The Wine Thread

[mosesbotbol]

Originally Posted by JohnnyFlake

What are your thoughts on the 5yr, 10yr and maybe 20yr, Sercial vs Malmsey vs Bual?

Sercial is one of the driest styles of port. Malmsey is the sweetest and Bual is close to Malmsey. Sercial is not for everyone. Just as the Verdelho is on the dry side too.

5 years is not enough for Madeira for me. Broadbents 5 year is pretty good for that age, but if you can swing 10 year it's worth it.

There's not much for 20 year. 15 seems to be the next after 10. Broadbents 1996 Colheita is good too. I split a case with my accountant, but have not tried it yet. He likes it.

[JohnnyFlake]

Originally Posted by mosesbotbol

Sercial is one of the driest styles of port. Malmsey is the sweetest and Bual is close to Malmsey. Sercial is not for everyone. Just as the Verdelho is on the dry side too.

5 years is not enough for Madeira for me. Broadbents 5 year is pretty good for that age, but if you can swing 10 year it's worth it.

There's not much for 20 year. 15 seems to be the next after 10. Broadbents 1996 Colheita is good too. I split a case with my accountant, but have not tried it yet. He likes it.

Thanks for you input.

I'm going to pick up a 10yr Bual and/or Verdeho this weekend to try. I have noticed you seem to like Broadbents. I am not sure if I can find that brand around my area (Henderson, Nevada). Blandy & Sandman are the most common. What others brands do you suggest?

Also, what is Colheita? Is that a brand or a style of Madeira?

[landhoney]

Originally Posted by mosesbotbol

There's not much for 20 year. 15 seems to be the next after 10.

Isn't this because at 21 years old it can be declared with a vintage date?

[rizzle]

Whoa...check out what I want to subject myself to.

The Aroma and Flavour of Brett Character

But what is Brett character and how and why does it appear in some wines? The wine character described as "Bretty" comes in various forms. It is the combined result of the creation of a number of compounds by the yeast Brettanomyces bruxellensis, and its close relative, Dekkera bruxulensis. The three most important known aroma active compounds are 1) 4-ethyl phenol (4-ep), which has been variously described as having the aromas of Band-aids®, antiseptic and horse stable 2) 4-ethyl guaiacol (4-eg) which has a rather pleasant aroma of smoked bacon, spice or cloves and 3) isovaleric acid which has an unpleasant smell of sweaty animals, cheese and rancidity. Other characters associated with Brett include wet dog, creosote, burnt beans, rotting vegetation, plastic and (but not exclusively caused by Brett) mouse cage aroma and vinegar

http://www.aromadictionary.com/artic...s_article.html

That just sounds nasty.

[landhoney]

Originally Posted by rizzle

Whoa...check out what I want to subject myself to.



http://www.aromadictionary.com/artic...s_article.html

That just sounds nasty.

It's not all bad though, again at least in beer, the current 9th highest rated beer in the world on beeradvocate uses Brett to achieve a unique flavor profile.

There used to be a Madiera thread. That may have been before Oct '08 ;D

I'm looking to pick up some whites from Loire Valley. Can anyone recommend some good readily available wines?

[TheRiddick]

Nate, look for Huet. They make some dry ones as well as spectacular sweets.

Originally Posted by TheRiddick

Nate, look for Huet. They make some dry ones as well as spectacular sweets.

Thanks, I'll look for some of their offerings.

Loire Valley is "the place" for whites in France right?

[TheRiddick]

Also, Champalou (imported by Kermit Lynch) make some of the better wines there, both dry and sparkling at lower prices than Huet. Both of these are in Vouvray region.

If you're into sweet wines (after dinner and with cigars) along with those of Huet I'd also look into Domaine Baumard (or others from Quarts de Chaume/Coteaux du Layon regions).

On the dry Loires front, some of the better producers are located in Sancerre region: Marc Brediff and Henri Bourgeois both make great wines.

[TheRiddick]

Not sure I'd call Loire "the" place for whites in France :-) There is always Alsace region producing some spectacular whites, both dry and not. Bordeaux region makes some of the best whites as well, pricey, but incredible. And there are whites in Burgundy (Chardonnay) as well Rhone (Marsanne/Rousanne/Viognier grapes). It all depends on what you're in the mood for and how much your wallet can stand the abuse :-)

[mosesbotbol]

Originally Posted by TheRiddick

Not sure I'd call Loire "the" place for whites in France :-) There is always Alsace region producing some spectacular whites, both dry and not. Bordeaux region makes some of the best whites as well, pricey, but incredible. And there are whites in Burgundy (Chardonnay) as well Rhone (Marsanne/Rousanne/Viognier grapes). It all depends on what you're in the mood for and how much your wallet can stand the abuse :-)

The most expensive whites are from Burgundy, including Meursault and Chevalier-Montrachet. Rhone has some nice whites from CdP and Cote Rotie. Generally Meursault is 'top of the pops' when it comes to white wine in France. Loire has lost popularity with the consumer, but is a great value due to that.

It depends what you are in the mood for as TheRiddick has mentioned. White Burgs are being dumped by a lot of distributors as many consumers aren't spending $50+ on white wine like they use to. Some great deals in the bin ends locally for me.

[TheRiddick]

Originally Posted by mosesbotbol

The most expensive whites are from Burgundy, including Meursault and Chevalier-Montrachet.

Moses, I know you have a Euro-centric palate and cellar, but I am sure white wine producers in Bordeaux (and other regions in France) will disagree with you statement. When was the last time you looked at Sauternes prices? Or those of dry whites from Haut-Brion and such? They make very little (when compared to their red programs), and I only wish prices for Bordeaux whites would be in affordable category (some DRY whites reach $400 per bottle, although spectacular wines by any measure). I'd be a buyer, for sure. Most, if not all, white Burgs are affordable. North Rhone whites are more expensive than white Burgs, Chave comes to mind (Hermitage White, they start at $200 and quickly go up, that is if you can find a bottle) and there are others. Even Beaucastel white is more expensive than Burgs and its Southern Rhone.

White Burgs are much more known and more readily available, but price wise, they are not top of the heap. Bordeaux, North Rhone and Alsace are more expensive, in that order, with sweet Loires taking 4th place.

[mosesbotbol]

Originally Posted by TheRiddick

Moses, I know you have a Euro-centric palate and cellar, but I am sure white wine producers in Bordeaux (and other regions in France) will disagree with you statement. When was the last time you looked at Sauternes prices?

I wanted to stick with dry wines and keep it very general.

David. It didn't even occur to me to ask him if he was related. Even after he mentioned his winery was in the hills above Tobin James' place.

Originally Posted by BC-Axeman

I just met a Paso Robles winemaker named David James at a cigar lounge (Perfecto) here. There is some kind of Syrah Days or something like that going on and he was exhibiting an '05 he made. He stopped in for a cigar and opened up a bottle for tasting. Very nice. Good mixture of oak, no brett and a smooth long finish. You never know who you will meet.

Originally Posted by hammondc

David James or Tobin James? A friend of mine brought me some Cab and Red Zin from Tobin James Winery in Paso Robles a while back. Some of the best stuff I have ever had. I wish I could get it in TX.

Originally Posted by BC-Axeman

David. It didn't even occur to me to ask him if he was related. Even after he mentioned his winery was in the hills above Tobin James' place.

Hmm...
His name is David Cole. His winery is called James David Cellars. I have no idea where the "James" came from since his website calls out a whole bunch of family members and none are named James. Maybe his name is James David Cole. I always have a problem with two first names, keeping them straight.

[mosesbotbol]

I bet there are pipes going back 100+ years that are still being bottled. The thing nice with vintage port is that the bottle is that old too.

[TheRiddick]

Parker LOVES this sh#t! Openly admits to it and on top of that, teaches others they should LOVE this as well. And then people ask me why I so disagree with Parker's notes so often, his palate has been destroyed for years now and he actually gives higher scores to wines with brett (also his own admission).

Its really nasty stuff and it spreads like wildfire in the winery.

[mosesbotbol]

Originally Posted by TheRiddick

Parker LOVES this sh#t! Openly admits to it and on top of that, teaches others they should LOVE this as well.

One could argue if these wines have always had Brett that it could be considered part of their terrior, no? I don't mind a little in them, it adds to complexity, but can spread and dominate very easily too.