Any BitCoin users?

[timj219]

I saw this offer recently at the website of an offshore cigar vendor

"Save on credit card fees and receive a 5% discount by paying with Bitcoin!"

Has anybody here taken advantage of an offer like this? I think I might - I can always use a 5% discount and as long as I do not intend to leave any money in bitcoins I should be fine when the bubble bursts right?

[cmitch]

Bit coin is a virtual currency that made it's debut in 06 or 07 and has swelled to a currency worth of 750 million U.S. dollars. Not huge, in comparison, but gaining in popularity. Persons who 'invested' in bit coin have seen about a 40% return. It's hyped because of the Cyprus currency break down and the fact it isn't tied to any particular government, so, according to the article I read about it, Bit coin isn't subject to the volatilities of the currency market, which is why I would be scared of it. My biggest question: What or Who stands behind it if something goes sour? Now, it would be great if a large investment firm bought gold and then sold bit coin and it was backed up by the gold.

[DennisP]

You're going to pay a fee to buy the bitcoins....

[markem]

BitCoin is a logical derivation from digital cash, original concept by David Chaum. The principle feature is that it cannot be traced (not actually mathematically proven yet for bitcoin, I don't think). As far as a currency goes, it seems to be gaining momentum. The main problem that I haven't seen adequately address is how to get your money back out. If you buy a product with them, that is one way to get money back. Of course, if you get a refund, it will be in bitcoins as well.

I think that all the little extra bitcoins that one has in their account will rapidly become like the foreign currency brought back from vacation. Put on a shelf and quickly forgotten.

It is quite likely to catch on in Euro countries except probably Great Britain and maybe Germany since if you buy at the right time, you can avoid certain currency fluxuations as long as you are flexible on the spending side.

If you can buy just enough to make the purchase and no more, then it is probably worth the effort. Dunno right now on the best ways to go about buying the bitcoins.

[equetefue]

not worth the 5% IMO

[jjirons69]

Saw that, too. I'll continue to use my Visa or Amer Express.

[AdamJoshua]

This from their website.


The price of a bitcoin can unpredictably increase or decrease over a short period of time due to its young economy, novel nature, and sometimes illiquid markets. Consequently, keeping your savings in bitcoin is not recommended. Bitcoin should be considered as a high risk asset, and you should never store money that you cannot afford to lose with Bitcoin. If you receive payments with Bitcoin, many service providers allow you to convert them instantly to your local currency.
Any transaction you issue with Bitcoin cannot be reversed. It can only be refunded by the person receiving the funds. That means you should take care to do business with people or organizations you know and trust.

Yah I'll pass.

[macsauce13]

Currently it's main use is for drugs. Its a black market item in beta for real world use. I know it isn't exclusively for drugs, but that is where the majority is spent.

[AdamJoshua]

:r

[timj219]

Currently it's main use is for drugs. Its a black market item in beta for real world use. I know it isn't exclusively for drugs, but that is where the majority is spent.Well I'm right in step then. Nicotine is a drug right? Now I can feel edgy and dangerous again like in my youth :)

[Apoco]

My biggest question: What or Who stands behind it if something goes sour? Now, it would be great if a large investment firm bought gold and then sold bit coin and it was backed up by the gold.

No one is backing it. It is worth X amount because people have agreed that is what it is worth (this is what is known as an "exchange valued currency").

It may sound odd - but it is the truth. Keep in mind that the US hasn't been on the gold standard since Nixon put a stop to it in 1971. There's really nothing behind the US dollar either - aside from the fact that people agree that it has value. This holds true for the US Dollar, the British Pound, the Euro, etc.

At this point, gold is used as a safe haven from fear of currency problems. When the US (and really the entire world) was crashing in 2008, everyone was fleeing from currency and into gold. The mindset being that if SHTF in a big way, gold might become the currency/bartering tool of choice going forward.

That's how I understand money/currency today, at least.

Currently it's main use is for drugs. Its a black market item in beta for real world use. I know it isn't exclusively for drugs, but that is where the majority is spent.

I'd expand that to say that it is used for anything you don't want tracked (usually for legal reasons, admittedly). Online gambling is another big market. Along with items that are embargoed for political or health reasons (cuban cigars, unpasteurized cheeses, etc).

Although right now a lot of people are using it as an investment vehicle. Just holding onto their bitcoins as the value continues to inflate.

It is interesting because bitcoins aren't just created whenever there is a need. Bitcoins are only created/released at very scheduled times, and it is clearly relayed when those times are. So what we see is the true effect of demand and demand alone. The value isn't affected by bankruptcy concerns, it isn't affected by additional money being printed, it isn't affected by an earnings release or by unemployment numbers. It moves almost at random. It is really quite interesting from an economics perspective.

That being said - I don't want any part of it. I believe that I am relatively well informed on bitcoins, but I'm just not willing to gamble on them. It is too random for me at this point.
Posted via Mobile Device

[timj219]

You're going to pay a fee to buy the bitcoins....You know that really should have occurred to me :fp I'll bet there goes the 5% and without that I'm not going to bother.

[timj219]

I have no intention of investing in bitcoins - I know enough about them to realize that only someone with more expertise and enough spare cash to take a flyer will likely profit from it. I'm looking strictly at the possibility of transactional use.

[AdamJoshua]

No one is backing it. It is worth X amount because people have agreed that is what it is worth (this is what is known as an "exchange valued currency").

It may sound odd - but it is the truth. Keep in mind that the US hasn't been on the gold standard since Nixon put a stop to it in 1971. There's really nothing behind the US dollar either - aside from the fact that people agree that it has value. This holds true for the US Dollar, the British Pound, the Euro, etc.

At this point, gold is used as a safe haven from fear of currency problems. When the US (and really the entire world) was crashing in 2008, everyone was fleeing from currency and into gold. The mindset being that if SHTF in a big way, gold might become the currency/bartering tool of choice going forward.

That's how I understand money/currency today, at least.



I'd expand that to say that it is used for anything you don't want tracked (usually for legal reasons, admittedly). Online gambling is another big market. Along with items that are embargoed for political or health reasons (cuban cigars, unpasteurized cheeses, etc).

Although right now a lot of people are using it as an investment vehicle. Just holding onto their bitcoins as the value continues to inflate.

It is interesting because bitcoins aren't just created whenever there is a need. Bitcoins are only created/released at very scheduled times, and it is clearly relayed when those times are. So what we see is the true effect of demand and demand alone. The value isn't affected by bankruptcy concerns, it isn't affected by additional money being printed, it isn't affected by an earnings release or by unemployment numbers. It moves almost at random. It is really quite interesting from an economics perspective.

That being said - I don't want any part of it. I believe that I am relatively well informed on bitcoins, but I'm just not willing to gamble on them. It is too random for me at this point.
Posted via Mobile Device

All of that being said, they are tracked by governments, what you think they don't want their taxes, even on bitcoins site they bring this up several times.

[The Poet]

Two IDs required for cash. :D

[dave]

Police recently dragged friend's teenager out of very bad situation. Largely drugs, but the 'group' was clearly relieving people of their bitcoins, too. Steal bitcoins; buy drugs overseas with bitcoins; sell drugs here for dollars.
I have no details, but apparently the electronic security isn't quite what you might find using BoA or Citi services.

[DennisP]

Here's a pretty interesting article if one is interested in learning about bitcoins. http://www.macroriskadvisors.com/layout/pdf/bitcoin%20primer%20BTC.pdf

Security on bitcoins themselves is fantastic. I think some of the issues have come with the operators you can buy from.

[stearns]

certainly an interesting phenomenon to watch, i know people that bought at 10 and sold at 130, making a hefty little profit. It's too volatile for my tastes, and not worth going through the efforts to aquire them solely for a single purchase, but definitely interesting to watch

[AdamJoshua]

The interesting thing is there are no FINRA / AML rules surrounding bitcoins, easier for the bad guys to use them, real bad guys, not guys selling weed.

[Weelok]

I'd expand that to say that it is used for anything you don't want tracked (usually for legal reasons, admittedly). Online gambling is another big market. Along with items that are embargoed for political or health reasons (cuban cigars, unpasteurized cheeses, etc).

Posted via Mobile Device

And there in lies its value if your trying to buy items outside the US that you don't want Uncle Sam to know your buying. I only buy non-ISOMs but I can see how those buying ISOMs may find the bit coin appealing.

[jjirons69]

I'm thinking about chucking my cigars and starting an unpasteurized cheese hobby! Couldn't be much worse for me.

[cmitch]

No one is backing it. It is worth X amount because people have agreed that is what it is worth (this is what is known as an "exchange valued currency").

It may sound odd - but it is the truth. Keep in mind that the US hasn't been on the gold standard since Nixon put a stop to it in 1971. There's really nothing behind the US dollar either - aside from the fact that people agree that it has value. This holds true for the US Dollar, the British Pound, the Euro, etc.

At this point, gold is used as a safe haven from fear of currency problems. When the US (and really the entire world) was crashing in 2008, everyone was fleeing from currency and into gold. The mindset being that if SHTF in a big way, gold might become the currency/bartering tool of choice going forward.

That's how I understand money/currency today, at least.



I'd expand that to say that it is used for anything you don't want tracked (usually for legal reasons, admittedly). Online gambling is another big market. Along with items that are embargoed for political or health reasons (cuban cigars, unpasteurized cheeses, etc).

Although right now a lot of people are using it as an investment vehicle. Just holding onto their bitcoins as the value continues to inflate.

It is interesting because bitcoins aren't just created whenever there is a need. Bitcoins are only created/released at very scheduled times, and it is clearly relayed when those times are. So what we see is the true effect of demand and demand alone. The value isn't affected by bankruptcy concerns, it isn't affected by additional money being printed, it isn't affected by an earnings release or by unemployment numbers. It moves almost at random. It is really quite interesting from an economics perspective.

That being said - I don't want any part of it. I believe that I am relatively well informed on bitcoins, but I'm just not willing to gamble on them. It is too random for me at this point.
Posted via Mobile Device

This is basically what I tried to say but more abbreviated and, albeit, poorly. Bit coin isn't backed by anybody. U.S. currency is backed by the good faith and trust in the U.S. Government which is pretty much worthless as well.

[AdamJoshua]

I'm thinking about chucking my cigars and starting an unpasteurized cheese hobby! Couldn't be much worse for me.

Don't chuck em, tell you what I'm an authorized dog rocket disposal professional, I give you one dowah for them and will be responsible for the incredibly high fees for disposal. I'll also throw in some liquid vegetable rennet to get your cheese operation off the ground!

Back on track, the more I read about bitcoin the less interested in it I am, I read the FA's paper on the way it works and security and I don't buy it, where there are large sums of money there are very organized individuals and for that matter entire governments looking for a piece of the action, in this case non-friendly governments that I'm sure have no problem with screwing a lot of people out of a lot of cash.

[themoneycollector]

Can't really add much more than what has been said.

I've looked into bitcoins, even tried mining a little bit. Now that it has blown up over the last 2 weeks after Cyprus banking issues, I tried to explain it to a few people.

Usually I get a long pause and then get asked "so it's a virtual currency that has no backing, why would anyone want it" LOL. It's complicated, but definitely still has potential for making money off the recent growth. The bubble has to pop soon though.

[Apoco]

So Bitcoin lost ~50% of it's value.

Today.

In 8 hours.

Source (http://www.businessinsider.com/bitcoin-plunges-2013-4)

[themoneycollector]

The bubble has to pop soon though.

So Bitcoin lost ~50% of it's value.

Today.

In 8 hours.

Source (http://www.businessinsider.com/bitcoin-plunges-2013-4)

Although it rebounded to nearly all of its value. Dunno if that's a good sign or bad.

[emopunker2004]

Hey you guys. This is news! Bitcoin crackdown by the .gov

http://thehill.com/blogs/hillicon-valley/technology/299921-feds-crack-down-on-bitcoin-exchange

[AUguy]

So I've been playing around with a couple of crypto currencies lately. Not as an investment though. Just using them because I think it is an interesting concept even if they all end up being worthless in the end.

I have a few bucks worth of bitcoin and I am looking to get a little more but I don't 100% trust the sites that sell them for USD. If anyone on here has some pm me if you would be willing to trade some BTC for a few cigars. Not looking to sell a bunch of stuff. Just 20 or 30 bucks worth.