It's happend

[Asher]

Originally Posted by RX2010

don't worry, Jon's actions will work themselves out

It puts a smile on my face just to think about how much money he must be losing.

[madurolover]

Originally Posted by Asher

It puts a smile on my face just to think about how much money he must be losing.

For some reason I do not think that Jon is hurting financially.

[DrDubzz]

Originally Posted by madurolover

For some reason I do not think that Jon is hurting financially.

well he certainly never spent much on cigars, anyone else remember that weak-A humidor? (in terms of what was in it, the humi wasn't half bad)

Originally Posted by madurolover

For some reason I do not think that Jon is hurting financially.

Well, not yet anyway.

This just goes to prove a point, you can buy a forum and webspace and serverspace. You can buy a logo and a list of users but you CAN'T buy people. We are not slaves or endentured servants and we the people will revolt, or is that we the people are revolting? Anyway, you catch my drift.

Cheers,
Rob

[BigBruce]

Wow I think they banned that newt guy. Guess he came off wrong but that went down hill fast.

[madurolover]

Originally Posted by No1der

Well, not yet anyway.

This just goes to prove a point, you can buy a forum and webspace and serverspace. You can buy a logo and a list of users but you CAN'T buy people. We are not slaves or endentured servants and we the people will revolt, or is that we the people are revolting? Anyway, you catch my drift.

Cheers,
Rob

I don't think he will go broke. The site is not going to survive because of long-term members. Just like DevShed which is another site he did the same thing with. While there are some regulars there it is mostly people who come on, ask a question and get it answered. They then move on until they have another question. The site probably gets 1,000's of clicks a day. That is where the money comes from. Not long time members but site traffic. He may not be a BOTL but he is a businessman and you can believe that.

Originally Posted by madurolover

I don't think he will go broke. The site is not going to survive because of long-term members. Just like DevShed which is another site he did the same thing with. While there are some regulars there it is mostly people who come on, ask a question and get it answered. They then move on until they have another question. The site probably gets 1,000's of clicks a day. That is where the money comes from. Not long time members but site traffic. He may not be a BOTL but he is a businessman and you can believe that.

Well, I'll tell you what my hope is. I hope that he learns a lesson that you can't treat people like garbage. I hope he takes a bath on this one and seeing how the economy is and that the mini-boom is over with this is more likely than not.

What you just said about his business model is very sad. At least to me it's sad.

Cheers,
Rob

[a2vr6]

Originally Posted by madurolover

For some reason I do not think that Jon is hurting financially.

Not as former head sales for Sun, he was easily pulling in high 6 figures plus bonuses.

[Asher]

Originally Posted by madurolover

For some reason I do not think that Jon is hurting financially.

Maybe not, but between the costs of buying the sites (I don't know how much he paid for CS, CL, and CR, but his $50k offer for CigarPass is public knowledge), the "puff.com" domain name, graphic design, hosting, etc., I highly doubt that his investment is paying off the way he had hoped.

In the end, a website is more about branding than anything else, I think. The business approach thus was not well thought out. What the fellow that bought those 3 sites should have done was kept the branding of either the largest site or the site with the most cohessive population. Then, he should have added the coupling interfaces necessary, given the members of the other 2 sites a chance to migrate over themselves and then finally couple the 3 sites together under the name and branding of the established "mother" site.

I wonder if this whole thing would have taken another form if one of the main sites had been preserved. Would the same level of fighting and anger be present if something call "club stogie" was still present?

Then again, it may be fortunate that it has taken on a whole new identity. It may actually offer people a quicker and more complete "closure" knowing that CS is gone, as opposed to them hating how CS has changed.

But, I should probably just go to bed.

Cheers

Cyanide

[renton20]

Although I am not nearly as eloquent as many who have already posted I feel a strong desire to express my feeling about what is going on over there in a place where I will not be punished for it, i.e. not there. I joined clubstogie because I had a few questions about cigars that I wanted answered. What I found was a community of people who were truly passionate about something that they enjoyed.

I was told to start trading and received a great selection including my first ISOM as a result. More than that, with the trading I really began to feel as I have never before in my life that the world is a very small place. The fact that I could take some cigars, package them up, and for $5 send them from MN to SC in two days blew my mind.

Even more, the fact that some one who had years of cigar experience on me was willing, even eager, to send me something simply because he thought that I would enjoy it took me a little time to understand.

The point that I am trying to get to is that JC bought a business but lost, through his own mismanagement, its soul. He will still make money on it because of the size, which is all he really cares about. I think that I am simply going to stop logging on. The soul and the community is here. People that I know and feel privileged to call friends are here. I just feel bad for those that called the place home for much longer than I did. I joined back in may. Though I did spend an obsessive amount of time there it must be much worse for those of you who were there for years and years. Let's just keep the spirit alive guys. We may have switched buildings, but it's still the same bar.

Josh

[madurolover]

Originally Posted by renton20

Although I am not nearly as eloquent as many who have already posted I feel a strong desire to express my feeling about what is going on over there in a place where I will not be punished for it, i.e. not there. I joined clubstogie because I had a few questions about cigars that I wanted answered. What I found was a community of people who were truly passionate about something that they enjoyed.

I was told to start trading and received a great selection including my first ISOM as a result. More than that, with the trading I really began to feel as I have never before in my life that the world is a very small place. The fact that I could take some cigars, package them up, and for $5 send them from MN to SC in two days blew my mind.

Even more, the fact that some one who had years of cigar experience on me was willing, even eager, to send me something simply because he thought that I would enjoy it took me a little time to understand.

The point that I am trying to get to is that JC bought a business but lost, through his own mismanagement, its soul. He will still make money on it because of the size, which is all he really cares about. I think that I am simply going to stop logging on. The soul and the community is here. People that I know and feel privileged to call friends are here. I just feel bad for those that called the place home for much longer than I did. I joined back in may. Though I did spend an obsessive amount of time there it must be much worse for those of you who were there for years and years. Let's just keep the spirit alive guys. We may have switched buildings, but it's still the same bar.

Josh

I call BS!

That was stated as well as anyone could hope to say it (except maybe Da Klugs).

Excellent post!

[white_s2k]

Originally Posted by madurolover

For some reason I do not think that Jon is hurting financially.

As we have seen in the past months.. money does not buy members. You may, or may not be a testament to that (publicly). But it is apparent.

[madurolover]

Originally Posted by white_s2k

As we have seen in the past months.. money does not buy members. You may, or may not be a testament to that (publicly). But it is apparent.

I agree, but as I stated above, as long as there are clicks the number of members is basically moot.

[white_s2k]

Originally Posted by madurolover

I agree, but as I stated above, as long as there are clicks the number of members is basically moot.

I agree there. Hopefully, as the hype wears off the true numbers will emerge.

[icehog3]

Originally Posted by madurolover

In the past few days (8- 10) I have received PM's from some of the members here that seem to be held in high regard. I will not name them but I will tell you that never have I got such nasty, vile messages from people that I consider my "brothers".

Donnie, Aaron, Ji and Dave tried to help a place that at one time the vast majority of us loved. They did nothing wrong by trying to help steer CS (and eventually PVff) towards a better place. I think it was inevitable that it would not work.

That being said....Ladies and Gentlemen...Inmates.....

I think we have all had our say, some have had their bashing (I was admittedly one of the worst)...but now I think it is time to get back to what brought us together here in the first place....Friendship and Cigars.

Shawn put it wisely, and more than 100 posts later, I respectfully ask that we put this to bed, get positive about the great Haven we have all created here, and focus our energy on the Inmates of the Asylum.Tom

[SmokeyJoe]

Originally Posted by icehog3

Donnie, Aaron, Ji and Dave tried to help a place that at one time the vast majority of us loved. They did nothing wrong by trying to help steer CS (and eventually PVff) towards a better place. I think it was inevitable that it would not work.

That being said....Ladies and Gentlemen...Inmates.....

I think we have all had our say, some have had their bashing (I was admittedly one of the worst)...but now I think it is time to get back to what brought us together here in the first place....Friendship and Cigars.

Shawn put it wisely, and more than 100 posts later, I respectfully ask that we put this to bed, get positive about the great Haven we have all created here, and focus our energy on the Inmates of the Asylum.Tom

Agreed... I think it would be better for our community here if we did exactly as you suggest, Admiral!

[mmblz]

Originally Posted by icehog3

I think we have all had our say, some have had their bashing (I was admittedly one of the worst)...but now I think it is time to get back to what brought us together here in the first place....Friendship and Cigars.

This thread has been at least to some degree a necessary evil, since so many of us have shared the same or similar feelings. It would be hard not to discuss an event that such a huge percentage of our membership was involved in. It has been cathartic. But now let's put our brief fomentation behind us and get back to everything depicted in our banner - friendship, cigars, serenity.

[poker]

I also agree that its time.

Its time to let go of what once was.

What many of us had at Club Stogie is gone from there now. We all knew it was going to happen, but many times we as humans believe only what we want to believe. The fact is CS is no longer.

Jon bought CS strictly as a business venture. Nothing more, nothing less. Is that a bad thing? No, not really. Its how the world turns. Its the way things are.

Do we have to be happy about it? Of course not.
The one thing we must all remember, is that although we all have a choice of where we go in life, its "how" we get there that is most important.
Wouldn't it be nice if you were financially rich? Of course it would. But what if the cost of being rich was you had to ruin hundreds/thousands of people & their families financially? (read Enron here). Could you sleep well at night? Could you look yourself in the mirror every day and be proud of yourself for being financially "successful"? I know I personally could not. I have a pretty good feeling that you could not either.

Should we go raise hell over there at Puff by creating new usernames from different IP's or behind proxy servers? No.

I believe the members here are better than that.

I've seen what you do for each other by sending out cigar bombs.
I've seen you helping a fellow brother that you have never met by sending him cash in the event of an emergency.
I've seen you fly hundreds of miles away at your own expense just to say hi and share a cigar together for a couple days.
I've seen you take the time out your own life so you could organize and carry out tasks like sending thousands of cigars overseas to our troops that are serving to protect us.
I've seen you help the new guy who dosent know much about this hobby of ours and take him under your wing with nothing expected in return.
I've seen you open your houses to folks you have never met and welcome them with open arms.
I've seen all of this and many other actions that are beyond words.

So when I say you are better than that, I know for a fact that you are. I know for a fact we all are better than that.

For Cigar Asylum and Puff.com, things are going to turn out just as they are supposed to.

In the end, let Puff be. Let Jon be. What will happen there will happen regardless. CS is gone there. Jon is the owner there. Puff.com is a reality. You have no control over that fact.

What you do have control of however, is your own actions.
Be better than that. Lets all try to be better than that.