Collectible Vs "share the share" (discuss)

muhren · 12-16-2011, 01:31 PM

I'm curious as I see prices all over the place. You can feel free to answer any, none, or all...A couple thoughts for discussion's sake:

1. If a cigar is unavailable (not produced anymore) should there be a secondary market mark-up? If so, how much?
Follow-up: would you pay that mark-up?

2. If a cigar is hard to find, should there be a secondary market mark-up?
Follow-up: would you pay that mark-up?

I'll post a poll too for quick answers...why not?!

M

Mugen910 · 12-16-2011, 01:32 PM

why? what are you trying to sell?

icehog3 · 12-16-2011, 01:36 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by muhren

1. If a cigar is unavailable (not produced anymore) should there be a secondary market mark-up? Yes. If so, how much? Fair market value.

Follow-up: would you pay that mark-up? Yes.

2. If a cigar is hard to find, should there be a secondary market mark-up?
Follow-up: would you pay that mark-up?

See above.

And I am saying that from a buyer's perspective, as I rarely sell cigars.

12-16-2011, 01:40 PM

How much would a Picasso be worth if there were 15 million of them?

How much would a Van Gogh be worth if he were still alive producing them today?

MurphysLaw · 12-16-2011, 01:40 PM

I'm with Tom, I'm not opposed to paying markup for something I can't easily get my hands on, as long as the price is fair. Fair is a relative term as well, what I think may be an absurd markup may be what someone else is willing to pay.

Subvet642 · 12-16-2011, 01:45 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by MurphysLaw

I'm with Tom, I'm not opposed to paying markup for something I can't easily get my hands on, as long as the price is fair. Fair is a relative term as well, what I think may be an absurd markup may be what someone else is willing to pay.

Ditto.

pektel · 12-16-2011, 01:48 PM

What they said.

As long as it's not price gouging, I don't see the problem.

D Man · 12-16-2011, 02:58 PM

Supply and Demand

12-16-2011, 03:13 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by D Man

Supply and Demand

Exactly. The market will work out the price as long as it is allowed to.

muhren · 12-16-2011, 04:20 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by goomer

Exactly. The market will work out the price as long as it is allowed to.

Follow-up on this...

IF the FDA gains control of cigars and advertising stops, walk-ins stop, blends must be approved, etc.

Does that make cigars created RIGHT NOW (or prior), ahead of any possible regulation, worth holding on to?

Just curious.

M

icehog3 · 12-16-2011, 04:27 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by muhren

Follow-up on this...

IF the FDA gains control of cigars and advertising stops, walk-ins stop, blends must be approved, etc.

Does that make cigars created RIGHT NOW (or prior), ahead of any possible regulation, worth holding on to?

Hsdn't heard anything about blend approval, what have you heard?

Absent that, I don't see anything making them more desirable after that legislation/regulation than before.

muhren · 12-16-2011, 04:38 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by icehog3

Hsdn't heard anything about blend approval, what have you heard?

Absent that, I don't see anything making them more desirable after that legislation/regulation than before.

http://www.cigarrights.org/newslette...ate_120211.htm

Bullet point #7 (near bottom middle of the page)

M

icehog3 · 12-16-2011, 04:47 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by muhren

http://www.cigarrights.org/newslette...ate_120211.htm

Bullet point #7 (near bottom middle of the page)

M

Gotcha...apparently just speculation on the part of CRA.

Taki · 12-16-2011, 04:48 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by muhren

Follow-up on this...

IF the FDA gains control of cigars and advertising stops, walk-ins stop, blends must be approved, etc.

Does that make cigars created RIGHT NOW (or prior), ahead of any possible regulation, worth holding on to?

Just curious.

M

Absolutely worth holding on too...I hope it would never get to that but you never know. As for the other question as long as its not an out of control price I would pay

12-16-2011, 04:49 PM

If the ban on flavored cigars goes through I would imagine certain cigars like Acids will be worth more. The biggest effect will be on the lack of affordable cigars due to the end of online ordering and the availability of cigars in many rural areas that don't have a good cigar shop.

muhren · 12-16-2011, 04:54 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by goomer

If the ban on flavored cigars goes through I would imagine certain cigars like Acids will be worth more. The biggest effect will be on the lack of affordable cigars due to the end of online ordering and the availability of cigars in many rural areas that don't have a good cigar shop.

Yeah...most mail order would be gone...if I'm reading correctly. But, they're making it sound like walk-ins would be gone too.

It would be like buying a pack of cigs at the gas station..."Gimme a robusto monte white and this pack of shulies gum."

M

DPD6030 · 12-16-2011, 06:32 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by icehog3

And I am saying that from a buyer's perspective, as I rarely sell cigars.

Quote:

Originally Posted by Resipsa

How much would a Picasso be worth if there were 15 million of them?

How much would a Van Gogh be worth if he were still alive producing them today?

I don't know Vic but I sure would want one still

Maybe when I die my finger paintings will be worth more than the paper they are on

replicant_argent · 12-16-2011, 07:04 PM

Certainly your background and Cum Laude degree in ... let's see.. what was it?

Advertising?

Would allow you to answer this for yourself.

muhren · 12-17-2011, 06:41 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by icehog3

Gotcha...apparently just speculation on the part of CRA.

Yeah, it's hard to get a good grasp on what might really happen because I tend to only get information via CRA and it's "end of the world stuff".

I did their form letter to the congressman and senator is my area and I got a form letter back stating how horrible tobacco is on the health of the society. Most of the references were to Cigarette smokers though.

Either way....it'll be interesting.

M

12-17-2011, 06:57 AM

I saw a news story last night about how a few congressmen were pushing the FDA to ban flavored cigars. Evidently there's a study that shows more teens, and pre-teens, are smoking flavored cigars these days. Unfortunately, they aren't differentiating between flavored premium cigars and swisher sweets. My guess is those teens are getting their hands on the swisher sweets. I would also bet that many of them are not smoking the swisher sweet but only the wrapper with an alternative filler.

Once again congress is trying to regulate based on ignorance.

View Poll Results: Mark-up on out-of-production or aged stock?
Yes. They stored it and aged it.	33	44.00%
Yes. If I can get something I couldn't before, it's worth it.	33	44.00%
No. What they paid is what they should charge.	7	9.33%
No. If they're selling, it must be worth less, not more.	2	2.67%
Voters: 75. You may not vote on this poll

12-16-2011, 01:31 PM	#1
muhren The Cigar Artist Join Date: Sep 2009 First Name: Mike Location: Ohio Posts: 1,268 Trading: (43)	Collectible Vs "share the share" (discuss) I'm curious as I see prices all over the place. You can feel free to answer any, none, or all...A couple thoughts for discussion's sake: 1. If a cigar is unavailable (not produced anymore) should there be a secondary market mark-up? If so, how much? Follow-up: would you pay that mark-up? 2. If a cigar is hard to find, should there be a secondary market mark-up? Follow-up: would you pay that mark-up? I'll post a poll too for quick answers...why not?! M __________________ Cigar Art available for sale: www.mikeuhren.com

12-16-2011, 01:32 PM	#2
Mugen910 I <3 Huy Join Date: Oct 2008 First Name: Location Location: First Name Posts: 8,387 Trading: (106)	Re: Collectible Vs "share the share" (discuss) why? what are you trying to sell? __________________ I'm not antisocial, I just think people are stupid.

12-16-2011, 01:40 PM	#4
Resipsa Guest Posts: n/a	Re: Collectible Vs "share the share" (discuss) How much would a Picasso be worth if there were 15 million of them? How much would a Van Gogh be worth if he were still alive producing them today?

12-16-2011, 01:40 PM	#5
MurphysLaw Anything can go wrong Join Date: Dec 2010 First Name: Brian Location: SoFlo Posts: 2,823 Trading: (19)	Re: Collectible Vs "share the share" (discuss) I'm with Tom, I'm not opposed to paying markup for something I can't easily get my hands on, as long as the price is fair. Fair is a relative term as well, what I think may be an absurd markup may be what someone else is willing to pay. __________________ It's THIS easy to help our Troops.

12-16-2011, 01:48 PM	#7
pektel I'm nuts for the place Join Date: Jul 2010 First Name: Peter Location: Grand Rapids, MN Posts: 4,320 Trading: (28)	Re: Collectible Vs "share the share" (discuss) What they said. As long as it's not price gouging, I don't see the problem. __________________ The problem is not the problem. The problem is your ATTITUDE about the problem.

12-16-2011, 02:58 PM	#8
D Man Grip it and Rip it Join Date: Sep 2011 First Name: Dan Location: Avon Lake Ohio Posts: 54 Trading: (2)	Re: Collectible Vs "share the share" (discuss) Supply and Demand

12-16-2011, 04:49 PM	#15
goomer Guest Posts: n/a	Re: Collectible Vs "share the share" (discuss) If the ban on flavored cigars goes through I would imagine certain cigars like Acids will be worth more. The biggest effect will be on the lack of affordable cigars due to the end of online ordering and the availability of cigars in many rural areas that don't have a good cigar shop.

12-16-2011, 07:04 PM	#18
replicant_argent Gravy Boat Winnah. Join Date: Oct 2008 First Name: Pete Location: my attorney has advised against giving this information to insane people Posts: 5,326 Trading: (22)	Re: Collectible Vs "share the share" (discuss) Certainly your background and Cum Laude degree in ... let's see.. what was it? Advertising? Would allow you to answer this for yourself. __________________ www.stogietorch.com Some days call for a stiff Pomade.

12-17-2011, 06:57 AM	#20
goomer Guest Posts: n/a	Re: Collectible Vs "share the share" (discuss) I saw a news story last night about how a few congressmen were pushing the FDA to ban flavored cigars. Evidently there's a study that shows more teens, and pre-teens, are smoking flavored cigars these days. Unfortunately, they aren't differentiating between flavored premium cigars and swisher sweets. My guess is those teens are getting their hands on the swisher sweets. I would also bet that many of them are not smoking the swisher sweet but only the wrapper with an alternative filler. Once again congress is trying to regulate based on ignorance.