Vino Temp 102

[Munkey]

Why get a VinoTemp 28-Bottle VT?

Like a cooler, it’s a sealed environment. (minus the drain – see below). For those in areas with temp fluctuations or hot environments, it adds the benefit of cooling the unit as well. Uses a thermoelectric element, which is better for cigars than say a mini-bar fridge with a compressor, which will pull the moisture from your cigars. It’s better looking than a cooler (and only slightly more expensive), but not nearly as good looking as an Aristocrat (and much cheaper).

How much does it cost?

VT - $150-200 at Target
Beads - $30-50
Fan - $5
Shelves - $10 per shelf
Cedar trays - $10-20 per tray
Hygrometer - $20
Cigars – Up to your credit limit


Ewwww, it smells like plastic. What do I do? You can give it a washing with a mild soap or baking soda, but I let mine air out for 2 days (unplugged of course) and started putting boxes in. Within 3 days, it smelled just like a humi should.

Why add shelving? Looks/utility, Humidor Smell, Control moisture.
VT shelving is made to hold bottles, not cigar boxes or trays.

Source: Woodcraft.com

4”x36”x3/8” will make two shelves (on one level) Some Gorillas use 3 per level. Personally, I like the idea of more air-flow so 2 is sufficient. You will worry less about box placement as well since there are more gaps.

I’ve also heard gorillas say ¼ inch is sufficient to hold boxes without bending.

Do I need additional Cedar? No, the boxes and shelves you put in will be sufficient.

Remove the Vinotemp logo – 120-180 seconds of heat with a hairdryer to the front loosens the adhesive enough to pry it off carefully with your fingers. Goo Gone to remove the remaining residue.

Why use a fan? Even when turned on the fan in the VT only runs when the unit runs, in winter, it’s unlikely that you’ll have enough air circulation.

Oust or other kind of fan: Some use Hydra fans or computer fans. The majority of VT set-ups use Oust fans (although they are getting harder to find). Remove the cover for more air-flow if you use an Oust. Bobarian says: The covers unscrew, and the case splits in half. The fans will push more air this way. Use a rubber band to hold the battery in place.

I’m planning to use a 120 MM computer fan that is rated 42 CFM (Oust is 1-2 CFM). I’m adding a timer to run it at certain times of day.

I want to run a computer fan but don’t know how to power it without a computer?

BXT AC to 12V DC with 4-pin Molex Power Supply (Genuine UL Rated)

BXT-ACDC-MOLEX for 12.95 @ buyextras.com http://www.buyextras.com/bxtactodcpos.html

Note: you can buy a Molex 4-pin splitter and run two fans off one power supply if you desire two.

Active or passive humidification? 1.5-2 pounds of beads spread throughout the unit suffice. No need for an active system. However, some users swear by Cigar Oasis systems.

What RH beads are best? Personal preference. Based on what I see posted in the humi thread and bead threads, most Gorilla’s use 65% beads.

Temp – On or off? In a hot climate like FL, you probably want to run the VT, in milder climates the choice is yours, but you probably don’t need it unless the temp in your house is high. 66 degrees is the warmest you can make the VT run. It’s the setting most choose, but in extreme heat you may need to adjust to lower temps to make it work. The VT isn’t highly rated for making low temps for wine, but 66 degrees is fine for cigars. Note: the VT does not warm, so if you have a cold environment (say 32 degree garage), the unit will not warm your cigars to 66.

To plug the drain or not? I haven’t plugged the drain on mine, and haven’t noticed a huge loss in humidity. It’s a personal preference. If you live in a very humid area, odds are you are going to want to plug the drain and rig a system to catch the moisture from the unit. Some people recycle this into their beads, but I prefer to only add distilled water to my beads.

If you plug, use a odor free silicone or cover it with tape. One gorilla reported his plugged drain catches about 1/8” of water in a Cool Wh!p container each week in the summer. More on this topic by Shilala - http://www.cigarasylum.com/vb/showthread.php?t=8235

Where is the drain? On the floor of the VT if you look in the middle about 3/4 of the way to the back.

My VT wobbles, what can I do? The feet are adjustable.

I want to put some trays for singles in my VT, where should they go? Put them in the top or bottom of the unit. Placing them in front of the built in fan is potentially dangerous to your cigars as the constant air flow could dry your sticks out. (I now recommend NOT using trays.)

Will a VT stop the dreaded Beetle infestation? No. I’m not getting into a freeze vs. no freeze debate, there are other threads for that. You probably reduce Beetle Risk with a VT, but you’ll find people that report Beetles at less than 70 degrees.

Can I run cables through the drain? Yes, several Gorillas have successfully done this. It’s labor intensive since the drain is ‘S’ shaped. Also may require cutting the wires and re-attaching. Chewie says: I completely removed the drain assembly, which is very easy. Simply flip the fridge onto the front glass <lay a towel down first!> and use a wrench to remove the plastic hex nut holding the drain in place on the bottom rear. Then turn the fridge to the correct position, and use a pair of needle nose pliers to pull the drain assembly out. And just like ljh824, I used a drill bit to widen the hole a VERY slight amount. Finally, I used black caulk (looked better than the clear I originally used first) to make a very clean seal on both ends. Took about 20 minutes total.

Note: if you run wires through the drain, you probably want to build a drain catch.

Can I just put boxes on the floor of the VT? No, several gorillas have lost boxes of cigars after condensation built up and soaked the boxes. Also, the low first shelf offers a great place to keep your beads below.

How many cigars can I fit in a VT? barbourjay says: I have a hydra unit and about a pound and a half of beads. It's also completely full with close to 20 boxes and 3 singles trays.

[ChasDen]

I want to put some trays for singles in my VT, where should they go? Put them in the top or bottom of the unit. Placing them in front of the built in fan is potentially dangerous to your cigars as the constant air flow could dry your sticks out. (I now recommend NOT using trays.)


Not if your tray has a top like these:

http://i78.photobucket.com/albums/j94/shareall2/vino_trays/vinotrays01.jpg

:D

Very nice article :tu

Chas

[King James]

awesome post! May sway me to buy one! :tu

[Mr.Goodfella]

I really like the setup that you got going on. I never would have thought of something like that.
Although mine is not a Vino Temp it is a 28 bottle:
http://i289.photobucket.com/albums/ll202/baltesa/Winador001.jpg

This is from when I first purchased it. I will say that it is very easy to maintain a steady 65/65. I love everything about Winadors.

[BORIStheBLADE]

Why get a VinoTemp 28-Bottle VT?



Why use a fan? Even when turned on the fan in the VT only runs when the unit runs, in winter, it’s unlikely that you’ll have enough air circulation.




Nice post, good info.

With my vino set on the highest temp and the inside temp actually colder the fan is still circulating air while the vino is plugged in.

[chippewastud79]

Nice outline, except for you can't find the 28 bottle Vinotemp anymore :bh

[Prospector]

Nice outline, except for you can't find the 28 bottle Vinotemp anymore :bh

It's not that you can't find them; just that you can't find them cheap anymore. You can always go direct to Vinotemp and order them online.

http://www.vinotemp.com/View.aspx/2885/28-Bottle-Thermoelectric-Wine-Cooler-

[rizzle]

Good job bringing this over Munkey.

[Munkey]

Nice outline, except for you can't find the 28 bottle Vinotemp anymore :bh

You can, just not at Target anymore apparently. And the price is much higher than Target sold it for. Watch Craig's List or eBay. :2

[Agent11br]

interesting read!

[s15driftking]

here's a question.

Will a cigar oasis be enough to keep a 28 bottle vino nice and humidified?

[Munkey]

Yes, but it's really overkill. I haven't added water to my beads in months and just like a coolidor, the % stays very level. I put a hygro inside a box and left it for a few days and it was right on 65 which is what my beads are. Beads are also a lot cheaper than the oasis. and don't need a power supply.

[s15driftking]

well, i own an oasis... and would rather just use it instead of having to buy another LB of beads to match the 1lb i have right now in my other humidor.

[King James]

how much beads do you use?

And where would the best place to mount a fan controller be? could you run the wires through the drain opening?

[s15driftking]

Ok,

Here's a question to the Vino-gods.

I have a cigar oasis on the very bottom of my vino and it keeps the thing well humidified... welll it's now too much humidity in a sense.

Here's the problem. i have two salt tested same-brand hygros and one is on the bottom and the other is o the top shelf. The one on the bottom reads 65% and the one on top reads 74% (respectively)....

My question is.. how do i even that out? Should i buy an oust fan to circulate the air? will the oust fan do the job? Should i put the fan up top where its very humid or down low where its right at 65?

What should i do?

[Parshooter]

Here's the problem. i have two salt tested same-brand hygros and one is on the bottom and the other is o the top shelf. The one on the bottom reads 65% and the one on top reads 74% (respectively)....

What should i do?

That's strange. I've always believed that humidity will fall, therefore the bottom should have more humidity than the top. Check your cigars. Do the cigars at the top level feel the same as the ones on the bottom? Maybe you should invest in a nice digital hygrometer as well.

[Prospector]

Ok,

Here's the problem. i have two salt tested same-brand hygros and one is on the bottom and the other is o the top shelf. The one on the bottom reads 65% and the one on top reads 74% (respectively)....



Have you tried swapping the two hygros, just as a sanity check on their operation? It would be interesting to see how they read then.

[Raralith]

Ok,
My question is.. how do i even that out? Should i buy an oust fan to circulate the air? will the oust fan do the job? Should i put the fan up top where its very humid or down low where its right at 65?

What should i do?

Do you have anything obscuring the heatsink fan? Do you have boxes pushed directly onto it? If so, move the boxes and give it some room. The fan has holes on the front, top and bottom so air circulates in all directions. Also, is your drain plugged?

An oust fan won't do much in my opinion. The oust fan is 1-2 CFM, 3-4 if you remove the cover, and the fan in the Vino itself is much stronger. If you do want more airflow, you need to use computer fans which can be easily hooked up via a 12v adapter (found at RadioShack).

What you should do is just invest in some beads. A pound of beads split in two for top and bottom will almost always fix this problem. $30 for a lifetime of use, and passively working is probably the best thing you could buy besides a humidor for your cigars. You may like your Oasis, and paid a pretty penny for it but for a Vino, beads are the way to go.

[s15driftking]

That's strange. I've always believed that humidity will fall, therefore the bottom should have more humidity than the top. Check your cigars. Do the cigars at the top level feel the same as the ones on the bottom? Maybe you should invest in a nice digital hygrometer as well.

there is more humidty on top, and the cigars are a bit softer up top when i do the squeeze test. i should have also mentioned that both hygros are digital.


Have you tried swapping the two hygros, just as a sanity check on their operation? It would be interesting to see how they read then.

yes, i have done this and they (respectively) tell me that there is mroe humidity on top.


Rarilith, i appreciate your advice on the beads but i'm not ready to go that route.

My basic question to everyone who is trying to help is this... Will the RH even out top-to-bottom if i get some circulation going in there? shoudl i put the fan up high or down low.

I've used beads and other types of passive humidification which didn't produce what i wanted and as of right now i'm never looking back.

[Prospector]

My basic question to everyone who is trying to help is this... Will the RH even out top-to-bottom if i get some circulation going in there? shoudl i put the fan up high or down low.



It should. Getting some circulation going in there should induce mixing and eliminate the humidity stratification that you are seeing. Theoretically it shouldn't really matter where the fan is placed as long as it induces mixing of the entire volume.

caveat: I can't speak from any experience as I don't yet have a vino.

[Raralith]

Rarilith, i appreciate your advice on the beads but i'm not ready to go that route.

My basic question to everyone who is trying to help is this... Will the RH even out top-to-bottom if i get some circulation going in there? shoudl i put the fan up high or down low.

I've used beads and other types of passive humidification which didn't produce what i wanted and as of right now i'm never looking back.

Air circulation is not the best route, especially if you are aging cigars. Air circulation creates more fermentation which speeds up aging, but the cigars do not age as beautifully. This is why dress boxes aged faster than SLB/cab's, but cigars in cab's aged much better in the long run - less air circulation, less air flow. This isn't a problem if you are smoking NC's, and not aging the NC's either. But this, in my opinion, is not a good route for aging sticks.

But you should look back at passive humidification, many people on these forums use it and there's a good reason why.

To answer your question specificly though, yes the RH should balance out if you use fans. It doesn't matter which way you point (up or down, high or low) the fans either because within a few hours there would be enough air circulation to cover the Vino. Make sure that your drain is plugged though.

[s15driftking]

Make sure that your drain is plugged though.


School me on why the drain must be plugged? thanks

[white_s2k]

School me on why the drain must be plugged? thanks

http://www.cigarasylum.com/vb/showthread.php?t=8235

[zmancbr]

http://www.cigarasylum.com/vb/showthread.php?t=8235

You were quicker than I was lol... that was the thread I was looking for. :D

[white_s2k]

You were quicker than I was lol... that was the thread I was looking for. :D

LOL I started to type out an explanation, but then thought wait.. let me just find Shilala's thread :D

[Raralith]

School me on why the drain must be plugged? thanks

Well, if you didn't have it plugged, I'm fairly certain that's the reason. I'd check the pan too on the bottom; my guess it has water in it.

[s15driftking]

mine isnt a vino, its an edgestar so there is a pan out back. with a little bung that loosk like a hollowed out bolt... i think im just going to put a foot long tube (that fits nice and snug) over the drain spout (note- its outside the vino) so that i can plug the drain (in a sense) and still let it capture water without having to rig a run-off system.

[Raralith]

mine isnt a vino, its an edgestar so there is a pan out back. with a little bung that loosk like a hollowed out bolt... i think im just going to put a foot long tube (that fits nice and snug) over the drain spout (note- its outside the vino) so that i can plug the drain (in a sense) and still let it capture water without having to rig a run-off system.

You don't want to capture water though because there should be no water; that's why you have a humidifier. If there is enough moisture, the humidifier shouldn't do anything, if there's not enough it should add some. If you have a pool of water on the bottom of your Vino and you have it sealed, you are doing something wrong. If it's draining, it's because the ambient outside is sucking out that moisture. Both of these are bad for a humidor. This is why beads are so good - they have the ability to both release and absorb water, and you can easily recharge or discharge moisture from them. Read shilala's post because he makes a very good description of what the drainage hole is,

"First off, the vino drain is a hole. It's a hole in my humidor.
If I had a half inch hole in the front of my desktop it'd make keeping the humidity stable a real challenge. Being as I know it's not supposed to be there, I'd plug that sucker up.
Now if I choose to leave it there, I can use lots of beads, a hydra, sponges, voodoo, and lots of effort and manage to keep the humidity where I want it. If that's okay by me and I have the time or enjoy doing it, by all means I should keep my hole and go along being happy."

[s15driftking]

You don't want to capture water though because there should be no water; that's why you have a humidifier. If there is enough moisture, the humidifier shouldn't do anything.


Don't people put rags or cups on the bottom of their vinos because they want to catch and hold the water? So if there should be no water than shouldnt they drain it?

I understand hte importance of taking the rag/cup out to pour it out as often as possible. I am going to experiment with it and post results.

[STYX&STONED]

After having a hard time trying to figure this out a couple of weeks ago, I went to one of the PHD's here in the lab and asked for an explanation for this very problem. And here is what he came up with.
"The temp of the confined space plays a roll as well as the density of the space (how packed is it with cigars) & CFM of air flow around the booty stashed in the confined space."

Take it for what it's worth, I don't usually put a lot of weight in a PHD's response to most questions for they are mostly "THEORY" types I work with but his explanation seems to make sense to me.........

[landhoney]

The one on the bottom reads 65% and the one on top reads 74% (respectively)....


You don't need 'respectively' in that sentence. :tu

[s15driftking]

You don't need 'respectively' in that sentence. :tu

You are right. I should have said....

"the top half and bottom half are at 74% and 64%, respectively."

i believe that would be correct, sorry!

[fatboy05]

Love my VT
if your looking for the most realible place to keep your stash this is it

Beads, set it and forget it.
Mine stays at 65 Deg and 68-70 Hum.

I did plug my drain and recycle the the water back into the beads

[Mirrorlure7m]

I have a question I just ordered 70%RH beads will I be alright with 2 pounds of the 70% beads ? Or are the 65% better for the Vinotemp 28?

[King James]

I have a question I just ordered 70%RH beads will I be alright with 2 pounds of the 70% beads ? Or are the 65% better for the Vinotemp 28?

The % Doesn't really matter for which type of storage you are using, it is the amount of beads that matters. You want to have enough for what ever size storage you have.

The % Is more so a matter of WHAT you are storing. If Non-Cuban some like using the higher 70% beads. For Cubans the 65% beads seem to be favored. Although personal preference is important to.

[ChasDen]

The vino is roughly 4400 cubic inches.

Based on the Heartfelt site you only need 8 oz of beads.

Past experience tells me to always double that number.

To be safe I then double it for a wine cooler since the RH jumps up and down when it cycles.

As for 65 vs 70, it depends on what you like. I started with 70% and switched to 65%.
I like my cigars a little dryer. They tend to burn better for my smoking style at 65%

Chas

[DPD6030]

there is more humidty on top, and the cigars are a bit softer up top when i do the squeeze test. i should have also mentioned that both hygros are digital.




yes, i have done this and they (respectively) tell me that there is mroe humidity on top.


Rarilith, i appreciate your advice on the beads but i'm not ready to go that route.

My basic question to everyone who is trying to help is this... Will the RH even out top-to-bottom if i get some circulation going in there? shoudl i put the fan up high or down low.

I've used beads and other types of passive humidification which didn't produce what i wanted and as of right now i'm never looking back.

Bob,
I have my computer fan pointed on an angle at a 45 degree or so upward so it blows from the bottom of the vino and off the glass door up to the top. I'm always within 1-2 % from top to bottom. Oh and I have beads. :2

[Mirrorlure7m]

The vino is roughly 4400 cubic inches.

Based on the Heartfelt site you only need 8 oz of beads.

Past experience tells me to always double that number.

To be safe I then double it for a wine cooler since the RH jumps up and down when it cycles.

As for 65 vs 70, it depends on what you like. I started with 70% and switched to 65%.
I like my cigars a little dryer. They tend to burn better for my smoking style at 65%

Chas

Thanks guys. I ordered the 70% I got 2 pounds and 2 oust fans from Heartfelt. I am hoping it will not go over 72% and no lower then 68% then I will be happy. This Vinotemp 28 I am setting up with be for my rare and hard to get cigars I want to age. I will get another Vinotemp for me everyday smokes later on. But my main focus is on the aging vinotemp now.

[s15driftking]

Bob,
I have my computer fan pointed on an angle at a 45 degree or so upward so it blows from the bottom of the vino and off the glass door up to the top. I'm always within 1-2 % from top to bottom. Oh and I have beads. :2

Thansk for the info,

I should update all of you... it seems like the only reason i had higher humidity on top was due to a bad "tetris" situation. i moved some stuff around after i recieved chas' trays and im good all throughout.

BTW, i might add:

i never plugged my drain and i have experienced zero problems thus far... BUT, the edgestar is a bit different since the drain route starts halfway up the back instead of the bottom so any excess "water" will route itself out without being able to damage anything.

[kydsid]

Does anyone know if Vinos are still available at Target? I can only find them for about 400 online but none at Target.

[Mirrorlure7m]

Check your PM they are online for 300 in some places. Edit nevermind I just looked and the price is 400 now .. WOW

[DPD6030]

Does anyone know if Vinos are still available at Target? I can only find them for about 400 online but none at Target.

I don't think Target has anymore. Months and months ago I searched about 50 Targets with no such luck. Craigslist or Eeeebay is probably your best bet right now :2

[Mirrorlure7m]

I don't think Target has anymore. Months and months ago I searched about 50 Targets with no such luck. Craigslist or Eeeebay is probably your best bet right now :2

Yeah I looked on ebay when I was about to get mine they never had the 28 bottle unit. Which is the one you want to get. I got mine for 300 less then a month ago but checked the website and it is 400 now. I should have bought two . Becuase I need another one since I filled mine up already.

[kydsid]

Well what is it that makes the VT28 so preferrable. From the current pricing I am thinking of spending a bit more for more room and get this new model.

http://www.vinotemp.com/View.aspx/2957/32-Bottle-Thermoelectric-Wine-Cooler-–-2-Temperature-Zones

[rizzle]

Well what is it that makes the VT28 so preferrable. From the current pricing I am thinking of spending a bit more for more room and get this new model.

http://www.vinotemp.com/View.aspx/2957/32-Bottle-Thermoelectric-Wine-Cooler-–-2-Temperature-Zones
The reason the VT28 was so popular is it could be bought straight up for $199 and would go on sale at Target all the time for $139- $159. So it was cost/storage space primarily.

The one you have listed...you're about to pay 4 - 5 times what most all of us paid for the 28 for probably less storage space because of the dual zones.

:2

[kydsid]

The reason the VT28 was so popular is it could be bought straight up for $199 and would go on sale at Target all the time for $139- $159. So it was cost/storage space primarily.

The one you have listed...you're about to pay 4 - 5 times what most all of us paid for the 28 for probably less storage space because of the dual zones.

:2

Thanks. Sounds like I moved back down to the lower 48 a bit too late. Well I'll keep looking as cooling is very much necessary were I am living now.

[s15driftking]

mayeb this retailer will blow them out for 199.00 again. i would suggest PM'ing him...

http://www.cigarasylum.com/vb/showthread.php?t=9580&page=5

[ECPrevatte]

I bought a super cheap one on Ebay. It's a 6 bottle vinotemp for $30.00 shipped. It was brand new, not a scratch and dent one either. (I can direct you to the store ebay store if you are interested) I live in a college dorm so I needed something small. Shelves are being made for it, but so far it holds up really good. I don't have tons of cigars, or tons of space so this smaller one is perfect. Plus it won't break your wallet.

http://i68.photobucket.com/albums/i14/P-vot/005-2.jpg

Nifty little sticker I made for the door: :D
http://i68.photobucket.com/albums/i14/P-vot/003-2.jpg
Little side sticker, because I can: :fu
http://i68.photobucket.com/albums/i14/P-vot/006-2.jpg