The Official Asylum Freshwater Tank Thread

[shaggy]

if the salty guys can have a thread then so can we.

Just gettin back into the fish thing after many years away. Used to have an Oscar and a Red Bellied Pirranaha but i wanted something a bit more sedate this time around.

this is my 25g tank i just got ready and it is just finishing up cycling. currently there is only 3 silver mollies and one neon tetra in there but i want to fill it with about 12-15 fish eventually.

http://i129.photobucket.com/albums/p206/shaggy_059/fish/003-2.jpg

this is a 10g i picked up for the grandkids to fill with guppies and stuff.
http://i129.photobucket.com/albums/p206/shaggy_059/fish/002-3.jpg

nothing specatular but still kinda nice.

eventually i will end up with a salt tank i think but just small stuff. price is pretty prohibitive up here on the equipment.

[Rabidsquirrel]

After I finish my move I'll post pictures. I haven't been scrubbing the algae off the glass for a while, and I don't want to take a picture of that.

[shaggy]

another addition to the tank tonite.....3 more neon tetras and 3 shimp...they are way cool...i never knew about having shimp before in fresh water tanks

[Old Sailor]

Gail says for me to cleanup my tank that has been sitting for a year, guess it's as good a time as any to restart her.

[shaggy]

it prolly was home to prehistoric fish at one point.....lol

[Rabidsquirrel]

What type of shrimp did you get?

[shaggy]

japonica or they have another more common name that escapes me atm...starts with an 'a' tho

[LookAtBigErn82]

japonica or they have another more common name that escapes me atm...starts with an 'a' tho

Amano?

[shaggy]

Amano?

that would be them.
they were pretty active when i first put them in now they just hang out chillin

finally got the grandkids tank ready....they currently have 3 guppies...1 male, 1 female and a baby....but the female is already pregnant

[Old Sailor]

it prolly was home to prehistoric fish at one point.....lol

:fu:fu:r

[shaggy]

lookin to change my tanks to LED lighting....anyone got any comments?
should i just get a kit of ebay for like 30-40 bucks?

[Rabidsquirrel]

What type of LED lighting? The only one I've seen is for salt water and costs well over $500.

[shaggy]

something along these lines...
http://shop.ebay.ca/?_from=R40&_trksid=m38&_nkw=fish+tank+led+lighting&_sacat=See-All-Categories

i think it would look pretty cool

[omowasu]

Cool thread, lets see some more pics!

I used to have several saltwater tanks many years ago, but the maintenance and upkeep was sucking up a LOT of my time. Eventually I got out of the hobby - gave away the fish, sold the tanks, etc.

Been getting the fishkeeping itch lately, especially since the kids have been asking for a tank. I am thinking of a 55 gal freshwater setup, maybe brackish, but either way I would like to cut my maintenance time to 1/3 that of a saltwater tank.

Some of the newer hood systems will definitely help - I used one of the first generation Eclipse systems a few years ago. It worked well but the biofilter gunked up quickly and needed to be rinsed weekly. Any ideas here are welcome.

[foomanto]

had a tank for years pretty maintenance free my big mistake my gravel was to small larger gravel would have stayed cleaner filtered better. the smaller gravel had to be cleaned about once every 2 months other than that i just checked the water levels every other week. the key was to get fish that did most of the work for you.

[shaggy]

Cool thread, lets see some more pics!

I used to have several saltwater tanks many years ago, but the maintenance and upkeep was sucking up a LOT of my time. Eventually I got out of the hobby - gave away the fish, sold the tanks, etc.

Been getting the fishkeeping itch lately, especially since the kids have been asking for a tank. I am thinking of a 55 gal freshwater setup, maybe brackish, but either way I would like to cut my maintenance time to 1/3 that of a saltwater tank.

Some of the newer hood systems will definitely help - I used one of the first generation Eclipse systems a few years ago. It worked well but the biofilter gunked up quickly and needed to be rinsed weekly. Any ideas here are welcome.

the hood on my 25 gal is an eclipse but the previous owner gutted all the filter stuff out of it. i have a fluval2 submersable filter working in it now....soooo quiet. i find the area where the filter was a great storage space for nets and the like that drip when you put them away

[shaggy]

added some ghost shrimp the other day.....they are way more visiable than the amanos and just as fun to watch

[LookAtBigErn82]

Here are some pics of my tank. Started it back in August. I love the live plants that are growing in there. I constantly have to trim those down.

Just a couple Tiger Barbs in there right now.

http://i679.photobucket.com/albums/vv159/lookatbigern82/DSC01090.jpg

http://i679.photobucket.com/albums/vv159/lookatbigern82/DSC01087.jpg

http://i679.photobucket.com/albums/vv159/lookatbigern82/DSC01088.jpg

[shaggy]

nice setup
i am gonna go planted on the next tank i get

[LookAtBigErn82]

nice setup
i am gonna go planted on the next tank i get

Thanks, the plants actually started out as roots that you can buy from a pet store. I paid a couple bucks for like six of them. Only two started growing but they're huge.

[Tikihut27]

I have two tanks up right now. Since I was overseas for 2008, they started out a little shabby this year, but here is how they are right now. (My wife says they die when I am on military duty because they "miss me".)

First tank, 55 long. Use this for schoolers and to grow predators for the big tank. Once they eat the schoolers, they are ready to move! Has in it right now:

2 Red Rainbow (Glossolepis incisus)
1 Bosemani Rainbow (Melanotaenia boesemani)
2 Madagascar Rainbow (Bedotia geayi)
2 Diamond Tetra (Moenkhausia pittieri)
2 Red Eye Tetra (Moenkhausia sanctaefilomenae)
1 Emperor Tetra (Nematobrycon palmeri)
2 Flagtail Porthole Catfish (dianema urostriatum)
2 Bumblebee Catfish (Pseudopimelodus raninus)
1 Banjo Catfish (Bunocephalus coracoideus)
1 Clown Loach (Chromobotia macracanthus)
1 Green Tiger Botia (Botia hymenophysa)
1 Striped Headstander (Anostomus anostomus)
And probably a few I missed

http://i317.photobucket.com/albums/mm386/gsmilligan/IMG_0583.jpg

The big tank is a 150 that used to be an Amazonian tank but has morphed a little. Big predators and cats mostly, but I lost the really good ones last year. Currently:

1 Leopard Ctenopoma (Ctenopoma acutirostre) 4"
1 Flagtail Prochilodus (Semaprochilodus insignis) 6"
1 Rhino Pleco (Pterygoplichthys scrophus) 8"
1 Black-Banded Leporinus (Leporinus fasciatus) 10"
1 Lima Shovel Nose Catfish (Sorubim lima) 5"
1 Upside-down Catfish (Synodontis eupterus) 6"
1 Twig Catfish (Farlowella acus) 5"
1 Hujeta Gar (Ctenolucius hujeta) 5"
2 Red Bellied Pacu (Piaractus brachypomum) 2" just got this weekend

http://i317.photobucket.com/albums/mm386/gsmilligan/IMG_0586.jpg

Ctenopoma acutirostre

http://i317.photobucket.com/albums/mm386/gsmilligan/IMG_0587.jpg

Leporinus fasciatus

http://i317.photobucket.com/albums/mm386/gsmilligan/IMG_0588.jpg

Pterygoplichthys scrophus

http://i317.photobucket.com/albums/mm386/gsmilligan/IMG_0589.jpg

[Churchlady]

Cool!!!
Some day I want to have a grown up tank!!
As it is... I'm having trouble with ours - ammonia levels are through the roof and I've only got a black mollie, Silver Dannio and 2 kuhli loaches!

[Tikihut27]

Cool!!!
Some day I want to have a grown up tank!!
As it is... I'm having trouble with ours - ammonia levels are through the roof and I've only got a black mollie, Silver Dannio and 2 kuhli loaches!

The bigger they are, the older they are, and the more gunked up with organic life they are, the easier they are to maintain, I've found.

Welcome to the board, by the way!

[shaggy]

Cool!!!
Some day I want to have a grown up tank!!
As it is... I'm having trouble with ours - ammonia levels are through the roof and I've only got a black mollie, Silver Dannio and 2 kuhli loaches!

i am goin thro the same thing with mine....high ammonia and cloudy water....just keep up on water changes and fill it up with some hardy fish

i am goin later tonite to check on a really cheap 10 gal setup i will prolly use for shrimp and hopefully plant it later

[shaggy]

finally finished stocking my 25 gal.

ended up with 2 silver mollys, 7 neon tetras, 3 sunburst platys and 4 otto cats

tomorrow i am suppose to pick up a new 35 gal for wife and i get to start all over again

[BC-Axeman]

My wife maintains our 55 gal freshwater tank. It's got some misc tetra types, a hatchet, a huge pleco and an overgrown algae eater. We try to grow plants in it but everything gets eaten except the java fern, which becomes a weed.

[GWN]

Here's our big one. We have a smaller one in my son's room that produces a fresh cloud of guppies every couple of weeks.
http://i175.photobucket.com/albums/w149/GWNJeff/DSCN2190.jpg

[shaggy]

what do u think of the eclipse canopy jeff? i have one on my tank but it is gutted, i use a submersible filter in the corner but have heard good things about the elcipse,,,wondering if i should try to find all the pieces for mine

[Old Sailor]

How do you cycle your tanks guys....I use the amonia cycle....no fish till it's done, had good success with this way.
Now, try to get your hands on pure ammonia with no perfume or other addictive to it.

Add 4-5 drops of ammonia per 10 gallons of water, everyday.

Monitor the nitrites level everyday.

When you see a nitrates spike, drop the addition to 2-3 drops of ammonia per 10 gallons of water, everyday

When you see the nitrites level drop to zero,

Congratulations, your tank is fully cycled!

[Blueface]

How do you cycle your tanks guys....I use the amonia cycle....no fish till it's done, had good success with this way.
Now, try to get your hands on pure ammonia with no perfume or other addictive to it.

Add 4-5 drops of ammonia per 10 gallons of water, everyday.

Monitor the nitrites level everyday.

When you see a nitrates spike, drop the addition to 2-3 drops of ammonia per 10 gallons of water, everyday

When you see the nitrites level drop to zero,

Congratulations, your tank is fully cycled!

Dave,
In my years in the salt water aquarium business, I learned how to rapid cycle a tank, even fresh water.
I needed to learn not only for my tank and for the business but more so for those times when purchasing new fish and needing a rapid start hospital tank for quarantine.
Buy a simple product Bacter Vital. Comes in one formula for saltwater and a second for fresh so make sure you get the right one.
Use it for three days.
On the fourth day, the Tank is cycled and ready to go.
I swear I have done this with my tank and that of many customers, each time dealing with thousands of dollars in fish and have yet to loose one.
Stuff is amazing.

I have even experimented with a $5000 fish, with no waiting.
Just added it and kept adding for three days.
No sweat at all.

[Old Sailor]

:hm will have to look for that stuff Carlos.:tu

[Blueface]

:hm will have to look for that stuff Carlos.:tu

One word of caution about Bacter Vital, throw away the test kits and don't use them as it will throw off the readings and drive you nuts thinking all is whacked out, meantime, the fish are happy as can be.

[GWN]

what do u think of the eclipse canopy jeff? i have one on my tank but it is gutted, i use a submersible filter in the corner but have heard good things about the elcipse,,,wondering if i should try to find all the pieces for mine

Both of ours are Eclipses and they work well. When the filter gets clogged up, the biowheel doesn't spin that well, but otherwise they're great. Both were fairly cheap at Big Al's.

[shaggy]

i cycled mine with a product called 'cycle'. add a couple of capfuls wait a week and add a couple more and in another week u are done. it is suppose to have the good bacteria in the bottle to give it a jump start.
seemed to work ok for mine...i added fish at the 2 week mark and lost 2 of 10. and one was a neon tetra which is notorious for being a fragile fish.

[Blueface]

i cycled mine with a product called 'cycle'. add a couple of capfuls wait a week and add a couple more and in another week u are done. it is suppose to have the good bacteria in the bottle to give it a jump start.
seemed to work ok for mine...i added fish at the 2 week mark and lost 2 of 10. and one was a neon tetra which is notorious for being a fragile fish.

Cycle works the same as Bacter Vital.
I just got use to one over the other.

[Churchlady]

Just lost my black mollie! bummer... can you add bacter vital with the fish in?

[Blueface]

Just lost my black mollie! bummer... can you add bacter vital with the fish in?

Absolutely.
It is an injection of beneficial bacteria for the system.
Just remember it throws off test kits so don't rely on them for a short while once you use this product.
However, if cycled already and running fine, no need to waste the money on it.
If a fish died and temporarily spiked the tank, definitely will help but so will any product like Prime or Amquel.
If anyone buys Bacter Vital, just remember to refrigerate it after opening the package.

[Churchlady]

Will try it... still got 3 in there I think - kuhli loaches are pretty crafty... can never find them when you're looking for them.

[shaggy]

well i got a couple of new tanks up and running...a 10 gal with a couple of femail bettas and silver tip tetras and the 35 gal with 5 albino plecos and 2 elephant nose fish

[Rabidsquirrel]

Should have the new top finished for the 55 finished by this weekend. I'll take some pictures then.

[GWN]

well i got a couple of new tanks up and running...a 10 gal with a couple of femail bettas and silver tip tetras and the 35 gal with 5 albino plecos and 2 elephant nose fish

post a pic!

[Old Sailor]

Got my 20 gal. back up and cycling, man what a job it was to clean and get it going. Using a Fluval 203 filter......also have blue LEDS for night, thanks for the thought Mike, looks cool....I'll post some pics later.
Thinking of Tiger Barbs this time.

[Old Sailor]

http://i513.photobucket.com/albums/t336/bosunb/100_0942.jpg
http://i513.photobucket.com/albums/t336/bosunb/100_0943.jpg
Blue LED'S for night.

[shaggy]

bastage....i still dont have the leds in any of my tanks
what did u use for them? the ones u buy at the fish store?

[Old Sailor]

bastage....i still dont have the leds in any of my tanks
what did u use for them? the ones u buy at the fish store?

Ones from Ebay....10 of them in there, but didn't use his wire,too bulky.

[Smoking Dragon]

I'm getting so excited now. Next week I am going to order my very 1st 90 gal tank for Fred the eel. Which means my water changes will cost a lill bit more. But Fred is worht it. I think he really loves me, or at least knows I bring the good foor home for him.



Sarge

[shaggy]

they all love you when either u bring food...or are food:)

[Rabidsquirrel]

Finally got around to taking a picture. Battling a small algae problem now, I need to get in and do a good cleaning. I build a custom cheapo hood which has four four foot 32watt lamps.

http://www.moderatelyconfused.com/images/tank55.jpg

[shaggy]

ok...so i got some more pics...
a 30 gal that i am not quite sure what i am gonna do with. currently home to some guppys, kuhili loaches, oil catfish and a few plecos
http://i129.photobucket.com/albums/p206/shaggy_059/010.jpg

a 30 gal tang cichlid tank i am just getting going...home for 4 lemon cichlids
http://i129.photobucket.com/albums/p206/shaggy_059/009.jpg

10 gal guppy tank
http://i129.photobucket.com/albums/p206/shaggy_059/008.jpg

10 gal tank home to 2 female bettas and some danios and tetras
http://i129.photobucket.com/albums/p206/shaggy_059/007.jpg

20 community tank home to all kinds of different stuff
http://i129.photobucket.com/albums/p206/shaggy_059/005-2.jpg

[shaggy]

and finally the wifes tank
http://i129.photobucket.com/albums/p206/shaggy_059/006-1.jpg

home to her prize fish.........
http://i129.photobucket.com/albums/p206/shaggy_059/015.jpg

http://i129.photobucket.com/albums/p206/shaggy_059/014.jpg

elephantnose fish

[Old Sailor]

Nice lookin setups Mike:tu

[whogamawut]

well never thought i would see this thread on here...nice tanks...if i ever find my camera cord ill throw my tank on here

[4WheelVFR]

Here's half of my stacked and divided 75 setup. Since this photo, I've taken the dividers out and added crossbracing to them. Still have dividers in one of the 75's for smaller fish and grow outs. Electrical is also a lot cleaner.
http://i73.photobucket.com/albums/i229/4WheelVFR/P1000633_Snapseed.jpg

http://i73.photobucket.com/albums/i229/4WheelVFR/P1000718_Snapseed.jpg
This tank is roughly 960 gallons and houses a hodgepodge of fish. The stock and layout of the tank have changed since this photo.
15" Cichla Temensis from Rio Ventuari
15" Cichla Kelberi/Piquiti hybrid from Sao Francisco
8" Cichla piquiti
10-12" Fossorochromis rostratus (tank boss)
10" Amphilophus sagittae
Breeding pair of Paraneetroplus bifasciatus
2 8" Amphilophus lyonsi
3 wild oscars from different collection points
yellow bullhead, longear sunfish, indian sun cat, calico convict, a bunch of misc fancy plecos, including a 20-24" common pleco, salvini cichlid, true parrot cichlid.......i think that's it lol.

Sorry for all the latin names, but it's the best way for me to keep track of and describe what I have.

[ColdCuts]

I'm considering getting into the hobby, but I don't know the first thing about it. Can anyone here recommend one of the many fish-keeping forums?

[4WheelVFR]

I'm considering getting into the hobby, but I don't know the first thing about it. Can anyone here recommend one of the many fish-keeping forums?

Monsterfishkeepers.com It's geared towards larger fish, but also has many resources for the beginner fish keeper. It's one of the best fish forums on the web. You can always post questions here for me and I'll be glad to answer them as well.

[ColdCuts]

Well that's awfully nice of you, Ray. :)

I randomly found http://www.fishlore.com/ and I've begun reading there. Do you have any feelings on that site?

Here's a question:
Where fish-keeping is concerned, I don't know anything. I'm as green as they come. So, on the one hand, it makes sense to start with a small 10-gallon tank, right? Smaller is easier? Smaller commitment? On the other hand, I know from experience that the environment inside of a large humidor fluctuates less than the environment inside of a small humidor. I would think the same rule would apply to an aquarium. Am I right? If so, what would you think if I started up with, say, a 30-gallon, planted, community tank setup?

If that's good, my next question would be -- and perhaps this should actually be my first question: after I'm up and running, and I've read up on all the basics, and I've gone thru the nitrogen cycle, how do I figure out how to stock my community aquarium? By this I mean, how do I know what will live peacefully with what, and how many? I don't want my fish to eat one another or war on each other. This aquarium idea was hatched from the need for a stress-relieving, blood-pressure-lowering pastime. Am I barking up the wrong tree?

[4WheelVFR]

You're definitely not barking up the wrong tree. Many studies have proven that aquariums are very helpful in lowering blood pressure and aiding in relaxation. You're also right that aquariums are like humidors, where a larger environment provides greater stability. A 29 or 30 gallon tank is definitely a great size to start with, although if petco is still doing their sale, a 40g breeder tank is a great size.
As far as equipment goes, here's a simple list.

Hang on the back power filter-very easy to setup and maintain, relatively cheap, usually extremely reliable, and probably the best filtration imo for small to medium tanks.

Heater-Ebo Jaeger makes the best imo, titanium heaters not worth it unless you have very large tanks....i still have glass heaters on my 1000g, albeit connected to a controller.

Air Stone and pump-I used to think these were outdated and unnecessary, but on any tank I've had one on, my fish seem to like it.

Lighting-LED all the way. A cheap led strip is good enough for a small tank and they use hardly any electricity at all. T-5 is next best.

Gravel Vacuum-for siphoning old water from the tank when doing water changes.

Dechlorinator-neutralizes chlorine and chloramines from your tap water. Prime by Seachem is the best, but any will do probably.

Food-New Life Spectrum is what you want. Great food and available in any size.

That is really all the equipment you need. You may also want a top for the tank and then there's all the gravel/sand and decor. It may sound intimidating but is not bad at all. Many petshops have aquarium packages where everything comes together. Craigslist is also an excellent place to find whole setups, often much cheaper.

[4WheelVFR]

As far as setups go, I would definitely recommend live plants, even for a newbie. There are many very easy to keep plants out there and they definitely have their benefits in an aquarium. As far as fish go, a great starter community for a 30 or 40 gallon tank would be a small school of tetras (many different species), a small school of corydoras catfish, a plecostomus (just be careful what species as many get very large) and a pair of small cichlids such as Apistogrammas. There are also many native fish that would work well in that type of community. Really, there is an unlimited choice of fish to choose from.

As far as compatibility goes, that can be a crapshoot sometimes, but the first rule of thumb is that if it can fit in another fishes mouth, it will end up there. If you have any idea of fish you want to keep, I can help give you ideas of what suitable tankmates would be.

As far as the nitrogen cycle goes, i've never paid it much mind lol. Just add fish slowly to a new setup and they should be fine. Don't overstock and don't add too many fish at once and they should be fine. The nitrogen/ammonia cycle is very important to understand, so I do recommend you read up on it if you already haven't.

A couple very important rules:
Only feed what your fish can consume in a couple minutes, once or twice a day.

Once a week, siphon out 10% of your aquarium water along with any stuff your siphon picks up, and replace it with fresh, dechlorinated water. Water changes should be mandatory and 10% to 25% a week is a good number.

Hope this helps a little bit. I'll also post up some links of mine for you to go over.

[4WheelVFR]

Plantedtank.net - great plant and fishkeeping forum
Reefcentral.com - in case you wanna go salt :D
Monsterfishkeepers.com is my home forum
Aquabid.com - great for buying anything fish related, just watch feedback
ratings like you would ebay.

Tangledupincichlids.com - absolute best source for very nice fish although small fish stock is kinda limited.

Kensfish.com - great place for food and accessories
Freshwatertropicalfishonline.com - great vendor of live fish
bigalspets.com - equipment
aquatraders.com - equipment
msjinkzd.com - great selection of small fish and inverts
drsfostersmith.com - equipment and live fish
yourfishstuff.com - equipment and very cool 3d backgrounds
wetspottropicalfish.com - another great live fish vendor

not familiar with fishlore.com but fishgeeks is another good one for general fish keeping.

Being a beginner, your B&M is the best bet, but all the cool stuff is usually online lol. As far as equipment goes, you can sometimes score well at local places but online prices are hard to beat.

[OLS]

http://i73.photobucket.com/albums/i229/4WheelVFR/P1000718_Snapseed.jpg.

HAHAHA, I love the way they are all looking at the camera basically. Must be
just got home, gonna be fed time. I miss my fresh tank days, in the USAF dorms
of course everyone had to have one. Quite a lot of competition for coolness in
design and stocking. Then I went to saltwater, and now I am free of all of it.
And thankful most times.....til now. One thing I learned over time was to lose
my fascination with Oscars....what a fun fish, like a dog, really. But too much
growth and too much tank dirtying in keeping them fed. Love em, but left em.
Give me the Lake Malawi Cichlids now.

[ColdCuts]

Holy smokes! Ray, thank you for all your helpful advice and recommended links! I repped ya. OK, I'm gonna keep reading up. Here's one more question: The wife and I will probably be moving in about six or so months. I imagine that'd be a real stressor on both fish and plants -- not to mention husband and wife. :p Would you recommend waiting until after the move to get started, or would you soldier on?

And for Brad: If you don't mind my asking, why did you get completely out of the hobby?

Thanks, fellas. :chr

[4WheelVFR]

Give me the Lake Malawi Cichlids now.

That large fish in the top center is a fish from Malawi. It's a large Fosorochromis rostratus. Kinda wish I had a small group of them, but they would probably go on a killing spree then. That one alone is a bruiser.

[4WheelVFR]

Dave, if you know you'll be moving soon, I would hold off on setting up a new tank. They can be a hassle to move. That will give you plenty of time to read up on what you want and get all your equipment bought.

[OLS]

I also think it is worth waiting for before a move....fish survive fine in buckets, especially with live plants in
the buckets. The motion of the moving van oxygenates the water. Buy why even do it? Fish tank crap is a
hassle, and moving is already a hassle enough. Even if you have the tank NOW, moving it dry with no stanky rocks
in it is the best idea.

As for the hobby exit on my part, I don't leave my home for long periods of time during the year, but when I DO,
I like to be gone a long time, 4+ days minimum. And fish tanks are kind of demanding in that regard. As I am an
a55hole, I do not have any friends to watch it. Nor is my house a place I would want people in, kind of a storage
unit with paths cut through the clutter, if you need a picture. I have been a bachelor hermit so long, its kind of
embarrassing. But there is also the issue of electricity, and the mess, and the work, and the fact that my MIND is set
on leaving here, and I do not want boat anchors around my legs. It has been set for 5 years, and I am still here, so
I am not very EFFECTIVE at getting out, but when I do get off my a55 and move, I want to be untethered.

[jjirons69]

Been eyeing this thread for a while. In my 44 years, I’ve been actively keeping and enjoying the freshwater aquaria hobby for more than half of it. If there’s one thing I feel I know in-depth, it’s freshwater tanks. Having a chemistry degree and working in laboratories the past 20+ years has made my aquarium hobby much more interesting. When the Internet came to be, aquariums and paludariums were my first interests. I was a part of so many user groups. I was big into planted tanks, from the basic, natural planted tank to the high tech CO2, high wattage lights, and PMDD versions. I’ve had nearly every type of plant for sell or trade and have tried my best to grow and propagate each one of them, some successful, some not-so-much. I went to many “aquarium herfs” you could call it, where we exchanged ideas, plants, and fish. I also had some success in placing in on-line tank contests and won some cool stuff. I’ve collected rocks and wood from every corner of the state trying to build a big collection to use and trade. I had it bad for 10+ years and had many close friends that were big into it. I also wrote a substrate article for Planted Aquarium Magazine and it’s now found it way to many websites that I’m sure folks still use. I went through several cycles – Tanganyikan cichlids (Julies, ocellatus, etc.), Amazonia cichlids (apistos, acaras, etc.), West African cichlids (pelvic, Congo tetras, etc.), low-tech planted, high-tech planted, paludariums, hard water species, soft water species, and specialty fishes. When I look back, it’s kind of mind-boggling. Fast forward to about 5 years ago – I’ve gotten older, I’ve experience about all you WANT to experience in this hobby, and I’ve wanted to slow down to just have tanks that are low maintenance and look good in our home. During this period I’ve honestly had several instances of thinking about getting rid of them all, even discussing it in-depth with my wife. However, I always come back to my senses. For the past 10 year I’ve kept 2 – 55 G, 1 – 20G, and 1 – 10G – all planted. They all reside in our living room and dining area and are truly a part of our home. When you take 4 steps in our front door, you can see them all. They are all low light, low maintenance (about 2 hours every other month), low cost “furniture” tanks. I keep fish and invertebrates that help the tanks stay clean. I add Ca, Mg, and K to levels around 4-6 dH and baking soda to levels around 2-3 dK. I don’t worry about pH, nitrates, phosphates or any of that other stuff anymore, I know from experience and lots of days of testing what to look for and what not to worry about. All have Fluorite/Small pea gravel substrates and all run off 12-hour cycle timers. I share baby fish and plants with folks I work with and also give them to local fish stores. I toss out tons of plants yearly, as they require pruning with maintenance. I took pictures with my iPhone last night, but they look a lot better than they are pictured. I also put some older pictures of the old days that I had uploaded to Photobucket years ago. There’s a lot of tanks that have been awesome that I never took any pictures of. No digital cameras back then and film cameras looked horrible. I know I’ve written a lot here, but I could gone on for days. If anyone ever has any questions, shoot me a PM and I’ll try to help.

Substrate article (circa 1999): http://www.cichlid-forum.com/articles/plant_substrates.php

10 G:
http://i160.photobucket.com/albums/t178/jjirons69/Picture012_zpse12fba28.jpg
http://i160.photobucket.com/albums/t178/jjirons69/Picture018_zpsf5ff1d67.jpg

20G:
http://i160.photobucket.com/albums/t178/jjirons69/Picture010_zps538823e0.jpg
http://i160.photobucket.com/albums/t178/jjirons69/Picture019_zpscf092994.jpg

Both 55 G:
http://i160.photobucket.com/albums/t178/jjirons69/Picture014_zps2442ec30.jpg

[jjirons69]

http://i160.photobucket.com/albums/t178/jjirons69/Picture013_zps427df023.jpg
http://i160.photobucket.com/albums/t178/jjirons69/Picture016_zps0d575ed4.jpg
http://i160.photobucket.com/albums/t178/jjirons69/Picture017_zps156f8fa9.jpg
http://i160.photobucket.com/albums/t178/jjirons69/Picture015_zps450d1fbd.jpg

[jjirons69]

http://i160.photobucket.com/albums/t178/jjirons69/E10B9178-8DFA-453A-87B7-C5A3857FD180-2011-000001D34119A222_zps074d4ce3.jpg

Older tanks from 10-15 years ago:

http://i160.photobucket.com/albums/t178/jjirons69/Miscellaneous/african5.jpg
http://i160.photobucket.com/albums/t178/jjirons69/Miscellaneous/newafrican3.jpg
http://i160.photobucket.com/albums/t178/jjirons69/Miscellaneous/newafrican8.jpg
http://i160.photobucket.com/albums/t178/jjirons69/Miscellaneous/african2.jpg

[jjirons69]

http://i160.photobucket.com/albums/t178/jjirons69/Miscellaneous/jack.jpg
http://i160.photobucket.com/albums/t178/jjirons69/Miscellaneous/julie1.jpg
http://i160.photobucket.com/albums/t178/jjirons69/Miscellaneous/afr3.jpg
http://i160.photobucket.com/albums/t178/jjirons69/Miscellaneous/newafrican1.jpg
http://i160.photobucket.com/albums/t178/jjirons69/Miscellaneous/male.jpg

[4WheelVFR]

Nice tanks Jamie. It's been a while since I've done a nice planted tank. Those look great. I've had the idea to turn my 1000g into a huge planted community with giant schools of tetras, discus, angels, and apistos, but some of my big guys in there have been with me for a while. Don't know how much longer I'll be keeping peacock bass though as their food bill just keeps getting bigger and bigger.

[ColdCuts]

Jamie, holy smokes! Just... Wow!

[4WheelVFR]

Looks like I'm getting ready to redo my big tank. My peacock bass are going through about 30-60 bucks a month in food and they are not even big yet. I really like those fish, but I gotta ditch that food bill. I'll be building a roughly 4-500 gallon tank to house some of my other big fish and turning the 1000g into a community tank. Plan so far is wild type angels, huge schools of tetras, some barbs, cory cats, and some other small cichlid species and plecos. I'll be getting back into plants as well for this tank with some larger, easy to care for plants. I know this thread doesn't get much attention on a cigar forum, but hopefully I'll have some photo updates as I progress.

[jjirons69]

400 G tank = divorce

1000 G tank = pine box

You're a lucky man (or either brave), Ray. Best of luck!

[Drphilwv]

Nice thread. I used to work at a pet store in Atlanta (post biology degree, pre med school days) and got to go to Fins Aquatics down by the airport where they would import the fish in. I could get the Laotian dudes who dipped fish to hook me up with oddball stuff that came in with the bigger orders. At the time it was Australian Raindbows, oddball synodontis sp catfish, and a few cichlids. At the time I had 3 55's in my 800sq ft apt. Last year I took my last one down (20 years after setting it up). The plants were mostly varieties of amazon sword and had survived moves from Atlanta, then 3 cities in WV. I miss my tanks but I have a nice Koi breeding pond behind my barn. It will do for now. Miss those days when I'd run down to Fins though.
Dr.Phil

[4WheelVFR]

400 G tank = divorce

1000 G tank = pine box

You're a lucky man (or either brave), Ray. Best of luck!

Lucky and brave!:D She already knows it won't end there either. Next house will have at least a 2500g tank. I want to revisit peacock bass and some other seriously large fish sometime down the road. Don't go lurking around Monsterfishkeepers.com, because it will ruin you on aquariums.

[ColdCuts]

Brothers, it's funny. At risk of sounding like a hippy, 'what a long strange trip it's been.' And I haven't even actually started yet!

This is a bit long-winded. Sorry.

So, I initially assumed I'd go with a freshwater set up because I read they require less maintenance and are cheaper to stock and run, generally, than saltwater. But then, while exploring further, I got exposed to the marine side of the hobby. I was mesmerized by the impossible colors, knocked-out by the outter-space strangeness of marine creatures. Nevertheless, I'd heard somewhere along the line that saltwater is for experts only. That one advances to saltwater only after first mastering freshwater aquaria.

Later, here and there, I read a conflicting POV: that keeping a FOWLR tank is really no more difficult than keeping a well-planted freshwater tank. Equipped with this nugget, I began planning for a saltwater set up. Not reef to start, but FOWLR with a eye on adding corals later. I continued to read. I visited a couple of all-saltwater B&Ms. I asked questions. I joined a forum called Manhattan Reefs (http://www.manhattanreefs.com/), I watched a dozen or more setup guides on YouTube, I got active on The Official Asylum Reef Tank Thread (http://www.cigarasylum.com/vb/showthread.php?t=7713), and I was even negotiating the purchase and delivery of a brand new 75-gallon reef-ready tank, when I suddenly decided to pull the saltwater E-brake.

Why? :sl

There are a few reasons for this; in brief, what we all already knew, that saltwater is more demanding than fresh, the livestock more expensive, more exacting, the possibility of a tank "crash" more likely with saltwater, and also -- and this is big -- the issue of how to responsibly source tank inhabitants.

You do a few dozen Googles on tropical fish and you're bound to be confronted by the ethical dilemma of where livestock comes from. I've read arguments suggesting that captive-bred (most freshwater fish) doesn't necessarily mean ecologically sound. Likewise, not all wild-caught (most saltwater fish) are caught using reef-blasting explosives or cyanide. Having said that, I feel better about freshwater. I know not all freshwater aquarium fish are farmed, but it's the majority, if you believe what I've been reading. It's difficult to truly know, of course. Which I find troubling. And "troubling" is antithetical to why I want to get into the hobby. Which brings me to my main point, personally speaking, regarding freshwater versus saltwater aquariums...

I think that for a short while I had lost sight of what attracted me to the idea of fishkeeping in the first place, that I find watching aquarium fish relaxing. That's what I hope to achieve with my tank. That's the objective. I want the successful keeping of my tank's inhabitants to be easy enough that care and maintenance don't impinge upon on that objective. I think that'll be easier to do with freshwater. What do you think?

[jjirons69]

Dave, I like a thinking man. Given that a tank setup is a big commitment, it's great you've thought it out. I've really never given harvesting practices much thought, but you do have a valid thought process. My biggest drawbacks were the fears you've expressed - increased maintenance, higher investment costs, higher priced inhabitants, and possible sudden failure. I've always been intrigued by the saltwater realm. A lot of them can resemble alien-like worlds and can have tons of unique inhabitants. With that, I'd have to say my favorite part about freshwater tanks is the naturalism they afford. I know I'd have to put forth a lot of effort and probably money to get a salty to function as close as possible to a natural environment. Even then, I don't see it ever being an aquarium that could take of itself. My tanks have been taking care of themselves for years. I change 50% water, wipe down any algae starting to show, clean the power canister filters, and remove any overgrown plants about every 2-3 months. Other than that a little daily feeding and maybe a little water addition to top them off weekly. They truly take care of themselves, finding the larger the tank, the more robust they are. If I want to get slack and put off some duties, I have no worries anything will crash. I can leave for the weekend (or the week) and return knowing everything is as good as it was when I left. If the power goes out for a day or two, everything is just fine. I like the luxury of using water right out of the tap with a little Prime and everyone goes about their business without the slightest inconvenience. Finally, I have the luxury of a nice aquarium downtown if I want to see salties in action.

Dave, try www.aquabid.com for plenty of freshwater variety. Most times you know if they're wild-caught, farmed, or raised by hobbyist.

Good luck on your adventure!

[ColdCuts]

Jamie, thank you. That's a comfort to know. You've helped me cement it, finally. Going with freshwater. Which brings me to...

Anybody want to help me stock my first freshwater tank? :D

Having settled on freshwater, I'm on to the planning phase. And I figured I'd ask all you guys for your experienced opinion.

I've heard it said that the best strategy for stocking is to select the fish that you're interested in keeping first, and then build your setup around those and select compatible tankmates.

Again, my main objective for this tank is: peaceful, easy to maintain, planted, colorful, beginner's tank. By easy to maintain I mean hearty fish and perhaps inverts, captive-bred where possible, that won't eat or uproot the aquascape, or one another. I'm thinking of a 55-75g community tank where inhabitants live in relative harmony. I also love weird stuff and vivid color -- which is why I almost went salt. I'm trying to consider the water column as well, and who likes to swim where. So, I've come up with the following shortlist. I welcome all thoughts, criticisms, hints, pointers, everything...


The current shortlist (for after the tank is cycled, of course):

Boesemani rainbows and/or pearl gourami. Twice as many females as males. The thing is, I'm not sure if these two will get along. Anyone know for sure?

Cardinal tetras or neon tetras - shoal of 5-8

Green tiger barbs - shoal of 5 or more. I know these guys are fin nippers so perhaps the gourami are out if these guys are in. I read that they do well with boesemani rainbows.

Dwarf suckermouth catfish - school of 3 or more. I was wanting to get glass catfish because they're a curiosity, but I read that they're terrible for beginners because they require at least 10 to feel comfortable, otherwise they'll never come out of hiding. Anyway, read somewhere that the dwarf suckermouth catfish is "almost mandatory" for a planted tank.

Corydoras of some sort - unless they and the dwarf suckermouth catfish are too similar. Don't wanna be redundant.

Gardneri killifish?

Maybe some type of loaches?

What about inverts? How would some ghost shrimp do? Would they be quick fish food? How about crabs, clams, or snails? I imagine the clams would really screw with the substrate, right?

How am I doing?

Thanks so much, guys. :tu

[4WheelVFR]

Set up a 75 instead of a 55, due to a bigger/better footprint. Here's a stock list for you.....

3 groups of different Apistogramma cichlid species
20-30 Neons or Cardinals
6-10 Cories (Sterbai cories are great)
a single pearl gourami would probably do well with these fish as well as a couple misc plecos. Don't do common or sailfin plecos as they get way too big for a 75.

This list has a lot of substitutes as well. Different small cichlids for the apistos, different characins or cyprinids instead of neons, smaller loaches instead of cories, etc.

Pool filter sand makes a great substrate if you want to save money and is great for cories and loaches. There are many easy to keep plants that would be great for your setup. One of my favs is the java fern. Pretty easy to keep.

Couple more links for you:
Plantedtank.net (lots of info on plants)
tangledupincichlids.com (one of the best vendors out there)
wetspottropicalfish.com (another great vendor with an amazing selection)

[4WheelVFR]

You could also do some slightly larger cichlids such as Thorichthys aureus, but you would want some more robust tetras like diamond tetras or bleeding heart tetras.

You may also consider Orange spotted or blue spotted sunfish, which are a native species and very colorful. There happen to be some on aquabid right now. They are also peaceful enough for a community tank and you could keep them at lower temps that loaches and cories will enjoy. Cooler temps (68-76) would also suit many barbs as opposed to tetras.

There are many, many choices out there to suit pretty much anybody. Browsing tangled up in cichlids and wet spot's stock lists will give you some eye candy to look at. Any questions you have, just post 'em up and I'll try to steer you in the right direction. I'm a certified fish nerd lol.

[ColdCuts]

Here's a stock list for you.....

3 groups of different Apistogramma cichlid species
20-30 Neons or Cardinals
6-10 Cories (Sterbai cories are great)
a single pearl gourami would probably do well with these fish as well as a couple misc plecos. Don't do common or sailfin plecos as they get way too big for a 75.
Ray, I appreciate your help. Thanks for chiming in.

You know, I had been looking at Apistogramma cichlids -- well, cichlids in general -- before I'd done any reading on them simply because they're beautiful and quite colorful. But I quickly dismissed them as candidates for my 'Beginner's Tranquil Community Tank' because according to, say, LiveAquaria.com (http://www.liveaquaria.com/product/prod_display.cfm?c=830+2855+1087&pcatid=1087), Apistos are not only semi-agressive, but also difficult to care for.

And Wikipedia says, 'Apistogramma species are very sensitive to changes in water chemistry. Apistogramma are best kept in species-only tanks... Although popular, Apistogramma species are not recommended for inexperienced cichlid hobbyists.' Sheesh. So, while Apistos are beautiful fish, I'm reluctant to build a community tank around these guys on my first foray into fishkeeping. Know what I mean?

I assembled the rough-draft stock list I posted using LiveAquaria's compatibility chart (http://www.liveaquaria.com/general/fwcompatibility_chart.cfm) as a reference. The chart is not super easy to read, and I guess one has to take these charts with a grain of salt anyway, but New World Cichlids are listed as either "caution required" or "not compatible" with everything besides plecos. Would you disagree with the "difficult" rap Apistos get, Ray? Are you not a big fan of the other stuff on my shortlist, or is it just that you're a big fan of cichlids?

Thanks again for taking the time. :)

[jjirons69]

+1 for Apistos. Check aquabid for a nice variety of apistos. The ones raised in hobby tanks are more tolerant to your home aquarium. The wild caught ones are less tolerant. Test your local water, if it's soft, the West African or Amazon tank is just right. If it's hard, a little additional African salt and you can have some nice Tanganyikan cichlids.

If "I" were you, I'd take that 75 G, fill it with Seachem Flourite/brown aquarium gravel mixed 50/50, puts lots of driftwood, and pack it with plants (java moss, jave ferns, amazon swords, cryptos, etc.) Research the net for low light plants unless you're going to go with over 2 watts/gallon lighting. I use around 1 watt/gallon and wouldn't have it any other way. I can't grow those light hungry plants, but I also don't have to trim the garden every few days either. That's the thing with a balanced aquarium, the poop feeds the plants and the plants absorb the nutrients before algae can get it. Next a couple big schools of dither fish - small tetras, cyprinidaes, etc. Get 20 or more that love to school and get a couple different kinds. Bolivian or blue rams are nice and you could handle 8-10 of them. Apistos are nice. Search for South American cichlids. Join a freshwater forum or lurk on several to get intell. Be very careful what you put in there, though. Once that tank is full of stuff, it's almost impossible to catch some of these guys to remove them. Add some cheapies to start with to slowly cycle the tank and after a couple of weeks, start gathering your stock. It'll take it a while to balance out, but it will eventually. Read, read, and read again. It's fun! Good luck.

[4WheelVFR]

I agree with Jamie on the Apistos. Many are raised in tap water and are not that hard to take care of at all. As for being aggressive, they may be feisty with each other, but are definitely community tank material. They are pretty harmless fish.
If you go with cories, loaches, or spiny eels (another awesome group of fish) make sure you have a fine substrate like sand. I'm not sure what the best balance would be substrate-wise to take care of plants though. You would need something fine enough not to damage cory and loach barbels, but something suitable for plants at the same time. Maybe Jamie can chime in on that one or look around on the plantedtank.net forums.

[hazydat620]

:po
you've peeked my interest about a tank. some good info here already, Time to start reading more I guess. Just having some some plants and some shrimp in a very large mason jar would be fun:hm

[ColdCuts]

Test your local water, if it's soft, the West African or Amazon tank is just right. If it's hard, a little additional African salt and you can have some nice Tanganyikan cichlids.
Ok, Jamie. You and Ray now have my interest piqued regarding dwarf cichlids. Especially Blue Rams. I also visited a LFS in Manhattan called Pacific Aquarium (http://www.pacificnyc.com/) where I was knocked out by their display tank which looks like this...

http://i37.photobucket.com/albums/e99/davidhudec/LocalFishStoreTravel-PacificAquariumNewYorkCityLocalFishStoreTravelEp59 62.png (http://s37.photobucket.com/user/davidhudec/media/LocalFishStoreTravel-PacificAquariumNewYorkCityLocalFishStoreTravelEp59 62.png.html)

So, as you suggested, I'd like to test my local water to see what my starting point is. That means I need a kit of some sort, yes? I'm excited. It'll be my first aquarium-related purchase. Looking online, there seems to be dozens to choose from: quick dip, battery operated, etc. Can you guys recommend one that'll suit my needs?

[Jefft72]

With regards to testing your water there are numerous brands available and they certainly range in price. A freshwater test kit should come with all necessary test solutions (ammonia, nitrite, nitrate, and pH). To test for hardness you will probably have to purchase a separate kit for GH (general hardness) and KH (Carbonate hardness).

That should give you a good baseline to start from.

[Jefft72]

Drs Foster Smith - Test Kits (http://www.drsfostersmith.com/fish-supplies/aquarium-water-quality-testing/freshwater-aquarium-test-kit/ps/c/3578/4345/17338?s=ts)

Dr Fosters & Smith is a good site to do research on available products.

[jjirons69]

I like this one - http://www.drsfostersmith.com/product/prod_display.cfm?c=3578+4345+17338+13521&pcatid=13521

Also, see if Pacific offers water testing. Keep the money local and help your LPS.

[jjirons69]

Cigars and aquariums - a great way to never have extra money! ;)

[4WheelVFR]

Cigars and aquariums - a great way to never have extra money! ;)

Yeah, no kidding.

[Jefft72]

Yeah, no kidding.

Roger that! I went from freshwater tropical (30g -> 55g), then turned the 55g into a planted freshwater. Both a 65g and made it into a saltwater reef. I ran both planted fresh and reef tanks for about year before I moved and shut down the fresh. I then upgraded the reef from a 55g to a 150g. Got into cigars about that time as well.

I ran the 150 for a little under 2 years and shut it down. Now I have a 12g freshwater biocube with neon tetras. I am itching to put plants in it. But then I realize that I will fall back into the trap.

[jjirons69]

http://i160.photobucket.com/albums/t178/jjirons69/Picture013_zps427df023.jpg


That was in August of last year - no pruning since then until this weekend. I could barely find my fish any longer. :D All 4 tanks needed landscaping.

First picture below is the jungle. After pulling out nearly a 5 G bucket of plants, the second picture is where she stands now. You'll notice the crypts in the front against the glass really did well over that 5-month period. I wish the pictures did them justice.

All together 2 - 5 G buckets of plants went into the compost. Incredible!

http://i160.photobucket.com/albums/t178/jjirons69/P1060125_zpscdc9004c.jpg


http://i160.photobucket.com/albums/t178/jjirons69/P1060126_zps53c093de.jpg

[Flynnster]

Thought I'd bring this back up!

After a really tough few months (never getting anything to live in my tank, no matter what I did) I gave it up for about a year.

Decided to start it back up recently. Figured maybe my water was the problem, so I've got brand new substrate along with only bottles spring water (5 gallons at a time) Now I've got a real simple tank with 4 guppies and 4 ghost shrimp.

So far so good, checking levels and keeping up with the water changes, hoping this time things work ou!

[Victor808]

I want to re-start having tanks when we move to a slightly bigger place. Being a city-boy I never have space for anything bigger than a 35G.

Flynn, I remember making a majorly dumb mistake once with an old tank, I just couldn't get the more sensitive fish to stay alive (rams especially) and was getting a lot of illness.

I realized that I was gradually increasing the salt concentration in my water changes... mainly because I was an idiot. When I did water-changes, I never took evaporation into account. Lets say I had a 35G tank, and that over a 3 week time there was about a half a gallon of evaporation... when I did a 30% water change I'd take out 10G, but replace that 10G with 10.5G of new water. As I always added a small amount of aquarium salt to my new water, that 0.5G replacement of slightly salted water was raising the tank salinity slightly every 2-3 weeks.

I don't know if this is a problem with your set-up, but it took me a while to figure it out... I just had a blind spot to that issue. I think it wasn't until I was looking at some salt-water tank videos and they were discussing automatic pumps to add fresh-water to maintain the strict salinity that I realized I was probably really screwing stuff up.