Coin Collecting/Buying

[Buckeye Jack]

So I have a question about buying coins. Specifically, uncirculated Silver Eagles. I am just wanting to buy back to 2008 (year my son was born) and start buying annually. This is merely a collectible, I don't care about the investment part of this.....though at the same time I want to make sure what I'm buying or how I'm storing doesn't hurt the value.

My main question revolves around the fact that I went ahead and signed up for (and can still cancel if this makes no sense) the annual uncirculated one from the US Mint. It's basically $40. Comes sealed in a plastic case from what I can tell in the pic.

When I was looking at a site I found online though, they had uncirculated for like half that price, including pre-ordering the 2016.

So my question is why? If I order 2008-2015 for half the price of the annual program, do they just come loose? Not sealed? Is that what I'm paying double the price for? I also noticed the one I am buying from the mint has a mint mark and the older (cheaper) ones say they do not.

I really know nothing about coin collecting, again, just thought it would be neat to buy these for him to have one day. I appreciate any and all information!

[shilala]

You can buy the cases on Amazon for next to nothing.
I have a 1991 silver eagle that sits here on my desk.
No specific reason, I just think they're gorgeous.

I also drag money home from all the other countries we visit, once again, just because I admire the art. I buy plastic bill holders to put them in.

US Mint is there to make money. I won't say anything bad, cause you already found the answer. You can find brilliant uncirculated coins anywhere, including the bank for face value.
Proofs are different. They're double struck, super fine, and really completely unnecessary.
And that's not what you're getting.

[shilala]

I looked on Amazon.
You can get any of the years you want for about $26 shipped, brother. You can probably do better, I didn't look hard.
25 air-tight cases, the good ones, are 19 bucks, Prime.
This is the cheapest I found a 2015.

[mosesbotbol]

Are the uncirculated coins all polished up like the proof sets?

[shark]

Originally Posted by mosesbotbol

Are the uncirculated coins all polished up like the proof sets?

No, they're just that, uncirculated examples of what would be released into the money supply. Proofs are strictly collectors items. The dies are polished and inspected to make sure they are perfect

[shark]

http://www.usmint.gov/about_the_mint...action=grading

[shilala]

Uncirculated just means they haven't reached people's pockets yet.
The mint throws a bunch of coins in big bags and they go to the banks.
They get thrown around, jostled, etc.
Even if a guy is buying from the mint, they get no special handling that I'm aware of.
So they can get little scratches, marring, and so forth.

On the other hand, a proof is perfect.

In the scheme of things, the difference means absolutely nothing.
So far as appreciation goes, a 2008 coin is worth the same as a 2015 coin (uncircluated).
Point being, it's not a money-making venture of any sort.
It's just plain fun, like collection state quarters and stuff.

You can get really swank velvet lined cases to display the coins, which is also cool.
You'll have lots of fun doing it, Jack. That's where the value is.

Moses, proofs aren't polished, at least not that I'm aware of.
I'm talking from years ago when I used to have books and collect all kinds of change.
Proofs are double struck. Meaning They hit them twice in the press. Regular coinage just gets mashed once.
That double striking is what makes them so fine and perfect.
Then they are handled very carefully and cased up as proofs, or proof sets.
Proof sets have a penny, nickel, dime, quarter, and 50 cent piece in them.
Old proof sets sell for big money. So do new ones. It's kind of nuts.
But some people will spend all kinds of money on goofy hobbies.

[omahaorange]

Don't confuse the silver eagle with the quarters in your pocket. The eagle is minted as a bullion coin, and was never intended to circulate. It is is a one ounce silver coin. Remember the kuggarnd from South Africa? Uncirculated verses proof refer to the way the coin is struck. There are some decent explanations already given.

As a bullion coin, you can buy them from the US Mint with the pretty packaging and pay the premium for that. The mint also sells them loose in bulk packaging to coin and bullion dealers. They are shipped in plastic tubes, unlike regular coins that are shipped in bulk bags, so there is little jostling during shipping. These dealers buy at a little above the spot price of silver, and sell them to us for a little bit more. They can be had for $18-26 each this way. Look for places like this:

http://www.apmex.com/?&promo=google|...FZJr7AodBCUAJQ

Look around this site for inexpensive holders:

http://www.jpscorner.com

You can get them alot cheaper, and find the years you want, by bypassing the mint.

[omahaorange]

Shilaha,

Actually the proof coins themselves are not polished, but the planchets (blanks) are, along with dies. They are double struck under higher pressure, then removed and packaged by hand. This gives them better shine and higher detail than a regular strike.

[AdamJoshua]

Right on the front page of that site is the 2016 Silver Eagle for Unit Price: $18.65*

[Buckeye Jack]

Originally Posted by omahaorange

As a bullion coin, you can buy them from the US Mint with the pretty packaging and pay the premium for that.

Awesome, this is what I was thinking but just needed to verify. I will go ahead and cancel my annual order with the mint and just buy from the dealer.

Thank you to everyone who spoke up! Going to be a lot easier on the budget to buy them all at $17-$18 then the $40 on the mint!

[stearns]

Great info Russ, thanks for posting up

[mosesbotbol]

Collecting for a child, I'd think the proof's would be a better in the long run, no?

[Buckeye Jack]

Maybe for some. I personally just wanted to buy him a coin every year since birth that wasn't a regular coin. Seems to me just the fact that they aren't used monetarily is neat in of itself. The fact that they are uncirculated means they should be in damn near perfect condition. No need for the polished double stamp in my opinion. Others I'm sure disagree.

[CigarGuy88]

Originally Posted by Buckeye Jack

Maybe for some. I personally just wanted to buy him a coin every year since birth that wasn't a regular coin. Seems to me just the fact that they aren't used monetarily is neat in of itself. The fact that they are uncirculated means they should be in damn near perfect condition. No need for the polished double stamp in my opinion. Others I'm sure disagree.

As any numismatist knows... damn near perfect and perfect are two completely different things and can mean the difference in 10's of thousands of dollars in value (in extreme cases). There's a reason why dealers charge a premium for the best of the best MS69-MS70 and PF69-PF70 graded coins. Uncirculated coins require a grade of MS60 or higher, so thats 10 grades between the lowest uncirculated grading and "prefect".The only reason in my mind to pay a premium is if the coin in graded to be perfect.

[Buckeye Jack]

Originally Posted by Buckeye Jack

This is merely a collectible, I don't care about the investment part of this.....though at the same time I want to make sure what I'm buying or how I'm storing doesn't hurt the value.

Originally Posted by CigarGuy88

damn near perfect and perfect are two completely different things and can mean the difference in 10's of thousands of dollars in value (in extreme cases).

And I totally get that, that's why I mentioned in my first post...not worried about the value

[omahaorange]

Either strike is one ounce of silver. Even though the coin has a face value of $1.00, they are really worth the value of the silver content. This value fluctuates with the market, but they will always be worth the silver. The eagles, are in fact, legal tender, and should be accepted at face value for spending. Sounds stupid, but some (who obviously did not purchase them), in the past, have tried it. I pick one up every year, and have a set of these dating from the first issue in 1986, and did not buy one from the mint. I also bought one for each my children and my granddaughter, from the year each was born. I also have mint sets, and both clad and silver proof sets, from those years as well. These sets can be picked up at any reputable coin dealer, both on-line and B&M, relatively inexpensively. Makes a nice complete set of birth year coins as keepsakes.

The difference between proofs and regular strikes is in the collector value. Either will always be worth the silver in them, but when you pay a premium for the proof strike, the collector market influences the price more than the metal content, which my fluctuate wildly depending on those market conditions. So you may lose the premium you paid for the proof strike a few years down the road.

[themoneycollector]

Originally Posted by shilala

On the other hand, a proof is perfect.

Proofs are also graded on the 0-70 scale just like uncirculated coins. And a perfect proof graded PF-70 is still quite rare.

Proofs will usually be better in terms of collectability, but unless that particular date ends up being a rarity, it's unlikely to ever recoup the markup for being a proof. Which is why those 1965+ yearly proof sets are not very desirable/valuable.

Even better yet for collecting and future value would be buying graded and slabbed coins. And graded proofs would be even better.

About buying current coins:

You are better off buying from ebay. There are some rare dates (like the 1986 & 1996), but in general, silver eagles are just bullion and their price/value will be based off the 1oz price of silver. So you know you got a good deal if you paid close to spot price and you're getting ripped off if you are paying much more than spot. There will always be a premium over spot, which is ~$14 right now, so that $18.95 price is pretty fair. The mint is not really in the business of making profit

I actually don't even know how dealers are able to order bulk from the mint and they must get them at spot prices, because otherwise, I'd be placing bulk orders myself.

[omahaorange]

Actually, the Mint is in it to make money:

http://lexicon.ft.com/term?term=seigniorage

They may not be doing too well now, but this can generate revenue for the Treasury Department.

The '96 is the key date to the set, but not impossible to find. Production was limited that year. The one I bought a few years ago was about double the other years. You're only going back to 2008, they minted millions, so you should easily find them and pick up for a little over spot.

[mncigarguy]

I bet the ones from the mint are proof sets and the others are uncirculated. I used to buy rolls of 20 eagles for under 125 bucks, sold when silver went up. It's a cool thing to do for your child but you are not going to make money only loose it, I read that didn't matter so no big deal. 10 coin proof sets won't be as volatile.you can look at the link below to see what happens over the years with values. There are silver and gold bullion websites as well that sell direct. It's all good to buy if prices are historically low.
http://www.pcgs.com/prices/