 feet and then nose dive back down into the island and kill everyone. The End.

[OLS]

Frank Lupitas called, he said the plan is to load everyone up in the plane on Hydra Island, climb 30,000 feet and then nose dive back down into the island and kill everyone. The End.Was I nuts or did I hear a reference to getting that airliner started and trying to leave the island on it last night??? Provided you could "fix" the jet, how could you take off?

[weak_link]

Was I nuts or did I hear a reference to getting that airliner started and trying to leave the island on it last night??? Provided you could "fix" the jet, how could you take off?

I was wondering the same thing although this is Lost! and there might be a 300 yard runway just past the tree line the losties missed for the past 7 seasons.

[OLS]

I was wondering the same thing although this is Lost! and there might be a 300 yard runway just past the tree line the losties missed for the past 7 seasons.
Hahah, true for sure. OK, so I DID hear that woman mention something like that.
I don't Tivo, and sometimes I am web surfing and peering over my glasses at the TV, so I never really know. I think I am going to watch the last three online tonight after Survivor.

My friend in Mississippi always says it's gonna turn out the Vincent is behind EVERYTHING.
That's the dog by the way, lol.

[kaisersozei]

I was wondering the same thing although this is Lost! and there might be a 300 yard runway just past the tree line the losties missed for the past 7 seasons.

Actually, there is a runway. It's what the Aljira flight landed on last season, that Sawyer/Kate were building while imprisoned in an earlier season.

Getting the plane to use it would be another matter, but there is a runway. ;)

[weak_link]

Actually, there is a runway. It's what the Aljira flight landed on last season, that Sawyer/Kate were building while imprisoned in an earlier season.

Getting the plane to use it would be another matter, but there is a runway. ;)

I forgot all about that, good point!

[OLS]

I KNEW I had missed a show. I remember the labor camp deal, but landing al jazeera must have slipped by. I think I casually blew LOST off last year. I missed alot.

[OLS]

I think what I like best about THIS "lost" forum is that everyone basically
is already vetted for ignorance, i.e. we all smoke cigars. There is really no guessing
at the gene pool at some of those websites. Even with me posting, it just seems safer
in here, lol.

[Mugen910]

LOST season 6, ep #7 "Recon"

1) Sawyer's flash-sideways
Liam Pace, Charlie's brother, was at the police station.When Miles served coffee at the police station, he took the black mug while giving Sawyer the white mug.

A big difference between island Sawyer and flash-sideways Sawyer: Detective James Ford was a terrible liar. Everyone could spot his tells. Everyone could see through his Steve McQueen cool: The grifter chick in the motel, Charlotte Lewis, his partner Miles.

It first appeared that Sawyer's flash-sideways wouldn't have a redemptive ending like the other Losties, but he ended up telling Miles the truth about Anthony Cooper because he knew Miles would try to talk him out of it. Whew!
Regardless of which world Sawyer is in he is destined to be law enforcement partners with Miles and pin Kate up against bars.
Charlotte: archeologist. What do archaeologists do? Dig up ruins of the past (Sawyer's family photo).

Kate's hoodie was conspicuous. In the episode ''The Long Con,'' the big twist was that Charlie had assisted Sawyer in his fake-crisis, fear-cultivating, gun-grabbing power coup. Charlie, wearing a hoodie, revealed that the only reason why he partnered with Sawyer was to humiliate Locke, who had humiliated him episodes earlier. Fittingly, ''Recon'' re-teamed redeemed Sawyer and Kate (now playing the Charlie role) in a bid to subvert Flocke.
Miles on island doesn't care about anyone else, Miles in flash-sideways cares, has a father, even has a girlfriend.
We got the impression that Anthony Cooper was a beloved father in Locke's flash-sideways, but still the bad guy in Sawyer's... what's up with that?
The books in Sawyer's room (incidentally, all three of the books were already introduced on LOST in previous episodes):

Watership Down - The novel is by Richard Adams (1972) and is a spoof of humans searching for a new home using a society of rabbits as characters. The rabbits find what they think is utopia - but discover that it is a farm with traps and snares and they have to live together or die alone while establishing new rules to live. On the island when Sawyer asked Kate what's for dinner she said "Rabbit, I think." A Wrinkle in Time - A sci-fi children's novel by Madeleine L'Engle (1962.) The story follows Meg Merry - a teenager who travels in time and space with her younger brother Charles Wallace and friend Calvin O'Keefe to rescue their father - who is a scientist being held prisoner by an evil force.
Lancelot - A novel by Walker Percy (1977). This is the story of Lancelot Lamar - an attorney who finds out he is not the father of his youngest daughter, then he kills his wife by blowing up their house. He ends up in a mental institution with his memories.... and reality and the past tend to get blurred for him.

Little House on the Prairie on Sawyer's TV - Pa Ingalls said "That's what life's all about - laughing and loving each other - and knowing that people aren't really gone when they die. We have all the good memories to sustain us until we see them again." HUGE hints here???So, can we assume that Sawyer never wrote that the letter to Anthony Cooper? That might mean that Jacob never existed in this reality or never gave young Sawyer that pen. It was, after all, Jacob who pushed him to finish the letter after his uncle warned him not to. Jacob nudged Sawyer down the path of obsessive vengeance, of becoming a con man rather than a law man. Are we seeing a world without Jacob? A world where our characters are free to live their own lives without this meddlesome entity and his damned island?

2) Flocke
Flocke told Claire that the Others took Aaron. It gave her a purpose.... having hate is better than having nothing. Perhaps it was the same thing that kept Smokey going when he was a prisoner for years... his hatred for Jacob. This theme was also echoed in Sawyer's anger/ enemy/ hatred toward Anthony Cooper.Was Flocke just channeling John Locke when he told Kate about his crazy mother? What were the ''growing pains'' he referred to? Maybe his mother had the sickness when Smokey was a boy or when she was pregnant with him, resulting in what happened to him.

3) Flocke's assignment for Sawyer
Why didn't Flocke just "smokey" over to Hydra Island to do the recon himself, instead of Sawyer. Maybe this has to do with him crossing the water. During the ep "Dead is Dead", Flocke took his shoes off during the canoe ride over to the main island, and put them back on when he reached the dock. Also, Ben released a drain plug to call Smokey. So, if Flocke can't touch water somehow, why did we see a resurrected John Locke standing ankle-deep in the ocean right after the crash of Ajira 316? I'm not sure what the deal is with him and water, but something definitely seems fishy."Do whatever you can to gain their trust, find out what you can about them, and then get back here." Now where have we heard that before? Ben said it to Goodwin when 815 crashed. I love how this show reuses dialogue lines.Last week Flocke told Ben to head to Hydra Island. This week he told his group that they might not leave their present camp for a couple days, whereas he told Ben to ditch (and kill) Ilana and head for Hydra Island. If Ben had killed Ilana and made his way to Hydra Island, he would have fallen right into Widmore's clutches. Was Flocke setting Ben up to be captured by Widmore or to be killed when Flocke/ Smokey killed the remaining Ajira passengers.If Flock continues channeling his subconscious John Locke ("Don't tell me what I can't do!" and "I had a crazy mother") that sub is going to get blown up.

4) Widmore
Does Widmore really want to kill Flocke (as Sawyer assumed)? Why, then, was he helping Locke return to the island when Locke turned the frozen wheel?
Sawyer was escorted to see Widmore on the sub and noticed a locked door. Remembered how Anthony Cooper had been brought to the Island via sub by the Others - and how John Locke had tricked Sawyer into killing him. FUN FACT! A ''locked room mystery'' is perhaps the oldest identified genre of mystery fiction. The oldest ''locked room mystery'' on record: ''Bel and the Dragon,'' an apocryphal Biblical text, in which a famous prophet debunked a false god by... sprinkling a perimeter of ash around a room. The name of this prophet? Daniel.

5) Claire
Her behavior is very child-like. Maybe the sickness is that you get mentally "reset" to when you were a kid. Examples, she's had quick bouts of anger, then shows remorse later (hugging Kate and crying), holds Kate's hand when Flocke gives his speech, playing with a doll, essentially. Is this what the sickness reduces you to? Sayid just watched while Claire tried to kill Kate... freaky.

6) What's next
Remember when Jack told Kate he had taken piloting lessons? I wonder if those are going to come in handy with the Ajira plane???Remember the mysterious "other Others" who shot at Sawyer, Locke, Juliet, Miles, Daniel and Charlotte during their canoe trip to the Orchid? They returned some shots, but flashed away before they could figure out who was shooting at them. I bet we are going to see the other side of that scene soon!Next week we FINALLY get Richard's story.

FUN THEORY FROM DOC JENSEN AT ENTERTAINMENT WEEKLY: The legend of the Fisher King - the guardian of the Holy Grail, or enchanted spring - holds that there are two custodians at any one time. There is a king, and there is a knight. Sometimes they are father and son. For some reason, the natural order of things requires the Fisher King to have an infirmity that makes him incapable of moving. He has an injury to his leg, foot, or groin. The job of the Grail Knight is to heal the Fisher King. But alas, Grail Knights are known to get distracted by selfishness or missions of vengeance and neglect their duty to the Fisher King. When this happens, the kingdom becomes infertile. No flowers; no babies. Oh, and the abode where the king and knight live pops in and out of reality, at different times and places. One more thing? The Fisher King is called the Fisher King because he fishes (like Jacob?). A lot. Mostly to pass the boring time guarding the grail. THEORY! Jacob was the Fisher King. Smokey was his knight. Smokey became disenchanted, neglected his duties, wanted out, conspired to kill the Fisher King to earn that freedom.

[Mugen910]

LOST: Charles Widmore refresher and other things

Facts to remember about Charles Widmore:

He was an Other, even in a position of authority at one time.

We saw him as a teenager (age 17) when Richard Alpert was in charge. This was when Locke time traveled back to 1954 and talked with Richard at the Other's camp (Episode: The Life and Death of Jeremy Bentham).

He sent the freighter to the Island, was the one who gave Keamy and crew their orders (find Ben Linus, kill everyone else), and therefore is partially responsible for Alex's death.

He tried to get Sun to kill Ben.

He purchased the Black Rock journal at an auction (Tovard Hanso owned the journal at one point, the journal was discovered in 1852 among the artifacts of pirates on an island off the coast of Madagascar, the Black Rock was a 19th century British vessel).

He encouraged Locke to get everyone to go back to the Island (We know that Smokey promises people what they want most. Widmore seems to want control of the Island, and in fact believes he is the rightful leader of the Others. Perhaps Smokey promised Widmore that he could control the island if he helps Smokey get off the island???)

He's the father of Penny Widmore (mother unknown) and Daniel Faraday (mother Eloise Hawking).

Some lingering questions:


Why did Widmore purchase the Black Rock journal at the auction? To help him find the island?

Now that we know what we know, we could infer that Widmore was working with Smokey and therefore knew the plan to take over Locke's body, which is why he sent Locke back ... or at least knew that all of Jacob's candidates were needed back on the Island in order for Smokey to be able to 1) kill Jacob, 2) kill all of his possible replacements, and then 3) do whatever it is he intends to do -- leave, blow up the place, etc.

Why has Widmore been searching for the Island? To exploit its magical properties?

Why did Widmore assemble a fake crash of Oceanic 815 on the ocean floor? So the search would end, thereby preventing someone else from finding the island?

What are "the rules?" Ben wanted to kill Widmore but couldn't because of the "rules." We've heard reference to those rules again and again and they seem related to who can/can't or should/ shouldn't be killed.

Why was Widmore determined to bring the Oceanic 6 back to the island? Did it help him find it? Does he need those people there to be part of the war?

LOST fun: :)

A message board is having a guessing game about what's behind the locked door in Widmore's sub. Some of the guesses have been:


Shannon's ghost

The missing hairbrushes from Oceanic 815 (Season 1 - remember how the girls couldn't find hairbrushes in the luggage?)

More blue tarps (since people have thought it was weird how many blue tarps
the Losties found for the beach camp!)

Mr. Friendly in sequined spandex tights

The statues' 5th toe

Jimmy Hoffa

Widmore's MacCutcheon whiskey, locked up to keep Desmond away from it

Jack's tears

[white_s2k]

Yawn

[weak_link]

Too much filler, not enough meat.

[kugie]

Last Nights not so good. But I am liking the lead up to the final Battle.

??? Who will take Jacobs Place.
My Guess is Jack

[dannysguitar]

Yeah, they sure seem to be making Jack seem like the new Jacob, but I think it will be someone a little less expected.

I really liked last night's episode. There is a huge war on the horizon...

[weak_link]

Hurley is going to be the new Jacob.

[mosesbotbol]

Hurley is going to be the new Jacob.

I have heard a few others say the same thing. Who knows? As soons as I think I have grip on what's going, a new angle hits me.

[white_s2k]

Any new notes on the last 2 episodes? Interested to see what the internets has to say about the Richard episode!

[Mugen910]

very sorry guys..I will try to post something up tomorrow.

[weak_link]

I only picked Hurley because of who, on the surface, appears least likely to assume the role of Jacob. The 'new' Hurley seems a lot more self assured and he seems to be the only one that can see everyone on the island.
Also, if the man in black can appear as dead people and turn into a bad ass smoke monster thing, what can Jacob do? He said he doesn't like to directly intervene so does that mean you don't get any smokey-type superpowers? But then he gave Richard the 'gift' of eternal life. Will the candidate inherit potential superpowers or do they already have whatever they are going to get? Maybe they have them, they just don't know how to use them yet? Maybe you get some cool stuff, like prizes. Congrats, you win a lighthouse with cool mirrors you can spy on people with...oh wait scratch the lighthouse. You do get some, to be disclosed at a later time and place, cool stuff. I feel like a cat chasing my tail.

Still think there needs to be more of a distilled story at this point in the series. Sidebars and human interest pieces are great but just as they advertised, I want answers. In the five or six episodes that are left it would be nice if they began to tie all together but something tells me they are just going to string things along until the last episode and try and cover as much ground as possible in a two hour special and hope for the best. Pretty present with a bow on top or soggy cardboard box with old spaghetti and meat sauce inside? Guess we'll know in a couple weeks.

[Mugen910]

LOST season 6, ep #8 "Ab Aeterno"

1. Richard's pre-island story
The doctor tells Richard that his wife's cross is worthless, a not so subtle jab at the idea of religion being ultimately worthwhile for Richard, and another case of man of science vs man of faith.

Richard hails from the Canary Islands. Over the course of the Canary Islands' history, people claimed to have seen a vanishing and reappearing eighth island. So there you go, the number 8, and a mysterious island. And the Canary Islands were the location of a famous plane crash in 1977, the year of the Incident in the LOST universe.
Richard and Isabella lived on the largest Canary Islands, Tenerife. (Tenerife is known for its ancient pyramids believed by some to be a link between Egyptian and Mayan cultures).
The passage Richard was reading in jail from the Gospel of Luke concerns Jesus rejecting the Devil's temptations, which is obviously relevant to the episode.
Notice how the doctor and priest wore black, while Richard wore white.

2. The Black Rock
What we were previously told - The Black Rock set sail from Portsmouth, England on March 22, 1845 on a trading mission to the kingdom of Siam, when she was tragically lost at sea. The only known artifact of this journey is a journal, which was discovered among the artifacts of pirates on the Ile Sante-Marie off the coast of Madagascar seven years later (1852). This constitutes a discrepancy because in Richard's flashback we were shown the date of 1867.

Another note about the date error is that we know there was dynamite on the ship. Alfred didn't invent dynamite until 1864 and didn't patent it until 1867. Maybe this is simply a writers' error to try to fix a past dating error?

It's possible that the owner/captain of the Black Rock wanted it to appear that the ship had been lost at sea in 1845, so that it could carry on possible illegal/secret voyages. It would have been simple enough to leave a journal on some far-flung island where it wouldn't be found for years.
After officer Jonas Whitfield killed the other slaves, was killed by Smokey, and Smokey killed everyone else, Richard was the only one from the Black Rock left. So how did the journal get off the island and make it's way into Hanso's hands, and eventually Charles Widmore's?
Hanso was never actually seen on screen. He died when the ship crashed, and he was (presumably) buried near the wreckage by the remaining officers before Smokey killed them all, just like it says on the blast door map at the Swan Hatch (see attached map, bottom right corner).

Richard said he wanted to go to the New World. America wasn't exactly a New World in the 1860s. However, Australia is very much still a "new world" in the 1860s. Gold had been discovered in the 50s, and certain Australian colonies were experiencing gold rushes. It seems plausible that Hanso was headed to Australia to get rich working his slaves in the mines. This would of course also explain how the Black Rock crashed on an island we know to be in the middle of the Pacific (if you sailed from the Canary Islands to America, you wouldn't cross the Pacific, but you would if your destination was Australia).

According to the texts of LOST, Magnus Hanso was an ancestor of Alvar Hanso, the financier behind The Dharma Initiative.
Upon arriving at the island, Richard saw the statue Taweret: the Egyptian goddess of pregnancy and childbirth, a former bad girl goddess who redeemed herself and helped keep the god of evil Set in check.

3. Richard's on-island story
Smokey told Richard the island is Hell and Jacob is the Devil. It seems that he used language from that era which Richard understood, from a time when people were devoted to religion and believed in absolutes.

Richard essentially creates his own job by telling Jacob that if Jacob doesn't interfere, Smokey will. In that respect, Richard becomes "the cause of his own suffering." (just like we were told by the brainwashing in Room 23!)

4. Smokey
Smokey's past manifestations: those not buried on the island: Harper (Goodwin's wife), Dave (Hurley's friend), Isabella, Walt, Eko's drug dealers, Locke. Those buried on the island: Christian, Yemi, Alex.

During the season 3 episode "The Cost of Living", Smokey appeared as ghosts of the drug dealers Eko killed with his machete. Perhaps he acquired images of those ghosts from Eko's past after scanning him, much like he was able to take the form of Isabella after scanning Richard (and taking Isabella's cross). So, that being said... what's all this business about hiding bodies, and Richard asking young Ben whether his dead mother he saw died on the Island?
Why does it seem like Smokey is incapable of drinking or eating? Is it because Jacob "took his body?" Smokey didn't eat boar along with Richard. He didn't drink along with Jacob. He didn't eat the fish with Jacob in the season 5 finale, either. Why did Jacob even ask Smokey if he wanted to eat fish? Is Jacob some sorta smart-ass???

Smokey presents Richard with a knife and instructs him to go to the statue and kill Jacob without letting him speak. These were the exact same instructions that Dogen gave Sayid in "Sundown". It is also the same knife. (see attached photos)

From Smokey's perspective, the island is Hell. It's his eternal prison. And Jacob, his prison keeper, is the Devil, a devil that has robbed Smokey of his humanity and identity. This plays right into the Biblical story of brothers Esau and Jacob, as Esau stole Jacob's birth right and inheritance by tricking him with a bowl of soup. "He can be very persuasive," Smokey warned Richard. That's may be coming from someone who was once fooled by Jacob, and now regrets it.
"Do you ever want to see your wife again?'' Smokey asks Richard. His utilitarian logic is located in the broad, contentious body of thought known as ''Consequentialism.'' A weakness of ''Consequentialism'' is its shaky, nebulous definition of justice. A major philosopher in the field of consequentialism? Jeremy Bentham (also the name Charles Widmore gave John Locke before his death).

Richard gave Smokey a gift from Jacob: a white stone, which may be nothing more than an inside joke, an ironic declaration of victory (I won Richard's soul! Nah-nah-nah! Again, Jacob the smartass?) punning off of Black Rock. (Get it? Black Rock the ship and an actual black rock)

5. Hurley
Hurley seems to be the new Richard... messenger of Jacob

6. Jacob
Why won't Jacob touch Ilana (wears gloves during visit)? The gloves are an obvious precaution against him touching her, even by accident.
Jacob seems to have a lot of faith that both Jack and Richard will discover what it is they need to do on their own.

Jacob makes it seem like the island is Pandora's box: although it contained a whole host of evil, it also contained hope.

Jacob doesn't promise Richard his wife back, telling him simply "I can't do that". This seems out of place; according to Dogen, Jacob promised to restore Dogen's son's life in return for service on the island. Jacob seems inconsistent.

Jacob said he gives everyone a clean slate when they come to the island. Meanwhile, it has been made clear that Smokey judges people on their past.

In relation to the Man of Science vs Man of Faith theme, if Jacob is Man of Faith then this may shed light on why he said to Ben "What about you?" before Ben stabbed him. Ben hails from the Dharma Initiative (Man of Science).

After Jacob beat the crap out of Richard, he somewhat "baptized" Richard (in the ocean) into Team Jacob.

Richard asked a crucial question: Why doesn't Jacob take a more active role in shepherding his spiritual reclamation projects? ''Because I want them to help themselves. To be able to tell the difference between right and wrong without me having to tell them, it's all meaningless if I have to force them to do anything! Why should I have to step in?'' Richard's reply: ''If you don't, he will.''

[Mugen910]

LOST season 6, ep #9 "The Package"

1. Sun/ Jin flash-sideways
Title "The Package" could reference the watch Jin was delivering, Sun's bun in the oven, or Desmond on the sub.

At the hotel, before Sun answered the knock on the door, she checked her face in the mirror, making her the latest flash-sideways character to do so.
Flash-sideways/ island time affecting each other theory: On-island Sun is knocked out cold, and off-island Sun is just waking up. We've seen this happen many times, including when Jack gets put under anesthesia for his on-island appendectomy and immediately wakes up in the Oceanic Six time-line. Unconsciousness has been associated with enlightenment. It's worked as a transition between scenes and storylines... but what if it also acts as a transition between worlds? Remember sleeping Claire waking up in her flashback car crash during the episode "Par Avion?" Remember Desmond hitting his head on the freighter and waking up in one of his flashes? Also, if you believe Jin's infertility was healed by the island, this could be even more evidence of the time-lines affecting each other. Flash-sideways Jin has never been to the island, yet somehow he's able to father a child. This could be chalked up as one of the things that are simply 'different' in the sideways time-line, or you could take it to mean there was island influence.

2. Sun loses her ability to communicate
There has been one other instance on LOST in which a character mysteriously lost the ability to communicate verbally. The episode was ''Further Instructions,'' and the victim was Locke himself. The Island had taken away his speech in the aftermath of the Hatch explosion as a kind of punishment for his big season 2 sin: Straying from his Island mission and becoming obsessed with pushing the Button. Perhaps Sun was stripped of her English for similar reasons. After all, in the island time-line she learned the language in order to run away from Jin. Moreover, she learned it from a man that became her lover. Sun's English had once saved her husband from the false charge of setting fire to the raft. It helped her build bridges with the castaways. Regardless, she doesn't need it anymore. Her future is in Korea, with her husband, with her daughter, and with a mother and father that need her forgiveness. So maybe losing her English was a movement of the Island to reminder her of who she is - and what she needs redemption for.
Perhaps Flocke was able to force Sun to channel herself in the other reality, where she doesn't know English. If Flocke has that power, we might have seen a glimpse of how the flash-sideways could ultimately factor in to the island time-line. Flocke might be the link between these two realities. This theory is based on the assumption/ guess that the two time lines are bleeding into each other.

Perhaps it's because Sun declined Flocke's offer to join his team and he knew she'd try to talk her friends out the plan - which she did try to do. Either that, or Flocke wasn't thinking short term at all by taking away Sun's English, but rather was planting a seed designed that will bare him fruit down the road when Team Richard executes its plan. In other words: maybe Sun's loss of English will prove costly at a pivotal point down the road.

3. Flocke
Flocke demonstrates once again that he has access to the real John Locke's memories by quoting Widmore's speech to the real John Locke: "a war is coming."

If water is an obstacle to Flocke, keeping him contained, what does that mean for the flash-sideways where we see the entire island underwater?

4. Keamy and his goons
When Keamy needed a translator he said to call ''Danny's friend'' (sideways version of Danny Pickette the dead Other?)... enter Mikhail Bakunin. We used to call him Patchy. :) Mikhail Bakunin is named after the historical Mikhail Bakunin, a philosopher and anarchist who believed in non-violent revolution and the abolishment of all government and religion. Remember when Jin and Mikhail fought on the island? It seems that Jin's always destined to get the best of Mikhail, and Mikhail is always fated to lose an eye.

The walk-in fridge, where Omar bangs Jin's head on the way in. "C'mon Omar, you gotta be more careful than that..." For a guy about to 'pop' someone, didn't Keamy seem overly concerned about what happened here? Was he just looking to keep things neat and tidy, or was Keamy concerned that Jin might go unconscious on them? On LOST unconsciousness = enlightenment. People pass out, get knocked out, or go to sleep, then we get a flash (sideway, back, or forward) where they experience something revealing or enlightening.
There is a hot debate over what Keamy said to Jin as he was tying Jin's hands. Some people think they heard Keamy say "Just in case you figure out what's about to happen ON THE ISLAND... can't have you freaking out". I think he just stumbled saying the word "I" after I re-watched the scene... "Just in case you figure out what's about to happen to ya, I-I can't have you freaking out" but the debate continues!

Keamy, speaking calmly in English - Jin had no idea that Keamy was telling him he was going to kill him. In other words, Keamy's brainwashing cooler in Los Angeles = the Room 23 brainwashing room on Hydra Island, which we visited during Island Jin's storyline. Note here that the only other time we saw Room 23 in use was when Karl was being punished by Ben for... dating his daughter Alex. Therefore, sideways Jin + Sun = Island Karl + Alex (both of whom were shot and killed by... Island Keamy and Omar).
When Keamy is locking Jin in the walk-in fridge he makes reference to the heart ("the heart wants what it wants"), a reference that parallels his own connection to the heart-monitor bomb he hooked himself up to.

5. Sayid
Sayid's motivation for joining Flocke: he wanted to see Nadia again. This was back when he had feelings, however. Without such emotions, will he still remain loyal to Flocke?

In the flash-sideways Sayid refused to cut Jin free, but still provided him with a means to do so. This repeats the "Moth" motif (the episode when Locke enabled Charlie to refuse heroin, but didn't directly help him) we've seen, allowing a character to experience personal struggle along the way to freedom or enlightenment. Also, remember Locke gave Boone the knife to cut himself free during the episode "Hearts and Minds."
Why doesn't Sayid feel anything? No pain, emotion, anger, etc?

6. Bridget's AWESOME theory
We already know that Desmond's consciousness has bounced around in time. Desmond is currently drugged. Sayid is numb, can't feel anything...wait for it... Desmond is currently consciousness traveling within Sayid! That's why Sayid can't feel anything, he's been drugged! That's why they looked at each other so strangely on the dock... they are seeing themselves! I love it! Thanks Bridget!!!!

7. Charles Widmore
Widmore's plan mimics his Season Four plan - bring scientists to the island to investigate strange properties - no mercenaries this time. We know where 2 of the electromagnetic pockets are: At the Swan Hatch and the Orchid Station.

8. Desmond
As Daniel Faraday pointed out in season 5, Desmond is "uniquely special". The [time travel] rules don't apply to him.
Previews for next week - background music: Amazing Grace - Written by John Newton, published in 1779, has a message of forgiveness and redemption, Newton wrote the words from personal experience. He grew up without any particular religious conviction but his life's path was formed by a variety of twists and coincidences that were often put into motion by his recalcitrant insubordination. He was pressed into the Royal Navy and became a sailor, eventually participating in the slave trade. One night a terrible storm battered his ship so severely that he became frightened enough to call out to God for mercy, a moment that marked the beginning of his spiritual conversion. His career in slave trading lasted a few years more until he quit going to sea altogether and began studying theology.

9. Damon Lindelof's (show's exec producer) Twitter post
Yesterday, Damon posted this on his twitter page: "In one week the conversation is going to change." Intriguing, no?

10. Theory
Everyone is going to end up at the hospital in LA: Jin will take Sun there (gun shot wound), Claire (getting baby checked out), Jack works there, Sawyer and Miles have to investigate a possible gun shot victim (and they still have Kate with them). It feels like this scenario is being set up, but for what purpose?

[dannysguitar]

Desmond!

[weak_link]

Was Des on the list? Why didn't he fry?

[Mugen910]

LOST: Eloise Hawking refresher

1954: Eloise Hawking is on the Island, known as Ellie, and seems to have some sort of standing in the Others' community. She leads Daniel to Jughead, where he tells her how to bury the bomb to prevent its leaks from destroying a good chunk of the Island.

1977: Twenty-three years later, she's still on the Island, and in enough of a power position that a member of the Others actively questions Richard's decision to take Ben to the temple without her knowledge. When Daniel Faraday comes looking for her to find the location of Jughead's burial site, she shoots him in the back without seeing his face. As the man fell, he realized that he had been shot by Eloise, and whispered to her that she had "known it the whole time." Confused, she asked him who he was, and he revealed that he was her son leaving her standing over him, shocked. Eloise then helped Daniel's friends by trying to detonate a hydrogen bomb, in an effort to change the future.

Between 1977 and 1996: At a later date (likely 1978 as Daniel has a birth certificate), Eloise left the Island and moved to Essex, Massachusetts, where she delivered and raised her son Daniel Faraday, fully aware that he would die at her hands after traveling back to the 1970s. Off the Island, she stunts Daniel's musical gifts in favor of his mathematical prowess. She ensures that his mind is singularly focused on academia, pushing aside all other distractions. She's surprised to learn upon Daniel's graduation from Oxford that Charles Widmore has given Daniel a $1.5 million grant for his research, and gives him a journal as a graduation present.

1996: Eloise worked at the store where Desmond went to buy an engagement ring for Penny during his first time shift after he turned the failsafe key. When Eloise showed him a ring and Desmond told her he would take it, she seemed upset and responded by telling him he would not. After Desmond refused to give the ring back she explained to Desmond that she knows his name, he will break Penny's heart, he will not marry Penny, instead entering the sailing race to prove Penny’s father wrong, and he will go to the island and press the button for three years until forced to turn the failsafe key. She said that if he "doesn't do those things," that "every single one of us is dead." She explains that pushing the button in the Swan Hatch is the only great thing Desmond will ever do. She teaches him about the concept of course correction before Desmond's mind returns to the Island after the Swan's implosion. During this meeting with Desmond, Eloise was wearing a pin, an ouroboros, a circular serpent with its tail in its mouth, a symbol in alchemy representing life as a cycle. But this particular one wasn't eating its tail.

2004: After Daniel's visit from Widmore, she visits her son and convinces him to go on the Kahana, the freighter taking mercenaries, scientists and Michael to the island.

2008: From within the Lamp Post, she determines the location of the Island for a brief window of time. She uses Ben Linus to help gather the Oceanic 6 to board Ajira Airways 316 to recreate the conditions of the Oceanic 815 crash. When Desmond refuses to go along, she warns him that the Island is not done with him. Later, after Ben shoots Desmond at the marina, Eloise visits Penny at the hospital to apologize for her son's involvement in this event. Outside the hospital, she and Charles Widmore talk of sacrifice and their son. When Charles calls Daniel his son, Eloise slaps him and leaves in a cab.

[Mugen910]

Was Des on the list? Why didn't he fry?

He's just special Eric...Not short bus special but that out of body sideways flash special.

[mosesbotbol]

My girlfriend in enamoured (as probably all our better half's) with Sayid & Sawyer. Have to admit they are handsome, but so are all the women on the show.

[OLS]

Even with all the BS you've been through on this wrap-up season, you still watch LOST? I thought I
was a glutton for punishment. :D

[Skywalker]

I only have one deep thing to say, "We are everybody!!!"

[Mugen910]

LOST season 6, ep #10 "Happily Ever After"


UPDATE FROM MY FRIEND!!!



This week’s episode (sorry this is so long, but there is so much fun information/ speculation/ theorizing that I love to consider and share!!!):



Fun fact to remember

* Desmond used to work at a monastery. Remember what his job was? Corking wine bottles.



George, the limo driver

· He's George Minkowski, the radio operator from the freighter who died after having the same experiences as Desmond in season 4… time travel flashes/ consciousness moving around in time. It was Minkowski who helped Desmond and Sayid get to the communication room so Desmond could call Penny. He died in Desmond's arms, a victim of time travel sickness; his mind had come unstuck in time and yo-yo'd between periods until his brain became mush.

* Suspiciously, can seem to get Desmond whatever Desmond wants (women, alcohol, flight manifests)



Seamus (the scientist) who spoke to Angstrom (the bunny)



* Did you recognize Seamus from the 80s sitcom “Kate and Allie?” I didn’t either, until it was pointed out to me, but he played the son Chip. See attached photos…



Charlie Pace



* Charlie still evades death for the time being (choked on heroin bag in airplane, walking across a busy street, drowning in a car).

· Charles and Desmond share drink and conversation in a bar called Jax, an Australian-themed pub.

· Charlie revealed that contrary to what we may have thought, he did not try to commit suicide by overdosing on the plane. He wanted to hide the drugs from the Marshall on the plane and choked while trying to swallow them. A theory! The rapturous blonde beauty he saw himself with, loving forever, was not Claire, but his season 2 Island temptress: the heroin-stuffed Virgin Mary statues. The painted hair? Blonde. The robes? Sky blue.

· Desmond wasn't buying it all the “love” talk that Charlie gave. ''That's poetry,'' Desmond cracked about Charlie's story. ''You should write a song about it.'' Actually, in another life, Charlie did write a song about redeeming love: ''Saved,'' the song Island Charlie wrote in his last-gasp bid to save Drive Shaft from disintegration. The season 2 Charlie-centric episode ''Fire + Water'' — memorable for its surreal, religiously-charged dream sequence (Hurley as Jesus; Claire as the Virgin Mary) and the ''You All Every Butties'' diaper commercial — gave us this bit of lyrics: ''All alone, I try to be invincible/Together now, we can be saved.''

· Desmond tries to save Charlie from drowning just like in the season 3 episode at the Looking Glass underwater station. NOT PENNY’S BOAT. Yikes.

· Both Charlie and Desmond had flashes of their island-life time line during near-death experiences.

· Remember when Charlie was down in the looking glass section, he was told that the code was programmed by a musician? We assumed it was Charlie from the past who programmed it, but could that musician be Faraday?

Desmond in flash-sideways

· Oceanic Airlines logo behind the glass of a video screen showing arrivals and departures of inbound and outbound consciousness — err, I mean flights. We saw Desmond's reflection in the glass (another flash-sideways’ character’s reflection).

· Desmond, to Claire, said he'd want to know the baby’s gender if he was pregnant. He said, ''I don't like surprises” … which is what Flocke told Sawyer last week, explaining his decision to send Sayid to do recon at Widmore’s camp.

· Desmond’s license plate was the same as Jack’s and Nadia’s in their flash-sideways.

· Desmond's wedding ring (see attached photo). Desmond had a wedding ring on his finger when Jack saw him on the plane… in this week’s episode he clearly wasn’t married. Is the island reality leaking into the flash-sideways reality

· Nurse Tyra that Desmond asked to give him Charlie's room number is the same woman that played nurse Susie at Santa Rosa in the original timeline. She gave Hurley his pills. See attached photos.

Daniel (Faraday) Widmore

· EEEEE!!! Daniel has his own LOST theory! J His theory: he and Desmond (and many others) are not living the lives they're supposed to be living — a consequence, he believed, of creating a new reality by detonating a nuclear bomb. ''I don't want to set off a nuclear bomb, Mr. Hume,'' Daniel said. ''I think I already did.''

· Penny is still Daniel’s half-sister in the flash-sideways, but this time his parents are married to each other.

· Daniel says he took the physics equation he wrote to a friend who was a math wiz at Cal Tech. In the online game The Lost Experience, it was reveled that Thomas Mittelwerk, a chief of technology for the Hanso Foundation who overthrew Alvar Hanso to take over the group that helped create the Dharma Initiative, went to Cal Tech.

Charles Widmore



* Did you notice the picture in Widmore's office - balanced scale with the white / black stones (see attached photo)



Eloise (Widmore) Hawking



* Eloise said to Desmond… “You got what you wanted” (a better relationship with Charles Widmore). It wasn't time for him to start questioning about Penny yet. Daniel was a musician, what he had really wanted. Others may have what they wanted also. For example, Kate may actually be innocent it this "reality"; Jack has a son; Dogan is with his son; Hurly is "lucky"; Locke is comfortable with his life and has Helen; Charlie is a rock star again; Nadia is alive; Claire is with her baby. It is as though they have their lives back and still have the potential to be with the ones they love. See theory at the end of the email for more on this…
* Eloise: ''Someone has clearly affected the way you see things. This is a serious problem. It is, in fact, a violation.'' Eloise definitely seemed to understand the origin, purpose, and more importantly the rules of the sideways world. She also seemed to have knowledge or vision for what should be happening and when, and Desmond's search for Penny threatened the implicit order she scolded him for wanting more than what he always wanted: Charles Widmore's approval. This landed like a newsflash for Desmond. ''How do you know what I want?'' he demanded. ''I just bloody do!'' See theory at the end of the email for more on this…

Penny

* In the flash-sideways, her last name is Milton (a shout-out to Paradise Lost author-poet John Milton?)

Desmond’s change in attitude/ stopping Flocke from leaving

· Have the candidates been nothing more than a distraction? Is Desmond the true threat to Flocke - The Constant - Jacob's heir apparent? Is Desmond both the Constant and the Variable, a wild card - something Flocke wasn't expecting? Afterall, Widmore said that Desmond will have to make a sacrifice.

· Desmond faints when he touches Penny’s hand and his mind transitions unconsciously into the island timeline. We’ve seen him do this before. He’s the only one who the rules don’t apply to. Maybe it's his exposure to electromagnetic radiation - in both timelines (hatch implosion and the MRI) - that allows this to happen?

· Desmond wants the Oceanic 815 flight manifest. Why? Is he going to "course correct?” He came out of the last consciousness flash as a man-on-a-mission. This may explain why he was so willing to go with Sayid. Desmond has already seen the end so he just goes along with everything. Because whatever happens, happens.

Watchmen

· If you’ve read Watchmen or seen the movie, here is a correlation between Dr. Manhattan/ Flocke and Dr. Manhattan/ Desmond that is interesting: “My comic book-soaked brained recalled Watchmen and the story of Jon Osterman, a physicist who was accidentally locked in a room and bombarded with energy that removed the ''intrinsic field'' that held his being together and became unglued... only to reconstruct himself through sheer force of disembodied will into an omniscient, omnipotent Nietzschean Ubermench capable of experiencing past, present and future all at one. He became a superman. Codename: Dr. Manhattan. The problem? He found himself stripped of his humanity, neither needing nor wanting companionship or love. The story of Dr. Manhattan should remind you of the Man In Black, who told us in ''Ab Aeterno'' that his humanity had also been stripped from him, hence his smoky physique. But it should also remind you of Desmond's Sideways story in ''Happily Ever After,'' for it told us the tale of a man considered something of a super-stud by the culture, but suffering from a malaise of emotional detachment.

Theory that Eloise is working with Flocke

Did Eloise help Flocke create the loophole? Go back and re-watch the scene in "The Variable" in which she stops Daniel from playing the piano. She emerges from her kitchen, almost as if she's just had a conversation with someone. Re-watch every action of adult Eloise and reconfigure it as a way to get her son back in her arms, EVEN IT MEANS UNDOING REALITY TO DO SO, and things make a lot of sense. Did she make a deal with Flocke? Help him as long as she can have her son back? By pushing Faraday harder than ever to conceive of the Jughead plan, she in turn created the possibility for Flocke's escape, which in turn offered her the chance to be with Daniel again. We've seen Flocke promise people what they want, over and over again, only to see the cracks in his promises show in the flash-sideways. Think of this sideways timeline like "The Matrix": sure as hell feels real, but it's simply a smokescreen (pun intended), a false world that masks the real one.

Theory summary: The sideways world is one dreamed up by Flocke with Eloise's help, unwittingly executed by Widmore, with Sideways Desmond now the wild card about to show some of his Oceanic 815 buddies a thing or two about what it feels like to be truly alive, to truly live in the real reality.

Eloise seems keen to keep the timelines totally separate, as evidenced by her brooch of the parallel lines and the twin stars… the lines do not intersect. See attached photo.

Another theory re: what Eloise and Widmore want/ are trying to facilitate:

Look at the way Widmore speaks to Desmond in his office. He talks about being blessed to "have him in his employ" and speaks about how "indispensable" Desmond is. He even goes normal praise, making sure to reinforce how happy Desmond should be to be free from commitments and attachments.

Widmore is pulling the wool over flash-sideways Desmond's eyes. He needs him to not question things, and to not dig too deeply into any emotions that might remind him of his prior life with Penny. This gets reiterated by Eloise later during her own conversation with Desmond. Flash-sideways Widmore and Hawking remain on the team that wants to keep things status quo.

Like Widmore, Eloise is doing everything to keep Desmond from remembering things. Eloise continues with something even more revealing: that Desmond should be happy because he has a "perfect life" and the one thing he always wanted: her husband's approval. The idea that she would know this seems to span both time lines, because it's within the island-based universe that Desmond sought Widmore's blessing. It also shows a serious error in judgment in thinking this was the one thing Desmond wanted most of all. Naturally, that honor would go to Penny.

Charlie stepped beyond the scope of the rules to show Desmond. He didn't allow Desmond the choice to see things for himself, he flat out took control of the situation and gave him the answer. There is another life they are supposed to be living. This overt display by Charlie was the violation that Eloise spoke of.

Does this verify that people outside of the 'game' - people who've died or gone over to the other side - are somehow in the know about things (Christian Shepherd, Richard’s wife Isabella)? Up until now, we've only seen these people permitted to push or nudge things in the right direction. Here however, Charlie wipes his ass with the rulebook. He shows Desmond his hand, sits back in his seat, satisfied that he conveyed his message, expecting to die as he knows he's supposed to. And for one last time, Desmond saves him.

So let's deconstruct this for a moment. The fact that Desmond's pre- flash-sideways needs have been taken into consideration seems to indicate we're seeing a manufactured reality. Someone or something has constructed the flash-sideways universe based upon what it thought Desmond - and possibly every other character - would want.

Just take a look at Daniel, now a musician. Certainly his mother would remember her young son's only desire was to play the piano, and now we see him placated by having grown into a talented pianist. The only problem is that Daniel is not happy or placated, because running into Charlotte has reminded him of his past life. This causes him to go physics-happy all over a perfectly good notebook, prompting an investigation of his own.

So who created this new universe? We've assumed Juliet facilitated it, setting off Jughead with that rock. Yet someone has definitely stacked the deck here. Someone with intimate knowledge (or scanning?) of our main characters has tried, in a very Matrix-like way, to create the perfect utopia for each and every one of our heroes.

In a careful, calculated manner, someone has been trying to give our flash-sideways characters exactly what it thinks they want, but at the same time, keep them completely in the dark about what happened in their previous, island-based lives. They're using happiness to suppress past memories, but love is the one thing that wasn't counted on.

[Mugen910]

pics continued.

[OLS]

A theory! The rapturous blonde beauty he saw himself with, loving forever, was not Claire, but his season 2 Island temptress: the heroin-stuffed Virgin Mary statues. The painted hair? Blonde. The robes? Sky blue..That's what I was thinking as it was coming out of Charlie's mouth. Great minds think alike.

[dannysguitar]

Everybody loves Hugo... Including me!

[mosesbotbol]

When that chick blew up, that was freaky! Should we trust Hugo? Not sure. This is getting awesome!

[Mugen910]

Well Jacob never actually touched Ilana so she wasn't saved I guess :(

[weak_link]

Why did she blow up again?

[kugie]

Why did she blow up again?

"DYNOMITE!!!!!"
To Quote JJ from Good Times

[kugie]

I agreet his is getting good.
Some one posted about everyone at the Hospital what will happen when they all get there?
I still think Jack has a big part in taking over Jacobs spot. The fact that he is just giving people little pushes but not truely interfering. The "do you trust me", comment he made to someone not to long ago..
Of course I am most likely completely wrong and the show will do something that will throw everyone off.

I don't know if this was posted but I guess the final Sceene has not even been shot yet. So the cast doesn't know what is going to happen yet.

[Mugen910]

LOST season 6, ep# 11 "Everybody Loves Hugo"



1) The local movie theatre Chunky’s in Nashua,NH and Pelham,NH will be showing the finale for free! You might want to check your local small theatre for the same.



2) Ilana: Guess the island was done with her. The book that Hurley found in her belongings was Dostoevsky's Notes from the Underground: considered to be the first existentialist novel. The author's philosophy of the mind: tortured and tumultuous, torn between action and passivity, a collection of conflicted voices that has been likened to schizophrenia. The protagonist reflects on an event and comes to conclusions about himself and his relationship to society, art and any number of things. An important theme is the attempt to take control of one's life, to manufacture experience into identity, birth consciousness out of suffering, and then live to fail and learn anew.



3) Michael: The whispers - "we're the ones who can't move on." Can they not move on because the flash-sideways world was created or is it because they have done something bad/ wrong/ immoral? So, is it Purgatory? The show's creators have said that the island is not Purgatory... did they lie to throw us off? Maybe the LOSTIES are not in purgatory, but people who died on the island are? However, what Michael said doesn’t really jive with the Catholic belief of what Purgatory is.



4) Hurley:

* It seems that the ones who can trigger the island memories in the flash-sideways world are the ones who have died on the Island. First Charlie, then Daniel, then Libby.
* Never lingered on his own reflection like the other flash-sideways characters.
* Remember the reason Hurley was in the mental institution? He had come to believe that his weight was responsible for a deck collapse at a party that killed two people. He blew up the Black Rock to prevent people from getting themselves killed (as Michael warned would happen). Hurley has guilt issues, to say the least.
* Found the bag of Jacob’s ashes in Ilana’s belongings.
* Hurley didn't remember anything until he was placed into a situation familiar to the island timeline. Once he had the picnic, once he kissed Libby, that's when he remembered. This is exactly what happened to Desmond last episode. His memory was triggered by an event that occurred in both timelines: seeing Charlie through a pane of glass, underwater. It's also what happened to jog Charlie's memory: doing drugs in the bathroom of Flight 815 was the connection for him, because it's something that happened in both the flash-sideways and island worlds.



5) Libby:

* So why hasn't Libby visited Hurley, as a ghost, on the island? Because she had been allowed to move on? Was she allowed to move on because she didn't meet the criteria to be an Island-bound whisperer: she lacked a burden of guilt, had nothing to atone for?
* In the flash-sideways, she tells Hurley she was watching a Mr. Cluck commercial when the rush of emotion struck her. This screams back to the first time we saw Daniel Faraday off-island, sobbing as he watched footage of the crash of Flight 815. Daniel cried back then without even understanding where those emotions were coming from - just as Libby did here.



6) Desmond:

1. Flocke offered his hand to Desmond to help him up...Desmond accepted it, which Sun and Kate both refused to do in earlier episodes. What does it mean?
2. The cut on the right side of his flash-sideways forehead is the same as the one he has in the flash-sideways. See attached photos (kinda hard to see b/c the island is dark or shaded in most photos).
3. When Ben asked Desmond his son’s name there was no hesitation when he answered “Charlie.” Flash-sideways Desmond of course has no son. It seems that Desmond is fully aware of his other life and that has a lot to do with his lack of fear towards Flocke.
4. The license plate on Desmond's car changes from one scene to the next. When he drives away after watching Libby and Hurley on the beach the plate on the car was 4PCI264. When he drove through the parking lot to mow Locke down, the plate read 2FAN321. Was it a shout-out to a fan or something more perplexing? (Both of these plate numbers are different than Desmond’s plate last week, which was the same as Jack’s and Nadia’s in previous weeks).
5. Why did Desmond run over flash-sideways Locke? One possibility is that Desmond tried to kill Sideways Locke to prevent Smokey from migrating into Sideways Locke's body… although it may be cruel that Desmond would basically murder an innocent man just to prevent his future corruption… just like how Sayid shot young Ben.
6. Have we been being shown two sideways worlds?

· At Mr. Clucks, Hurley doesn't recognize Desmond. At the airport Hurley very clearly recognized Desmond from the plane. However, at Mr. Clucks even after Desmond mentions flight 815, Hurley shows no recognition at all.

· Then there are the two different license plates on Desmond’s car…

· Hurley tells Desmond in the airport that flight 815 luggage is at baggage claim 4, but then Desmond and Claire get their bags at baggage claim 2.

· On the plane with Jack, Desmond is wearing a wedding ring, but in the car with George Minkowski, he's not married (Minkowski even points out “I see you’re not wearing a ring” before offering to get Desmond a “lady”).

· "The butterfly effect is a common trope in fiction when presenting scenarios involving time travel and with "what if" scenarios where one storyline diverges at the moment of a seemingly minor event resulting in two significantly different outcomes."
Note: The butterflies in the drawing on the wall behind Libby at Santa Rosa, the butterfly on the Black Rock with Richard, "For want of a nail" is actually a poem describing the chaos theory which was also referenced by that same scene.



7) Jungle boy: Clearly aggravates Flocke. The boy's smirk before he ran off had to mean something, like he was pleased. Why does he have blond hair sometimes and brown hair at other times? See attached photos…



8) Flocke: John Locke's mannerisms have been shining through Smokey lately... same expressions, phrases, stick carving. Maybe he can't suppress certain aspects of John's persona from exhibiting themselves and that will help lead to his downfall?



9) Previews: Next week's previews were played with the Willie Wonka Rowing Song in the background (very creepy)... here are the lyrics:

There's no earthly way of knowing
Which direction we are going
There's no knowing where we're rowing
Or which way the river's flowing
Is it raining? Is it snowing?
Is a hurricane a-blowing?
Not a speck of light is showing
So the danger must be growing
Are the fires of Hell a-glowing?
Is the grisly reaper mowing?
Yes! The danger must be growing
For the rowers keep on rowing
And they're certainly not showing
Any signs that they are slowing!!!



Remember that, like Jacob, Willie Wonka was looking for a replacement too.



10) Seinfeld shout-out: Hurley and his mother were going to another award ceremony for Hurley's contribution to the Human Fund. The Human Fund was a charity George Costanza made up so he could give a gift to his boss & others without spending money.

11) Bruce Springsteen shout-out: Spanish Johnny is the restaurant where Hurley was supposed to meet his blind date. It's also a character in the Springsteen song ''Incident at 57th Street,'' in which the young romantic is described as being ''dressed just like dynamite.'' You can find the song on the same album that includes the song that shares its title with the name of the woman Hurley was supposed to meet at the restaurant: Rosalita.

12) Work theme: Fugitive Kate runs. Pregnant Claire carries a life. Locke lost his job, felt emasculated, scrambled to get one back. Jack, Sayid, Ben, Sawyer, Jin, Desmond: career-absorbed men. We often see that the sideways characters are largely defined by what they do — by their business/ work. The cost of all this struggling and striving has been a diminished ability and interest for introspection. The characters that have had mirror/ reflection moments have detected something worth thinking about, but don't. One of the concerns of existentialist literature — especially Dostoyevsky — was how both Communist and Capitalist cultures left their citizens too fatigued for the work of personal enrichment, i.e. enlightenment. The psychologist Erich Fromm saw an even more profound problem: he believed a culture of work was crippling our capacity for love. It's interesting that the sideways character that has come the closest to having a self-generated moment of clarity while looking in a mirror was its only unabashed romantic, who was not defined by her work: Sun.

Enter Sideways Hurley, who both subverted and affirmed the theme. We met him as he was being celebrated for his work as... a giver. Hurley didn't get a conventional mirror moment. Instead, he got a short film praising his extraordinary and extensive philanthropy.

13) Saint Sebastian hospital: The hospital where Jack works, where Claire is getting her baby checked out, where Jin is taking Sun (gunshot wound), where Charlie is getting treated (car accident), where Locke is, probably, on his way to.... The story of Saint Sebastian has many LOST links. If you are interested in reading about him go here: http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Saint_Sebastian



14) The Well: There seems to be some confusion about which well this is. I believe this was NOT the well that Locke traveled down to turn the wheel. That well is under the Orchid Station, in the jungle. This well, was in a clearing, no Orchid Station.



There is a Chinese folk tale called ''The Man Who Was Thrown Down a Well'' that tells the story of an unredeemed soul who gets unjustly thrown into a well where he encounters spirits who are trapped and yearn to move on into the afterlife. They help do his penance and become a better person, and then after three years (the same amount of time Desmond spent in The Hatch) the man returns to the surface world, forgives the man who threw him into the well and fulfills his promise to help free the lost, trapped souls.



15) Angstrom the bunny: Angstrom the rabbit from last week was, most likely, a reference to the comic book villain Angstrom Levy from the Invincible series. He is a character who has the ability to travel between different realities.

[dannysguitar]

WOW! Thanks for the recap. I'm subscribing to the theory that we are seeing an alternate to the alternate universe.... :-)

[Brutus2600]

Found this thread and I've gotta agree...this season with how they're wrapping things up is pretty amazing. I can't wait to go back and watch the entire series to see it with the full understanding of what everything is all about.

[Eleven]

3. When Ben asked Desmond his son’s name there was no hesitation when he answered “Charlie.” Flash-sideways Desmond of course has no son. It seems that Desmond is fully aware of his other life and that has a lot to do with his lack of fear towards Flocke.

Flash Sideways Desmond had dealt with Charlie before the encounter with Ben. Told by Charles to go get Charlie, Charlie driving the car into the water, the hospital scenes, etc etc. My thoughts were that he just said Charlie real fast because of his recent dealings with Flash Sideways Charlie, not real son Charlie that he and Penny had.

Either could work I suppose.

[kugie]

In th pics of the Boy is it just me or does he look like he is getting older?

[OLS]

Next week he will fully become Matt Damon and we will realize that ALL this is actually just
a script idea that he and Ben Affleck had in high school. See the connection?? BEN?
The losties are HUNTING for GOOD WILL?

[Mugen910]

A great theory from a LOST website. The writer goes into detail regarding how the seasons are mirroring each other:

“I can't help but think that the vast majority of viewers (including here) are missing an amazing aspect of how the story of Lost is told. I see a lot of people complaining about how Ilana died, this week. In and of itself, Ilana's death was contrived and lame.

But her death was not a stand-alone thing. It is part of a huge story that has been carefully crafted and woven together since Season 1. They say history repeats itself, but on this island, this is true to the Nth degree. We are seeing the same situations and scenarios play out, over and over again. It mostly follows a patter of Season 6 mirroring Season 1..... and 5 mirroring 2 .... and 4 mirroring 3. So it is kind of like an A-B-C-C-B-A pattern. Mirror image. (Hence the mirror references in the final season, to draw attention to the idea of mirror-imaging.) The show has always been about duality -- black & white, free will & destiny, the Losties and vs Others, Locke vs Ben, the beach vs the jungle/cave, Jacob vs the MIB, and on and on and on. Duality is at the heart of the design of the whole show, and the mirror-image structure of the storytelling is a major tool to demonstrate this in both obvious and subtle ways.

I could go on for pages and pages of examples of this phenomenon, and this is actually my single favorite aspect of the storytelling on the show! And Ilana's death is YET another example of this pattern. Her death replicates the death of Arzt in Season 1, and this is intentional, part of an intentional, grander and more intricate pattern. Here are a few other, quick examples:

Remember how Sayid was tied down on a table, electrical wires attached to him to shock him, in order to aquire information about him, in a dwelling place that is hidden within the jungle. This was carried out by someone who lost their child and doesn't know if they'll ever see their child again. This happened in Season 1 . . . and Season 6!

-------------------
SEASON 1 - While searching for answers to the island's mysteries, Jack is led by a mysterious man to find a cave, next to water. Inside is a black stone and a white stone, and various personal belongings, including a baseball bat. Alongside the cave is Charlie's guitar. Christian's body appears to have been removed. Jack almost fell off a cliff while searching for his father, and this led him to the cave. But, Locke reached out and took his hand and saved him.

SEASON 6 - While searching for answers to the island's mysteries, Sawyer is led by a mysterious man (FLocke) to a cave next to water. Inside is a black stone and a white stone, and various personal belongings, including a baseball glove. Just inside the cave is a lute (an ancient guitar). The name of Locke (who took Christian's place on Ajira 816) is removed, crossed out. Sawyer almost falls of a cliff while being taken to this cave, but FLocke reaches out and takes his hand and saves him.
------------------------

SEASON 1 - Sun, an Asian character who hides many secrets, shows her skill at healing with herbal remedies.

SEASON 6 - Dogen, an Asian character who hides many secrets, shows his skill in the use of herbal medicines.
------------------------

SEASON 1 - Sun can speak English, while Jin can't.

SEASON 6 - Jin can speak English, while Sun can't.
------------------------

SEASON 1 - Sayid is a man who is ashamed of his violent past, and of how certain authority figures pressed him into service to them, to hurt innocent people for his boss's gain. Sayid's leg is injured in the process of being caught in a trap. He is caught by the person who set the trap, Rousseau. He passes out, and she takes him to her hidden home, where she interrogates him about her child, which she says was kidnapped by the Others.

SEASON 6 - Jin is a man who is ashamed of his violent past, and of how certain authority figures pressed him into service to them, to hurt innocent people for his boss's gain. Jin's leg is injured when he is caught in a trap. He is caught by the person who set the trap, Claire. He passes out, and she takes him to her hidden home, where she interrogates someone else she captured along with Jin, asking him about her child, which she says was kidnapped by the Others.
----------------------

SEASON 1 - Hurley decides that everyone needs to know who each other is, so he starts a census, which leads him to getting the ship manifest with the list of all the survivors on it. Many of the names are crossed off, having been "eliminated" (by death) in the crash or immediately afterward. By going over the list, Hurley figures out that one of the survivors is not a survivor, but is really an outsider pretending to be one of them... someone who had already been on the island for a long time!

SEASON 6 - Hurley is used by Jacob to take Jack to the Lighthouse, where they find the mirrors and the giant dial with the names of all of the candidates written on it. Many of the names are crossed out, having been eliminated. Meanwhile, FLocke takes Sawyer (who in Season 1 had the manifest) to the cave by the sea, and also shows him the names of candidates. Many are crossed off. It is around this time that Sawyer also learns that Locke is not really Locke, at all. He is an outsider pretending to be a survivor... but is really someone who had already been on the island for a long time!
-----------------------

SEASON 2 - Desmond is waiting for his replacement, and uses a riddle as a password to determine whether a person is there to help with his mission. (What did one snowman say to the other snowman? "Smells like carrots.") Note: this riddle also appeared in Season 1, briefly, before Desmond ever appeared.

SEASON 5 - Ilana is searching for Jacob's replacement, and uses a riddle as a password to determine whether someone is involved in her mission. (What lies in the shadow of the statue? "He who will save us all.") Note: this riddle also appears in Season 6, thus mirroring Season 1, while 2 mirrors 5.
-----------------------

SEASON 2 - Jin appears to have been completely lost at sea, possibly dead, after the raft he's on is destroyed by an explosive. There is no sign of him. However, later, he is found on the island, having washed ashore there.

SEASON 5 - Jin appears to have been completely lost at sea, possibly dead, after the ship he's on is destroyed by an explosive. There is no sign of him. However, later, he is found on the island, having washed ashore there.
------------------

SEASON 2 - Sawyer tells Jin his arm is going to fall off.

SEASON 5 - Jin sees the French science team member's arm ripped off.
----------------

SEASON 2: The survivors explored a lot of the various hatches and locations of Dharma. Several of the survivors are taken prisoner by the Others and stay with them for a while in one of the Dharma locations. They are gone from the survivors camp for nearly 3 weeks.

SEASON 5: Some of the survivors went to the Dharma village, where they lived for 3 years among the Dharma people, going around to a lot of the Dharma hatches and locations.
----------------

SEASON 2: Sawyer gets possession of all of the guns and declares himself "sheriff"

SEASON 5: Sawyer is put in charge of the guns as he becomes the Dharma sheriff
--------------------

SEASON 2: Ben (aka Henry Gale) is tortured by Sayid and held captive by Jack and other survivors, but one of the survivors betrays the rest by risking everything to rescue Ben, even though he knows Ben is the leader of the Others and is responsible for many terrible things.

SEASON 5: A young Ben is shot by Sayid. Jack and others stand by and refuse to help Ben, but another survivor takes it upon herself to risk everything to rescue young Ben, even knowing he will be the leader of the Others and will be responsible for many terrible things.
------------------

SEASON 2: They found their way to the hatch. They argued over whether to do something (push the button) in the hatch. The season ended with a lot of arguing over whether to push the button, and finally they don't push the button, and BOOM!

SEASON 5: They found their way to (what would be) the hatch, where they argued over whether to use some modern technology (bomb) to counteract the island's dangerous "energy." And then "pushed the button" and blew it up (or more accurately, it imploded, just like the hatch did in Season 2).

(Note: "Pushing the button" is an old euphemism from the Cold War days that referred to dropping a nuclear weapon.)
-------------------------

SEASON 3 - Introduces mystery of the people from the Kahana

SEASON 4 - Reveals the truth about the people from the Kahana
-------------------

SEASON 3 - Juliet tries to conspire to kill Ben when he is helpless, but Jack refuses and saves him. Ben lives.

SEASON 4 - Sayid conspires to kill Ben when he is helpless (a child), Jack refuses to save him. Ben lives.
----------------

SEASON 3 - Ben shoots Locke and leaves him for dead in the mass grave. Locke tries to commit suicide, but fails.

SEASON 4 - Locke tries to commit suicide, but fails. Then, Ben kills Locke. (Reverse order from what happened in Season 3)
------------------

SEASON 3 - Hatch catastrophically implodes, causing Desmond to bounce around in time

SEASON 4 - Donkey Wheel breaks, catastrophically effecting the island and causing survivors to bounce around in time
. . . . . [note: in Season 2, Locke lowers Kate down into the hatch flume, but something interrupts it and she disappears,
and then in Season 5, Locke is lowered into the well above the Donkey Wheel, but is interrupted and he falls and disappears]
---------------

SEASON 4 - Ben turns donkey wheel, goes to outside world and recruits Sayid

SEASON 5 - Locke turns donkey wheel, goes to outside world to recruit other survivors
--------------

SEASON 4 - Desmond starts out without Penny, ends up with her

SEASON 5 - Desmond starts with Penny, ends up shot and thus taken away from her

. . .
One of my favorite (although more minor) examples is the "return" of Charlie's peanut butter, a couple episodes ago in Season 6. Remember Charlie's (imaginary) peanut butter, which he offered to Claire to try to lift her spirits in Season 1? Just recently, in the Smoking Club's camp, Sawyer came up next to Kate and offered her some "hot cocoa" to try to make her feel better. She asked where she found some hot cocoa on the island...? "I didn't," he said. "Just pretend."

There are other examples I could cite. This is just a few, because the list is too long to post here, completely. But these show a clear and definite pattern. And Ilana's death is a part of that very intentional pattern. Yes, it's contrived... for a reason. Season 1 was giving us numerous pictures of what we would see in the final season! And Season 2 showed us many things we could expect to see in the next-to-last season, and so on! And I, for one, think it's awesome! On this island, history repeats itself... to the extreme. And no matter how much free will you try to exercise... this "curse" will catch up with you and make you a part of its mirror-image storytelling.”

[Brutus2600]

A great theory from a LOST website. The writer goes into detail regarding how the seasons are mirroring each other:

<cut text>



That's pretty amazing...I've watched from season 1 and never saw that. I really like this writeup!

[Jack Straw]

Great Episode!

Also, check out this interview: http://www.wired.com/magazine/2010/04/ff_lost/8/

Interesting read!

[OLS]

It would be really great though, if a show was as clever as this show is made out to be,
but instead of alienating half of it's viewers over 5-6 years, kept them gripped for
three years and accomplished the same thing in the end. I am going to watch the show finale
and all the crap I have to put up with to get there, but I quit liking this show a LLOoonng time ago.

[weak_link]

Last night seemed like more fluff and not enough meat & potatoes. Time is running out and I don't feel like we're making enough progress. Then I'll be sad when it ends and I can't complain about the fluff. :r

[Mugen910]

Last night seemed like more fluff and not enough meat & potatoes. Time is running out and I don't feel like we're making enough progress. Then I'll be sad when it ends and I can't complain about the fluff. :r

You're from SF...you'll always have fluff to complain about big boy :r

[Beagleone]

Last night seemed like more fluff and not enough meat & potatoes. Time is running out and I don't feel like we're making enough progress. Then I'll be sad when it ends and I can't complain about the fluff. :r

The producers have already said they will not be able to answer all of the questions before the series finale. You are just going to have to take what they give us and go from there. Personally last night, I think we got more answers in the first 7 minutes than we had in the past year or two.

[OLS]

The producers have already said they will not be able to answer all of the questions before the series finale.

Ironically, they also said they would answer all the questions before the end.
In a big splashy promo. I guess what they say in a magazine or online and
what they say in promos can be different and it's just OK. I hate them.
"The check's in the mail and I promise I won't ____ __ ____ ______!

[kaisersozei]

A great theory from a LOST website. The writer goes into detail regarding how the seasons are mirroring each other:


I think this is also the reason for a lot of the imagery of mirrors (heh, get it--"mirror imagery"?!) being used this year. Many of the characters (except, I think, Hurley) spend time gazing at their reflections in each of their character-centric episodes.

[newcigarz]

LOST can cup my nuts. :xxx

[OLS]

:xxx
Notice however that I still feel the need to have an opinion. :=:

[Mugen910]

No new episode next week. :td



1. Flash-sideways:
* Jack:

i. Jack reviews John Locke’s injury at the hospital. That passing reference to Locke's obliterated dural sac was a nod to the classic moment in the pilot when Jack recounted his most harrowing moment as a young doctor. He had to repair a dural sac and seized with fear. His father told him to count to 10. Jack recounted this story when he talked Kate through stitching up his side wound after the 815 crash.

ii. Upon entering the office building where Ilana’s office was a sign read "Visitors must sign in". Both Claire and Desmond signed it, and later Jack but not David. Perhaps this is indicative of our Losties being nothing more than visitors to this timeline.

iii. Jack peers into the operating room mirror and sees Locke's face, and as viewers we're flashed back to the spinal operation he did on Ben at the Hydra station. This is where Ben cryptically told Jack "See you on the other side", something that made little sense at the time. Now however, Jack is on the other side. Maybe this scenario is what triggers his own magic memory moment.

* Desmond: Much like Flocke, he is manipulating Losties toward a specific end. Both resort to violence to get what they want. And both are hard to resist if you allow them to start talking to you.
* Kate: At the Police Station she claimed to be innocent. Maybe she is innocent in the flash-sideways world?
* Sawyer: Eating an apple when he sat down to talk with Kate. The apple was the forbidden fruit in the Garden of Eden that Eve gave to Adam. Sawyer asked Kate if she wanted an apple. She didn't take it but was it a clue on who will be the Adam & Eve on the island? Just about everyone in this scene wears black. Sawyer, Kate, the police, the detectives... even the hat Kate puts on as Sawyer runs off to catch Sayid is black.



2. Flocke:
* Flocke sent Sawyer off to retrieve the sailboat so Flocke’s camp could sail over to Hydra Island. So off he went with Kate, splintering from the rest of the group. This was a mirror of what happened at the end of Season 2, as Hurley, Jack, Kate, and Sawyer went off to confront The Others, and Sayid, Sun, and Jin took the sailboat to try and meet up with them.

· Admitted to appearing as Christian Shepherd on the island (to help Jack find water).



3. Sailboat: The Elizabeth: the sailboat Libby gave to Desmond for his solo trip around the world.



4. On-Island Jack:
* Jack and Flocke talking by torchlight at night, yet when they went back to camp it was daylight.
* 2 creepy scenes: 1) Jack saying: "If that thing wants us to leave, maybe it's afraid of what happens if we stay?" and 2) Claire saying to Jack "You decided the moment you let him talk to you, like the rest of us. Whether you like it or not, you're with him now."
* From Season 3's finale, only now instead of Jack yelling after Kate, "We have to go back!" Kate is now yelling at Sawyer about Jack..."We have to go back!"

· The beach explosions: I didn’t hear this but other people describe the scene as follows… “First, when Jack hits the ground, sounds like he just fell into water...you can hear a splash. Then you hear a bunch of muffled voices, sounds like chaos. Then a woman’s voice (sounds like Kate), scream "noooooo". Then it sounds like Jack's voice says "Kate"....and then you hear a woman say "Sawyer".” Is this something we haven't seen yet or just the whisperers getting excited as they tend to do? Flocke stands motionless as Hell breaks out all around him. Creepy.

* Sawyer demands that Jack leave “his” boat. What Sawyer doesn't realize is that the off-island world isn't all that it's cracked up to be... something Jack learned first-hand a few seasons back, while Sawyer was stuck in the Dharma Initiative.



5. Widmore:

· Widmore orders that the Losties be taken prisoner. Warning: Star Wars reference coming… Did Widmore just pull an Emperor Palpatine? Emperor Palpatine initially acts as a man who has good intentions and loyalty, but look out, he is actually Darth Sidious! And what did Emperor Palpatine want to do? Set in motion a war to weaken the Senate and Jedi's so he could take control.....hmmm sounds familiar. As Ben and Flocke have said, Widmore just wants control of the Island.

· But now, why does he want the Candidates (minus Sayid)? As bait to lure Flocke there since Flocke needs them to leave? Does Widmore want to kill our Losties...just as he gave the green light to when he sent the freighter?

· Interesting Theory! Flocke and Widmore are actually collaborators in a conspiracy to manipulate (and ultimately destroy) the castaways in order to achieve mutually advantageous goals. We know that Flocke wants to leave The Island. What might Widmore want in this scenario? Maybe Widmore wants to replace Flocke as the new Smokey. Maybe Widmore is driven by a fear of death; becoming a black cloud of all-powerful disembodied consciousness is his ticket to eternal life.



6. Sayid:
* Sayid's problem is that he allows other people to define him — and then buys into it. His father, his country, the United States military, Ben, Dogen, and Flocke — they've all told Sayid that he's a killer, and he's accepted their judgment. Desmond's challenge to Sayid: Decide for yourself who you are and what you want to be. Maybe Sayid accepted Desmond's challenge and decided that who he wants to be is the man Nadia fell in love with — the man who chose not to be her killer; the man who sacrificed his own safety so that she could be free. He made a choice to be that man once. Maybe at the well, Sayid made the choice to be that man again?
* Desmond says "What will you tell her?" Perhaps the only thing Sayid cares about (if he is starting to feel things again) is what Nadia thinks of him, both on and off the island. In the flash-sideways world he packs his things telling Nadia he has to leave forever, Nadia says “what did you do?”



7. Kate theory: She has always been on the lamb or running from something. This show is about redemption so maybe it’s Kate who replaces Jacob… in a job that can last… centuries?



8. Claire: Claire tells Jack that a person who lets Flocke speak to them is automatically committed to his side. Later, she is convinced by Kate that she still has a choice and switches sides after 3 years???



9. The previews from the end of the episode: "HIS SOUL HAD GONE MAD - BEING ALONE IN THE WILDERNESS.” This line is from Heart of Darkness, the book that Apocalypse Now was based on. In the book, as Kurtz dies he says “the horrors…” also mentioned in the previews.



10. Questioning Ghost Jacob’s motives: When Hurley got lost in the jungle and stumbled upon Jacob's cabin and peeked in the window and saw Ghost Christian in a rocking chair. Then an eyeball popped into the frame and glared right back at him and scared the hell out of Hurley. Assuming that Jacob's cabin didn't belong to Jacob at all, but was instead a prison for Smokey, I wonder if Smokey literally got into Hurley's head in that moment and has been messing with him ever since.



Consider Ghost Jacob. In the season premiere, he instructed Hurley to take Sayid to The Temple for healing. How did that turn out? Sayid came back to life and helped Flocke. In ''Lighthouse,'' Ghost Jacob instructed Hurley to take Jack to the lighthouse by evoking his father's memory. (''You have what it takes.'') How did that turn out? The experience left Jack convinced that Jacob was a perverted voyeur who had been spying on him since childhood and further convinced him that The Island was not a place where he'd find healing for his brokenness. Putting Jack in such a place helps Flocke’s cause because it sets Jack up for one of Flocke’s bargains. What do you want most in the world, Jack? Reconciliation with someone you love? Your father, perhaps? Because I can do that. We haven't heard Flocke verbally make that pitch yet, but judging from what we've seen in the Sideways world, it looks like Sideways Jack lives in a world where his father issues have been resolved via an increasingly healthy relationship with his son.

11. Smokey is the embodiment of fear theory: When Jack told Flocke he didn't have any idea what he was, Flocke offered a cryptic reply: ''Sure you do.'' Was Flocke hinting at the secret to his true identity and nature, and that if Jack recognized him as he truly was, he would realize that he's known him quite well for a very long time. Flash back to Jack's ''count to five'' story about fear management in the pilot episode. Maybe Flocke is an embodiment of fear. Many characters have been referring to Flocke as “that thing” lately (See: Ilana, Richard, Widmore.) Of course, The Thing is a title belonging to two great science fiction films, the 1951 Howard Hawks original and the 1982 John Carpenter remake, about an alien life form marooned on Earth. Both were allegories about xenophobia and demonization.



12. Stephen King: His new book Under the Dome is set a few years into the future. A character mentions watching a sequel to the show LOST. It is called "The Hunted Ones."

[Tripp]

No new episode next week. :td



:( I thought that they were doing an uninterrupted season this year...

[OLS]

:( I thought that they were doing an uninterrupted season this year...
They were, and like everything else they told us, it's a big lie.

I thought this was funny in Muge's update:

Jack and Flocke talking by torchlight at night, yet when they went back to camp it was daylight

In any other entertainment thread context, this is a continuity issue. In lost it's a clue, :r:r:r

The explosions on the beach I did hear the calling back and forth and the muffled voices, but
I assumed it was just ear ringy stuff. I'd have to watch it again for a splash sound. It could
be that people associated the muffled and ringy sound as underwater. To me it was like the
opening of Saving Private Ryan. Just compression probs in the ear.

[OLS]

I like what was also written HERE:

''I remember how I felt the last time I left. Like a part of me was missing. We were brought here because we were supposed to do something, James. And if Locke — of that 'thing' — wants us to leave, then maybe it's afraid of what happens if we stay?'' In that line, it seemed to me that Jack was applying several lessons of his Island experience, including all the hard lessons Ben had taught him over the years about Island bad guys. Island bad guys figure out what you want most in life, then exploit it. Island bad guys always motivate you with fear and urgency and want you to act before you've taken the time to think things through. Island bad guys make it sound like you share common interests, but in most cases, whatever it is they want you to do is actually the exact opposite of what you should be doing.

[kaisersozei]

The explosions on the beach I did hear the calling back and forth and the muffled voices, but
I assumed it was just ear ringy stuff. I'd have to watch it again for a splash sound. It could
be that people associated the muffled and ringy sound as underwater. To me it was like the
opening of Saving Private Ryan. Just compression probs in the ear.

My wife noted the underwater muffles, too, and related it to the same kind of muffled sounds Kate heard when she shimmied down out of the tree in this season's premiere. She thinks it's somehow related to the fact that the island is underwater in the sideways world.

She also premised that what Sayid "wants most in the world" might no longer be Nadia--which everone assumes--but instead may be Shannon (Boone's stepsister.) I had forgotten all about the Sayid-Shannon relationship.

One last thing that I haven't read anywhere: when Kate is fleeing the airport in the cab, they come to a screeching halt in front of Artz & all his luggage. Artz bangs the hood of the cab and says "I'm walkin' here! I'm walkin' here!" There was something about that line that stuck in my head, and I finally figured out what it was after re-watching that episode recently: it's a relatively famous line by Dustin Hoffman from Midnight Cowboy. Artz said it with the exact same inflection & cadence. It was also used in Back to the Future 2:

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=yov2d0MmVsc

Probably doesn't have anything to do with anything, I was just proud of myself for spotting something!

[Mugen910]

My wife noted the underwater muffles, too, and related it to the same kind of muffled sounds Kate heard when she shimmied down out of the tree in this season's premiere. She thinks it's somehow related to the fact that the island is underwater in the sideways world.

She also premised that what Sayid "wants most in the world" might no longer be Nadia--which everone assumes--but instead may be Shannon (Boone's stepsister.) I had forgotten all about the Sayid-Shannon relationship.

One last thing that I haven't read anywhere: when Kate is fleeing the airport in the cab, they come to a screeching halt in front of Artz & all his luggage. Artz bangs the hood of the cab and says "I'm walkin' here! I'm walkin' here!" There was something about that line that stuck in my head, and I finally figured out what it was after re-watching that episode recently: it's a relatively famous line by Dustin Hoffman from Midnight Cowboy. Artz said it with the exact same inflection & cadence. It was also used in Back to the Future 2:

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=yov2d0MmVsc

Probably doesn't have anything to do with anything, I was just proud of myself for spotting something!

:tu very nice catch.

[OLS]

Sorry, if it was Saving Private Ryan it was underwater muffles. When The guys exit the
landing craft, the sound design is wicked cool in that when the camera is underwater,
the sound is muffled and when it comes out of the water it comes back to full. A striking
effect I'll always love from that movie. If it's ear ringing, it actually reminds me of "Carentan"
in Band of Brothers after a round explodes next to a guy and his hearing is muffled and
ineffective. I likened the muffles to the fact that a major explosion had just taken place.
With my hearing, I am lucky if I hear the whispering people when the smoke shows up.
No need to get all worried about what happens this week. :td

[Mugen910]

No new episode this week so just some thoughts and info to share:



1) A funny video summarizing Locke’s story through the use of action figures and rap music:

LOST Untangled: Locked and Loaded

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=KV1SXXnJVT0

2) Why is Jack suddenly calling Sawyer “James?” He never used to do that.

3) Some items that popped up during the enhanced re-run of Richard’s episode (I can’t confirm these because I didn’t watch it myself):

· * Revealed that Jacob brings people, who have directly or indirectly taken a life, to the island.

* The first rule of the Island is that no one enters the statue without Jacob’s permission, and that Flocke and Ben broke that rule.



* Flocke couldn't leave the island even when Jacob was killed (because of the candidates).



* When Isabella appeared to Richard on the ship she was actually the smoke monster. She appeared to Hurley the other time as a seemingly normal ghost.



* That Jacob “claims” to be the protector of the island. (Why was “claims” in parenthesis?)



· * A caption read (paraphrasing) that in season 1 Jack said that the Losties’ pasts did not matter anymore. That since the crash they were all given the chance to start over. (Maybe this redemption is what breaks the cycle that Flocke spoke about to Jacob… Jacob’s response “it only ends once. Everything else is just progress.”)

* Revealed that the doctor Richard went to for help for Isabella’s cough was conning him… the medicine the doctor wanted Richard’s money for was not a cure.

4) Theory! What if by choosing John Locke’s body to take over, Smokey will essentially be the cause of his own demise, since Locke was a candidate? Or, what if Jacob took over Smokey’s original body and when Ben pushed that body into the fire he destroyed Smokey’s original body… which will somehow prevent Smokey from leaving the island? Basically, has Smokey been tricked into being trapped in the "wrong" body?

5) Theory! Remember Ben’s childhood friend Annie? The one who made him the dolls? What if Ben and Annie were “together” later on the island, Annie got pregnant and died. This would explain why she was no longer on the island later in life and why Ben had a preoccupation with the island’s pregnancy issues. I doubt her mysterious disappearance from the show will be resolved so I’m just going to pretend this is what happened. J

6) Interview with the show’s producer:

“Damon Lindelof says Lost fans will be asking, "What did they mean by this?" after they see the series finale of ABC's mind-bending series. In a video interview with The Hollywood Reporter, the show's executive producer says that the final episodes are meant to answer questions, as well as provoke others. "We're trying to end Lost in a way that feels Lost-ian and fair and will generate a tremendous amount of theorizing," he said. "We're going to be as definitive as we can be and say this is our ending, but there's no way to end the show where the fans aren't going to say, 'What did they mean by this?' Which is why we're not going to explain it."

Lindelof and Carlton Cuse, his co-executive producer on the show, have publicly stated that they won't comment on the finale after it airs on May 23.

Lindelof also revealed that the final scene of the series was not shot sequentially, since new sets had to be constructed for the purpose. "That would have been a very nice idea to [shoot the last scene last], but for reasons of maintaining the secrecy of the show, and burying it in the middle of the production schedule was part of it, and also, we had to build some sets for the finale."”

[OLS]

This is why they are Aholes. I am sure that they do not owe me my life back after wasting 5+ years on this crappo,
but to say all the questions will be answered and then constantly back off ot that statment is just intolerable BS.
I wish em all luck in hell.

[white_s2k]

This is why they are Aholes. I am sure that they do not owe me my life back after wasting 5+ years on this crappo,
but to say all the questions will be answered and then constantly back off ot that statment is just intolerable BS.
I wish em all luck in hell.

:r:r:r:r:r

[mosesbotbol]

Wow is all I can say about last night. The Kwon's exit was quite emotional. Sayid is gone too... Sawyer is such a stuborn prick.

[kaisersozei]

Wow is all I can say about last night. The Kwon's exit was quite emotional. Sayid is gone too... Sawyer is such a stuborn prick.

QFT

And don't forget: Lapidus took a hatch door to the head... :(

I read somewhere (here?) that the producers had a few episodes this season where they "cleaned house." Guess last night was one of them.

Widmore telling Kate that she's not on any list further made me suspicious that he's in league with Flocke somehow. Kate's name was crossed off of Flocke's cave list, but IIRC she was still active on Jacob's lighthouse list.

Powerful episode last night.

[weak_link]

So if Sawyer didn't pull the bomb wires out the island wouldn't have let Jack die and all would still be fine? Is Jack our guy for sure at this point? I don't believe that, my money is still on Hurley. Or...or...or.... :r

[mosesbotbol]

I think Widmore is a good guy. Notice Ben was not in last night's episode at all? What does that mean? Where was he?

[BigCat]

So if Sawyer didn't pull the bomb wires out the island wouldn't have let Jack die and all would still be fine? Is Jack our guy for sure at this point? I don't believe that, my money is still on Hurley. Or...or...or.... :r

I think Sawyer's affirmative act made the detonation and possible death of all the candidates possible. Smokey couldn't do it on his own - the bomb would have fizzled like the dynamite in the cave. Richard couldn't kill a candidate either. But once Sawyer altered it, it became live.

[weak_link]

I think Sawyer's affirmative act made the detonation and possible death of all the candidates possible. Smokey couldn't do it on his own - the bomb would have fizzled like the dynamite in the cave. Richard couldn't kill a candidate either. But once Sawyer altered it, it became live.

Also, what the the protective range of the island? Even if Sawyer had not pulled out the wires, would they have really been saved since they were not actually ON the island when the bomb went off? Could Jack have been lulled into a false sense of security based on the Black Rock incident?

[kaisersozei]

Also, what the the protective range of the island? Even if Sawyer had not pulled out the wires, would they have really been saved since they were not actually ON the island when the bomb went off? Could Jack have been lulled into a false sense of security based on the Black Rock incident?

There's an underwater hatch around somewhere, so I think they were still within the island's range. I'm thinking that it radiates out a far bit--like, to where Widmore's freighter was--because of how it disappeared when Locke turned the wheel. Also, I think Jack spoke the truth, not only as he knew it, but he hit on one of the key concepts of "the game"--and he actually formed a pretty logical, convincing, Jack-like argument to back it up, too.

So, in the end, what does this say about Sayid, that he was willing to sacrifice himself? Was he just paying back Jack for saving him? He certainly didn't get to reunite with Nadia or Shannon....

And does anyone think that these actions will have an impact on their sideways lives? Much like Desmond running over Locke may have been influenced by him getting shoved down the well.

Was it Richard who wired the plane with explosives? Remember that Isabella told him he had to stop MIB from leaving the island.

As for Ben, I have to think about where he went. Didn't he get on Sawyer's boat with Claire?

[weak_link]

You didn't hear it from me but our Losties aren't dead. The sub sinks right on top of a scuba tour boat that is fully loaded with gear and tanks ready to go. When the sub crashes to the bottom all the gear floats up and right into the hands of Jin who swims around and saves everyone. Sayid only has a scratch from the c4 and everyone else lives.
















OK that's a stretch but is it any more of a stretch than polar bears in the sand?

[OLS]

Was it just me, or was the entire program this week a whole pile of NOTHING, except
for as it was termed, cleaning house. Did anyone learn anything about anything.
I guess we DID learn that Flocke CAN touch water and live to tell, lol.

[kaisersozei]

Here's something to ponder on the similarities/differences between the island now and the sideways world:

On-island Jin & Sun die, their daughter lives.
It hasn't happened yet but what if Sideways Jin & Sun live, but they lose the baby?

[weak_link]

Here's something to ponder on the similarities/differences between the island now and the sideways world:

On-island Jin & Sun die, their daughter lives.
It hasn't happened yet but what if Sideways Jin & Sun live, but they lose the baby?

Plausable theory based on how the sideways world 'works.'

Watched it again on Hulu last night. When Jin and Sun realize they are going down with the sub, Jin TOTALLY sounds like he's doing a bad Keanu Reeves impression.

[JackSchwartz]

Plausable theory based on how the sideways world 'works.'

Watched it again on Hulu last night. When Jin and Sun realize they are going down with the sub, Jin TOTALLY sounds like he's doing a bad Keanu Reeves impression.


You got it backwards. It's Keanu Reeves that sounds like he's doing a bad Jin impression when he's acting!

[Mugen910]

LOST season 6, ep# 13 "The Candidate"

New finale news!

1. The LOST finale on Sunday, May 23rd has been extended! It will now run from 9pm-11:30pm (followed immediately by “Jimmy Kimmel Live: Aloha to Lost” post-finale special at 11:30pm).



Jack flash-sideways:

1. Claire explained to Jack that she too was on Oceanic 815; it seemed as if Jack was starting to realize that something was fishy after finding out the same thing from Bernard.
2. Jack and John in the hallway at the hospital: By still clinging to their old ideologies, Locke and Jack are still unable to 'see' the truth. For Desmond, it took a brutal reminder of Charlie underwater. But for Jack and Locke... throughout duplicated scenarios and repeat dialogue, these characters still don't get it. They're still blinded by the inability to break out of their old bad habits... let go of certain things: for Locke it's his guilt, and for Jack it's his constant need for control/ to fix things.



Anthony Cooper flash-sideways:

1. Anthony Cooper not a con-man in flash-sideways, but a nice man in a wheelchair (like Locke!). Similar story to the relationship between Ben and Roger Linus on-island versus off-island. Both Ben and Locke had been cursed with horrible fathers previously, but in the flash-sideways things are different.
2. Locke told Jack how he became a paraplegic. Upon getting his pilot's license 3 years ago, Locke took his father for a ride — and they crashed. The irony! (Lots of reference to 3 years on the show... Juliet was on the island for 3 years, Desmond was on the island for 3 years, the Losties worked for Dharma for 3 years, etc)



Recycled scenes/ dialogue:

1. Kate is threatened at gunpoint outside the cage in front of Sawyer, mirroring when Sawyer was threatened at gunpoint by Pickett outside the cage in front of Kate in the Season 3 episode "I Do."
2. Bernard says “I hope you find what you're looking for" to Jack at the dentist's office. This is exactly what Kate told Jack in Episode 5 of this season, "The Lighthouse" and what Bernard/ Rose told the Losties outside of the cabin where he and Rose shacked up.
3. In the hospital hallway Jack called after John "I wish you believed me." This is the same message from John to Jack in his suicide note in "The Life and Death of Jeremy Bentham."
4. Jack's words when the bomb in the sub is about to blow "nothing's going to happen" are echoed in season two, when he tells Locke the same thing about pushing the button. These words are repeated again that season by Locke when he loses faith in the button and tells Eko the same thing.



Flocke:

1. Flocke told Jack: ''I could kill you Jack, Right here. Right now. And I could kill every single one of your friends. And there's not a single thing you can do to stop me.'' We know he's lying... but maybe Flocke really can kill the candidates himself but then just won't get what he wants: escape.
2. We’ve been, somewhat, led to believe that Flocke is averse to water. This would explain why an island would make such an effective prison for him. However, when Ilana first saw him he was standing in water at the Ajira crash and when Jack pulled him into the water this week he didn’t seem weakened.
3. Just before pushing Flocke into the water, Jack says "John Locke told me I needed to stay." I loved him throwing that back in Flocke’s face! John Locke was no loser!



Bernard flash-sideways:

1. "You mind if I ask you why you're so interested in Mr. Locke... Jack?" Bernard casually adds Jack's name to the end of the sentence, as if they're old buddies. Also, watch the knowing smile that crosses Bernard's face immediately afterward, "Oceanic 815. Pretty weird huh? Maybe you're onto something, here."
2. Bernard seems to know more but Jack needs to figure it out for himself (like Sayid handing Jin a knife to free himself, like when Locke supports Charlie to refuse heroin, but didn't directly help him, like when Locke gave Boone the knife to cut himself free during the episode "Hearts and Minds" and like when Jacob said “sometimes you have to let someone stare at the water for a while and figure it out for themselves.”).
3. Did Bernard remember the name Anthony Cooper after 3 years because Desmond already visited him?



Sawyer got conned:

1. Flocke didn't just con Sawyer, the con man — he exploited Sawyer's redemption. Once a selfish rogue, Sawyer has become a selfless hero over the past six seasons, and Flocke used that turn to his advantage. Flocke played Sawyer by basically giving him a Jack Shephard makeover (who's the desperate-reckless hero now, James?).
2. Sawyer blames Jack for Juliet’s death (Jughead), but he has stepped into the same role… taking action on behalf of others without thinking of the consequences.



Sayid, my favorite character:

1. Oh Sayid!!!! I’m devastated!!! :(
2. Whatever happened at the well, whatever Desmond said, it seemed to challenge Sayid, to shut down the voices of other people inside his head telling him that he’s a killer. In the end, he died so others may live.
3. Sayid: ''Because it's going to be you, Jack.'' Such a great scene! How does he know?! I don't care, I loved it.
4. Remember when Sayid saved Hurley at the mental institution and the pair was attacked at Sayid's apartment? Sayid loaded his dishwasher knife blades pointed UP and pushed a bad buy down onto them.... that was SO badass. :(



Jin/ Sun:

1. Jin told Jack: ''Save Sawyer.'' Jack wanted to stay; he believed he could save everyone. Jin disagreed, and the two men shared a meaningful stare. We all knew what Jin was really saying…
2. This post from a message board sums it up nicely: “…But I also thought that it was fitting that Jin and Sun died the way they did. Don't misunderstand - I cried for 10 full minutes afterward. But to me there was something so beautiful about the way their story was resolved. They had been through so much unhappiness in their marriage before coming to the island. Sun had felt such pain and guilt for leaving Jin behind when she left the island the first time. This time Jin chose not to leave her behind. (See, its all about choices) They weren’t separated but finally truly found each other. If they couldn’t be together in life then they would be together in death.” :(



The Island:

1. Continuity errors aside, there has to be something up with the passing of time on the island. Over the past several weeks we've watched night turn to day in a just matter of hours, and vice versa. As Sawyer tells Kate, it feels like we're running in circles. Time-wise, those circles now seem to be getting smaller and smaller. If this is intentional, perhaps the island is shifting or moving through time, as we saw way back in season 4 with Faraday’s rocket experiment.



Jacob:

1. Last season, Jacob said to Smokey on the beach “it only ends once.” What if there is no replacement for Jacob? What if Jacob wants it to END… destroy the island (and Smokey with it)… let the Losties live out the flash-sideways reality…



A nice post, from a message board, regarding John Locke not being as pathetic as Smokey thinks:

Jack: "John Locke told me I needed to stay."

“This phrase that Jack uttered to Flocke is one of the best lines of season 6. It kinda felt as though John Locke was still alive and definitely not the pathetic loser and chump that Flocke seems to have made him seem this season. It also, in my opinion, makes Jack appear to have come full circle, finally trusting in someone other than himself.

Jack's little shout out to John Locke also means that Locke wasn't a fool, but a courageous believer who, for better or worse, stuck to his guns. Sure Locke lacked logic and reason in some areas, but he made up for it with heart and courage. Jack on the other hand was logical and reasonable, but he lacked in the heart and courage part. Now Jack seems to possess all of these qualities.

I think the writers were telling us this when in the hospital scene where Jack says to Locke that he wanted to let go and move forward but he didn't know how, and has hoping Locke would “go first.” In the original timeline Locke definitely did go first and tried to show Jack how to be a believer (although Jack wasn't interested). Now hopefully Jack can move forward with all of his qualities, including his newfound faith, and do what he has to do.”

[weak_link]

3. Sayid: ''Because it's going to be you, Jack.'' Such a great scene! How does he know?! I don't care, I loved it.


I've watched it twice now and both times I thought he said 'Because it's GOOD to be you, Jack." Maybe I need to get my ears cleaned. :(

[weak_link]

So long dead dudes.

http://images2.wikia.nocookie.net/__cb20100429214150/tardis/images/3/3c/Weeping_angels_by_BugsyXoX.gif

[kaisersozei]

So long dead dudes.

That's freakin' me out

[white_s2k]

A fantastic episode this week. Answered a lot of questions that I had about the show.. :tu

[SaltyMcGee]

"Our very own Adam and Eve."

[BigCat]

From a CNN comment:

"Fake Mom was a smoky too I believe... She quoted man in black word for word (they come, they destroy...), she ripped through the site setting fire to everything, she thanked son for killing her, and he killed her by stabbing her throught he heart 'before she spoke to him' just like Dogen told Sayid he had to if you are to kill a smoke monster."

I'm not sure I buy it, but its an interesting thought.

[white_s2k]

From a CNN comment:

"Fake Mom was a smoky too I believe... She quoted man in black word for word (they come, they destroy...), she ripped through the site setting fire to everything, she thanked son for killing her, and he killed her by stabbing her throught he heart 'before she spoke to him' just like Dogen told Sayid he had to if you are to kill a smoke monster."

I'm not sure I buy it, but its an interesting thought.

Makes sense! Wait.. this is LOST, so you never know :r

[weak_link]

I was really pleased to get some actual info last night.

[OLS]

Hell of a night for me to forget it was coming on! But then, I am the one who HATES it right?

[weak_link]

Hell of a night for me to forget it was coming on! But then, I am the one who HATES it right?

You FORGOT?!!! That's it, yer banned. :su

:D

[mosesbotbol]

From a CNN comment:

"Fake Mom was a smoky too I believe...

Kind of reminded me of my friend's mom. She was sure creepy. Someone had to be the smoke monster to wipe out that village. It has to be mom or Jacob.

Did they ever say what the brother's name is? This episode would've been better if it was earlier in the history of the show. It seems like too much too late.

When does Ben come back to the series?

[kaisersozei]

Did they ever say what the brother's name is? This episode would've been better if it was earlier in the history of the show. It seems like too much too late.



Infant in Black.
Child in Black.
Teen in Black.

[ActionAndy]

Kind of reminded me of my friend's mom. She was sure creepy. Someone had to be the smoke monster to wipe out that village. It has to be mom or Jacob.

Did they ever say what the brother's name is? This episode would've been better if it was earlier in the history of the show. It seems like too much too late.

When does Ben come back to the series?

Yup. It proves that the writers did NOT have a plan all along like they kept insisting. If you look at the series as one long movie or book, there's serious pacing problems. I'd have been so much more invested in the struggles of Jacob and Black if we'd been shown this much sooner. Season one or two preferably, but hell, even earlier in Season 6.

[Brutus2600]

Yup. It proves that the writers did NOT have a plan all along like they kept insisting. If you look at the series as one long movie or book, there's serious pacing problems. I'd have been so much more invested in the struggles of Jacob and Black if we'd been shown this much sooner. Season one or two preferably, but hell, even earlier in Season 6.

Two things. I think that they screwed the pacing up because of ABC's refusal to allow them a hard end date to the show, thus they had no idea how long they were going to have to fill out the middle of the story.

Second, I agree I would've been more invested in the Jacob/MIB story if I had seen this episode earlier, but too much earlier and there wouldn't have really been enough understanding of what's going on. Towards the beginning of season 6 or even end of 5 would've been good, earlier than that and I think it wouldn't have made much sense and ruined the whole mystery they wanted to build up about Jacob and the MIB.

[Skywalker]

Kind of reminded me of my friend's mom. She was sure creepy. Someone had to be the smoke monster to wipe out that village. It has to be mom or Jacob.

Did they ever say what the brother's name is?

Much of the episode reminds me of the Biblical story of Jacob and Esau. They were twins; their father favored Esau while their mother favored Jacob. Esau is described as a hunter gather and Jacob is a trickster. Easu was to be blessed and inherit everything but was tricked by his brother, Jacob who didn't like being second choice.

[AD720]

At this point I have completely given up on trying to figure out WTF is going on and I'm just enjoying the ride. :)

[Mugen910]

At this point I have completely given up on trying to figure out WTF is going on and I'm just enjoying the ride. :)

quitter!

[Superbad]

I think the whole Jacob v Smokey story line is quite pointless. I just think they ran out of ideas, and/or realized that their approach to the past few seasons really had no direction. As such they did not know to get out of the hole they dug for themselves. I will say that I am impressed at how they are able to use the same dozen filming spots over and over again, and almost make them look like different places in the jungle.

[ActionAndy]

I think the whole Jacob v Smokey story line is quite pointless. I just think they ran out of ideas, and/or realized that their approach to the past few seasons really had no direction. As such they did not know to get out of the hole they dug for themselves. I will say that I am impressed at how they are able to use the same dozen filming spots over and over again, and almost make them look like different places in the jungle.

The problem with Lost is that they couldn't actually give you clues to what's going on. If they did, people on forum sites would have been able to figure out what's going on way before the end of the series. And no one likes having their secrets come out sooner than planned.

My mom watches a ton of mystery shows and if the cable went out in the middle of a Sherlock Holmes mystery, she'd be able to tell me how it would have ended. If the Lost people actually wrote logically and with clues/rational resolutions, we would have been able to guess the ending. So they have to write like dickheads.

When MIB/Jacob's murderous stepmother said to Claudia "any answer would lead to more questions, just be thankful you're alive," she was actually speaking to us the audience. It was quite an insult. "Don't expect any good answers from us, just be thankful we're around to entertain you."

I see WHY they tooled us around but that doesn't exactly make me feel better about it.

[Brutus2600]

When MIB/Jacob's murderous stepmother said to Claudia "any answer would lead to more questions, just be thankful you're alive," she was actually speaking to us the audience. It was quite an insult. "Don't expect any good answers from us, just be thankful we're around to entertain you."

Haha! I'm glad I'm not the only one who felt that way about that line :r

[ActionAndy]

Haha! I'm glad I'm not the only one who felt that way about that line :r

I was eating dinner when the episode was on and when she said that I looked up fully expecting to see the actress delivering her line directly to the camera LOL

[Mugen910]

LOST episode #14 "Across the Sea"

1. Claudia – the real mom

a. Claudia is the female version of the name "Claudius", which is a Roman name (and judging by her clothes and speaking Latin we can assume this all occurred during the Roman Empire – early ADs).

b. Brother (nameless) saw Claudia’s ghost, but Jacob didn’t… is it because Brother doubted what Mother told him and was, therefore “open” to believe there is a world outside of the island?

2. The Game

a. The game is Senet, and comes from ancient Egypt, maybe as far back as 3000 BC, and was often buried in tombs with the dead as its luck element was believed to demonstrate that certain people were protected by the gods. The game board that Brother finds could signal that the Egyptians came to the island well before Claudia's people, or that a group of Egyptians crashed there during the twins' childhood.

b. Brother says “one day you can make up your own game and everyone else will have to follow your rules." So, I’ll assume that means the island’s protector makes up the rules. Was one of Jacob’s rules (after Brother becomes Smokey) “you can scan people who come to the island to see if they are pure/ good or jaded/ corrupted. If someone scans “good” then leave them alone. Give them a chance to make the right choices. If someone scans “corrupted” you can kill them instantly.” Just a thought.

3. Mother

a. What she created for the boys reminded me of the Truman Show (Jim Carrey movie). She could tell the kids whatever she wanted and they wouldn’t know the difference… until a group of outsiders came to the island. Considering all the things she told them what was true and what was a lie told to keep them there?

b. Did Mother’s killing of Claudia create a curse of the pregnant women? Did Brother reinforce that curse by killing his adoptive Mother? Ethan Rom and Aaron Littleton were born on the island — but maybe they were exceptions permitted by Jacob or to facilitate their respective plans for the Losties…their “loopholes.”

c. ''I've made it so you can never hurt each other.'' Besides explaining why Brother had to use a proxy to kill Jacob, Mother's line said something about the power that an Island guardian wields — including the ability to make ''the rules.''

d. When Mother returned to her home/ cave after filling in the wheel well, she silently surveyed the scene and found the Senet box. Then Brother stabbed her. She fell to the ground and whispered a word: ''Nothing.'' She told her son that she couldn't let him leave because she loved him, and then she thanked him for killing her and died.

i. Three things to notice about this scene:

1. How she ''silently'' surveyed her camp. Remember Dogen's instructions to Sayid? Sayid had to plunge the knife into Flocke’s chest before Flocke spoke. Also, Smokey instructed Richard similarly when he sent Richard to kill Jacob (kill him before he speaks to you). Mother didn’t speak so Brother could kill her… she wanted to die.

2. Mother said ''Nothing'' before she died. Sayid also seemed to suffer from some kind of numbness, a state of emotional nothingness. Said he felt numb/ nothing.

3. Brother used the same knife to kill Mother that Dogen gave Sayid to kill Flocke, that Smokey gave Richard to kill Jacob.

4. Jungle Boy

a. It’s young Jacob. It seems that Jacob is appearing as his own younger form in an attempt to rattle Smokey/ Brother.

b. Both in their youth and as adults, Jacob pummeled Brother bloody. I'm guessing that explains the blood on young, ghost Jacob's hands when he appeared to Flocke in “The Substitute.”

5. Tapestry

a. Mother was weaving a tapestry, recalling the scene last year where we were introduced to Jacob weaving in the base of the statue.

b. When Mother returned to the caves after filling in Brother’s wheel well, she found her tapestry destroyed…Flocke destroyed Jacob’s tapestry in the foot of the statue earlier this season.

6. The Cave of Light

a. From what I’ve read, best described as a “whirlpool of ethereal life-giving energy — a wellspring of eternal life.”

b. Mother said some interesting things… "if the light goes out here, it goes out everywhere" (this is what Widmore and Ms. Hawking are referring to when they say that if Smokey gets off the island everything else will cease to exist. Mother also said that going down there is a fate "much worse than dying"… does she know this because it happened to her? Is she some sort of Smoke Monster? Is that how she killed all of the Roman settlers, burned their camp, and filled in the wheel well?

c. Silly theory… Is the cave light “time” (or eternal life)? Mother said “every man has a little… but wants more…” Was she Mother Time? Is the Smoke Monster the end of time (which is why everything ceases to exist if he’s released)?

i. “They’re not like us. They don’t belong here. We are here for a reason” the boys were told. And when the boys asked what the reason was, after a long pause, Mother responded “It’s not time yet.”

ii. Faraday said “I can make time,” Room 23 brainwashed with “only fools are enslaved by time and space”, the list goes on!

d. Brother looked at the cave light and declared 'It's beautiful.” Exactly John Locke's statement upon looking into "the Smoke Monster" the first time. Now that we know what the Smoke Monster was borne out of, it makes sense. Was Smokey showing this “beautiful” image to Locke enticing him to have a communion with the island, knowing that Locke was the one Smokey would impersonate/ become one day?

e. Consider the Sideways world, and remember that The Island is sunken there. Did someone succeed in putting out the light in that world? And what does it mean that the Losties are now remembering their Island world experience?

7. Mother Loved the Boys Differently

a. She knew that Jacob was trustworthy and loyal, whereas Brother was not. Therefore, she had to do a little extra with Brother, small things like leaving a box for him on the beach... Jacob thought she loved Brother more, but she was actually grooming Brother to be her replacement. She didn’t realize until the end that Jacob was truly the one.

b. When Mother told Jacob he would replace her as island protector she said "You don't really have a choice." I think that is the key moment that led to Jacob's methods...that there is always a choice/ free will.

c. Jacob was hurt that Mother had obviously wanted Brother to be the protector, initially. However, the candidate you get isn't always the one who looked best on paper, as Jacob discovers later with our Losties. Think about John Locke, whose faith, love for the island and jungle survival skills seemed like he would make the perfect person to become the next protector…. But it was Jack all along (or at least, after much pondering while looking out at the ocean, it became Jack).

8. The Island’s Light/ Power/ Energy Source

a. Brother creates/ designs the frozen, time-traveling wheel mechanism, but never finishes it. Who does? The Dharma Initiative?

9. Brother

a. A sympathetic character… he just wanted to see what else was out there…the opposite of the emotionless monster we've come to see him as in the current Island timeline. This is what centuries of resentment will do to you!

b. Adam and Eve skeletons… Brother and Mother. L

c. Jacob didn’t kill him (just like Mother said they couldn’t hurt each other)… Jacob beat him up, knocked him out, and sent him down the river into the cave of light. There (although this is up for debate) his soul turned into Smokey, his body was discarded. Smokey is his soul, that’s why it still looks like Brother, but we also see his corpse… this is why he previously said “Jacob stole my body, my humanity.” Even as John Locke he speaks from Brother’s point of view .

10. Taking Babies

a. Maybe when Jacob starts his group of Others he gives them orders to take the babies and “good ones” (like Cindy the flight attendant) because he wants them to be protected from the outside world’s greed/ corruption. He didn’t want anyone else to become jaded, like his brother.

11. Desmond

a. This episode may have shed some light on why Desmond is so important. The glowing light and the pockets of electromagnetic energy are one in the same. Desmond may be the only person who can enter the cave of light without becoming a Smoke Monster.

12. Interview with one of the show’s producers: An interesting question and answer…

Q: When Mother slaughters the people in the human village, the iconography looked very much like the Dharma bunkers after the purge. Was this your way of suggesting why it was Jacob might have allowed The Others to slaughter the Dharma folk - that this is the punishment for anyone who gets too close to unlocking the island's secrets?

A: Damon Lindelof (producer/ writer): “In terms of what Jacob allowed, what he didn't allow, what The Others did of their own volition, with Ben basically saying "This came down from Jacob" is all in the area that is subject to interpretation purposely. What our intention was is that there is a repeating vicious cycle that seems to happen on this island, where people come to the island, they try to figure out what makes the island work, and the closer they came leads them to their own inevitable demise.”

13. Was the Others’ Temple built over the cave of light? Supporting evidence:

a. The temple is hidden in the jungle and hard to find (like the cave) and the others and Dogen are EXTREMELY PROTECTIVE of it.

b. The temple has a hot tub that brings people back to life, or heals mortal wounds at the very least,

c. Smokie lived under the Temple (was released when Ben pulled a water drain plug).

d. Check out this video of the Losties arriving at the temple. Those super straight trees look very similar to the ones on the path to the light cave. http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=oeumUtncj3E&feature=related

[JE3146]

Who makes these compilations of ideas... and are they going to make a book when this is over? :r

Cus I want to read it... before I rewatch the entire series..... in August :D

[OLS]

This makes me wonder if anyone will want to watch it over. The producers say that they are
gonna answer all the questions, then they admit that they aren't even gonna scratch the
surface of the answers. People have invested so much time in this thinking it made sense
somehow, and that at the ned they would find out what the hell was actually going on.
But once the last episode has aired and it's just the DVD sales that keep this giant boner
alive in culture, They will find out why you do it right and make people satisfied, fulfilled
and cathartically spent. Who would want a DVD set of how this farce has turned out?
"I wasted 100 hours of my life and all I have to show is this Lost Tshirt."

[Mugen910]

Who makes these compilations of ideas... and are they going to make a book when this is over? :r

Cus I want to read it... before I rewatch the entire series..... in August :D

A friend of mine does a lot of data mining in various forums to compile this list for us Lost fans. It's not all her theories so I doubt she'll be making a book :)

[JE3146]

This makes me wonder if anyone will want to watch it over. The producers say that they are
gonna answer all the questions, then they admit that they aren't even gonna scratch the
surface of the answers. People have invested so much time in this thinking it made sense
somehow, and that at the ned they would find out what the hell was actually going on.
But once the last episode has aired and it's just the DVD sales that keep this giant boner
alive in culture, They will find out why you do it right and make people satisfied, fulfilled
and cathartically spent. Who would want a DVD set of how this farce has turned out?
"I wasted 100 hours of my life and all I have to show is this Lost Tshirt."

You can rest assured knowing I won't spend a cent on the DVD box set compiling all 6 seasons....








I'll be buying the blu-ray set instead :D... ;)

[kaisersozei]

I guess I'm one of the poor saps who is looking forward to Season 6 on DVD. We already have 1, 2, 4 & 5. I think the series is moving toward a decent conclusion, with enough questions being answered to satisfy me. They're not spoon-fed answers, but I can honestly say that I get what this story has been about.

[Cyanide]

I have heard that the producers/writers are re-working key episodes and story elements from all six seasons to make the story more cohesive and answer further questions that they original pass through couldn't handle.

Rumours have it that the extra/reworked footage will add up to an average of about 5 minutes per episode, or about 10 hours total never-before-seen footage in the whole 6 season box set.

[Cyanide]

Sorry if my last comment got people overly excited. In the end, I just made that up.

[JE3146]

Sorry if my last comment got people overly excited. In the end, I just made that up.

There's a special place in hell for people like you....

:r

[Mugen910]

This weekend’s schedule:

1. Saturday 8pm ABC will re-air the pilot episode
2. Sunday 7pm ABC airs a 2-hour recap/ retrospective. 9pm ABC airs the finale episode “The End.” It’s 2.5 hours long, followed by a Jimmy Kimmel: Aloha to Lost show, after the news.
3. Monday start watching the show all over again.

[JE3146]

This weekend’s schedule:

1. Saturday 8pm ABC will re-air the pilot episode
2. Sunday 7pm ABC airs a 2-hour recap/ retrospective. 9pm ABC airs the finale episode “The End.” It’s 2.5 hours long, followed by a Jimmy Kimmel: Aloha to Lost show, after the news.
3. Monday start watching the show all over again.

Anyone else just a tad bit nervous?

[PeteSB75]

I'm waiting to hear what you guys say about it before I decide to continue watching from where I left off at the end of Season 2.

[weak_link]

I think Jack is going to get knocked off in the final battle and someone else will have to fill that role.

[Tripp]

I think Jack is going to get knocked off in the final battle and someone else will have to fill that role.

My theory at this point is that Jack and all of the other candidates will get killed, and Hurley will become the new Jacob, and Hurley will die in the flash sideways. Then somehow, the 2 universes will merge, so everything will be fine. :2

[weak_link]

My theory at this point is that Jack and all of the other candidates will get killed, and Hurley will become the new Jacob, and Hurley will die in the flash sideways. Then somehow, the 2 universes will merge, so everything will be fine. :2

My original theory was that Hurley would be 'The Man' so I can buy into that. Except the merge, that's too trippy for me to work it out in my head.

[tomc3084]

I cannot wait for Sunday's episode....they say it starts at 7:00, so will it be 3 hrs you think?

[Tripp]

I cannot wait for Sunday's episode....they say it starts at 7:00, so will it be 3 hrs you think?

There's going to be a 2 hour recap at 7, and the 2.5 hour finale is at 9.

[JE3146]

When this flash sideways thing appeared... I figured there was going to be two things that happened... the sideways would resolve into peace.. and the island would resolve into chaos...

The sideways of course.. only resolves into peace BECAUSE of the flashbacks to an unknown connection and alternate reality.

The viewer will get to choose which is real.

That's my take on it...

[3SmokesaRound]

Not sure if I have enough room on my DVR for another 6 hours of LOST. Can't freaking wait for it though!

[OLS]

There's going to be a 2 hour recap at 7, and the 2.5 hour finale is at 9.Stupida$$ recaps!! Don't they know I have to WORK in the morning. I DID kind of get hooked on the "enhanced episodes" for dummies that explained wtf was going on that I had no clue about. I swear, these graphics say all these things and I go WHAT? WHO? The man in black? Flocke? what show is this. Some of that is kidding. :) But they don't call it LOST for nuthin.

[white_s2k]

Finale is almost here!!!:tu

[Kreth]

Dammit, I hate this show! Watched the pilot last night because nothing else was on, now I'm watching the recap. I think we'll be buying some DVDs in the future.
Posted via Mobile Device

[Brutus2600]

I've given the DVR a little bit of a buffer and I'm getting ready to watch the final episode right now. Pretty excited!

[OLS]

I think what I love about TV, is that it never changes. Flocke is wrapping up ten feet of rope
on his shoulder in camp or wherever, then as they lower Desmond down, they have a hundred feet.
When they shoot bows and arrows with dynamite, it will have come full circle. OK so Locke is in
Dr. Jack' hands. That's too obvious. But I think it's clear that it's gonna be Hurley in the end. Stay behind, my A$$.

[tomc3084]

I think what I love about TV, is that it never changes. Flocke is wrapping up ten feet of rope
on his shoulder in camp or wherever, then as they lower Desmond down, they have a hundred feet.
When they shoot bows and arrows with dynamite, it will have come full circle. OK so Locke is in
Dr. Jack' hands. That's too obvious. But I think it's clear that it's gonna be Hurley in the end. Stay behind, my A$$.

Wow you guys pick up on things I wouldnt have even thought of if for not seeing this thread

[white_s2k]

Edited: wait til West Coast catches up!!!

[Mugen910]

gawd I hope the west coast guys don't read this yet.

[white_s2k]

gawd I hope the west coast guys don't read this yet.

Didn't even think about it.. I'll wait;s

[Mugen910]

Didn't even think about it.. I'll wait;s

:tu
It's ok I forget about the west side often ;)

[Brutus2600]

I'll discuss this tomorrow so the west coasties don't accidentally read this.

P.S. What are you west coasters doing in this thread before the end of series anyway? :p haha

[Beagleone]

I have comments, but I will wait until tomorrow to write them down here.

[tomc3084]

I missed the damn thing and I was even posting on this thread while it was on, I am such a dumbass....anyone tape it? I know I can watch it online the day after it airs, but its not the same..FUDGE!

[MikeyC]

An absolutely awesome series finale. Not all questions were a swedes in the end but I'm still pretty satisfied. In the end the mysteries of the island were less important than a great story about people.

[Eleven]

I'm LOST.

[Goldie]

I wanted to have my questions about the island answered, rather than get such a story about the people. Maybe I'm focusing on the wrong thing?

[Skywalker]

Were the polar bears dead too???:confused:
http://riverdaughter.files.wordpress.com/2009/06/polar-bear-tongue.jpg









:r:r:r

[JE3146]

I wanted to have my questions about the island answered, rather than get such a story about the people. Maybe I'm focusing on the wrong thing?

You missed the big picture... big time.


The ending, while not immediately predictable was obviously rememberable.


And to people focusing on rope lengths... just wow.

[JE3146]

I missed the damn thing and I was even posting on this thread while it was on, I am such a dumbass....anyone tape it? I know I can watch it online the day after it airs, but its not the same..FUDGE!


http://www.youtube.com/watch#!v=wSdviB3ncO0&feature=related

[kugie]

i'm not sure what to think :confused:
I will have to watch it again

[Brutus2600]

You missed the big picture... big time.


The ending, while not immediately predictable was obviously rememberable.


And to people focusing on rope lengths... just wow.

I'm not entirely sure he did miss the big picture. Yes, I realize the finale was saying "oh hey, it's about the people, not about the island" but then why for SIX YEARS have they made it all about the island? Yes there was a great storyline about people and their life's journies, and I did appreciate the finale from that aspect, but the show was also about the island and I think they really didn't finish the show's story by leaving out any sort of explanation about the island :td

[SeanGAR]

I didn't see the finale ... did the professor finally get them off?

http://repairstemcell.files.wordpress.com/2009/04/gillians-island-mobile.jpg

[Goldie]

You missed the big picture... big time.


The ending, while not immediately predictable was obviously rememberable.


And to people focusing on rope lengths... just wow.


Unfortunately, the big picture isn't what has left me with the most questions. I can follow the story line (Sort of I guess, this is Lost after all) , but I would like several things explained in regards to the island, and some of the occurrences that happened. I feel as though the writers were able to brush things under the rug, that LOTS of fans wanted to have explained.

And lots of people have an inquisitive nature, so when we do focus on "rope lengths", that's our right to do so. No need to be brash. Just as it is your right to focus on the bigger picture.

And I have to agree with Brian, for 6 seasons, the show was about the island as a primary, so when they don't explain anything about the island in the finale, it is probably frustrating to a lot of people. I also think a lot of people want closure, where some people want to draw their own conclusion or interpretation, and that's fine. That's what makes us different from each other. But I am a closure person, so I would like things spelled out for me.

But when it's all said and done, the series was amazing, and truly will be hard to out do.

:2

[Kreth]

Posted via Mobile Device

[dannysguitar]

I kinda feel the same way. The island story was kinda resolved. Hurley was left in charge until he dies, and so on. I just can't wrap my head around all of the questions I still have about the island and it's mythical properties. I guess in the end the show was a story about Jack and his redemption. The rest was just extra stuff to keep us entertained in the meantime...

[Beagleone]

I think the Simpsons said it best last night with this opening sequence:

http://i.huffpost.com/gen/168483/SIMPSONS-LOST.jpg


Seriously, I did have to grapple with it in my mind for a while, but I do get it. The show ends as it begins and it made some sense to me. It was about choice and it was Jack who had to make that choice, something they hinted at all season long: Jack had to let go. Rose said that to him in the first episode this season and several others said it in one way or another. The producers already knew that not all of the questions would be answered, but that will fuel the debate of "Lost" for years to come.

[weak_link]

I'm not entirely sure he did miss the big picture. Yes, I realize the finale was saying "oh hey, it's about the people, not about the island" but then why for SIX YEARS have they made it all about the island? Yes there was a great storyline about people and their life's journies, and I did appreciate the finale from that aspect, but the show was also about the island and I think they really didn't finish the show's story by leaving out any sort of explanation about the island :td

THIS.

1-10 I give it a 4.5.

At least we know that Vincent is the grim reaper.

[Eleven]

Now that I have had time to think about it, I get *most* of it.

Ben's ending confused me a little, and why were some of the Losties left out of the Church reunion? Like Ann Lucia? I have to look again, but was Daniel in the Church? Desmond told his mother that Daniel wasn't coming with them if I recall correctly.

I'm OK with not being told the entire story/history/reason for the Island itself, it allows for speculation.

And now that I think of it, the best part of all were the scenes as the credits ran. I have to go back and look at those closely. At first I thought it was a look at the first Oceanic crash, the scenes from the First Episode, but now I think it was actually the plane that had Lapidus, Kate, Sawyer and the others on it.

Can't wait on the detailed notes to show up here.

[JE3146]

Now that I have had time to think about it, I get *most* of it.

Ben's ending confused me a little, and why were some of the Losties left out of the Church reunion? Like Ann Lucia? I have to look again, but was Daniel in the Church? Desmond told his mother that Daniel wasn't coming with them if I recall correctly.

I'm OK with not being told the entire story/history/reason for the Island itself, it allows for speculation.

And now that I think of it, the best part of all were the scenes as the credits ran. I have to go back and look at those closely. At first I thought it was a look at the first Oceanic crash, the scenes from the First Episode, but now I think it was actually the plane that had Lapidus, Kate, Sawyer and the others on it.

Can't wait on the detailed notes to show up here.


You'll notice every person 'found' each other before 'leaving.'

The obvious destiny of Daniel was to be with Charlotte, but both were never truly together, whether separated by time, space or death.

Each person found happiness. They found resolve and they proceeded onward. Not every person had resolve yet, and as Hurley pointed out, Anna Lucia wasn't 'ready' yet.

I didn't see Michael and Walt in that room either. I didn't see Charle's Widmore either, so I'm hoping neither of them will show up in a repeat viewing and blow my idea to hell, which is entirely possible.

And for the record, the Target commercials were genius. :r

[JE3146]

I kinda feel the same way. The island story was kinda resolved. Hurley was left in charge until he dies, and so on. I just can't wrap my head around all of the questions I still have about the island and it's mythical properties. I guess in the end the show was a story about Jack and his redemption. The rest was just extra stuff to keep us entertained in the meantime...

Groups of people inhabited the island for decades/centuries looking for clues to the island's mysteries. To the people protecting it, it boiled down to Faith.

[dannysguitar]

Groups of people inhabited the island for decades/centuries looking for clues to the island's mysteries. To the people protecting it, it boiled down to Faith.

Yeah, that makes a lot of sense. I wonder how Jacob got off the Island all the time....

[Volt]

So, I have never seen an issue of Lost, what did I miss?