The Official 2012 NFL Draft Talk Thread

[shilala]

I think it's way past time to get this thing started.

I'm in love with Matt Flynn. I have been for a few years now. It's nice to see him on the market, and I'd like to see him in Miami, but there's a lot of lip going on here in Cleveland about him. No respect lip because Cleveland fans are borderline retarded, but they've totally abandoned Colt McCoy, who's a serviceable QB, and they're all hollering for a QB when they have gaping holes to fill elsewhere.

That brings me to the question, what's the $ number for placing the Franchise tag on a backup QB, and will Green Bay make that move?
I think it comes down to dollars and cents, but with Rodgers a head shot away from finishing his career, it seems kinda crazy to let an arm like Flynn get away. Not kinda, just crazy. But if the money isn't there, it isn't there, and Green Bay has lots of needs.

No clue what the Steelers are looking to do aside from deal Wallace. I could see a Wallace for Hillis trade with Cleveland, or I should say I'd love to see Hillis in Burgh. Mendenhall is gone for next year and we're really light at RB. We need a left guard, as always. There's some kids from last year who were hurt that will be available this year, so that may clean up that problem. I see them chasing a couple D-backs in late rounds in hopes they can get ready to fill some aged positions.
We could use a big, heavy, strong QB to back up Ben. Leftwich should be ready and Batch and Dixon will likely be gone.

I could go on forever, but there's some starters. :D

[JenksAnejo]

I could definitely see Pitt taking a O-Line late in the first round. Cordy Glenn from Georgia would be a great fit if he lasts that long. The dude is 6'4 340 an absolute monster!!

As a Rams fan I'm hoping that Cleveland trades their #4 and #22 for the #2 overall. If that happens I would like the Rams to get Blackmon @ #4 and hopefully get either Peter Konz (maybe too high for a center) or Jonathan Martin if available.

I think Flynn is gone from GB.. I think they would take a late first or early second rounder and get rid of him. GB has a few needs that should be addressed in the first two rounds.

[larryinlc]

From JSonline: This was a result of the Finley signing

http://www.jsonline.com/sports/packers/finleyearly22212-140081103.html

Not having to use the franchise tag puts the Packers in a position of strength heading into the off-season. They're unlikely to use it on center Scott Wells, who will be an unrestricted free agent, because the franchise salary for an offensive lineman is $8.4 million, which is likely more than they would be willing to pay.

But they could use it on quarterback Matt Flynn, which could put them in the middle of a bidding war for the young backup's services. If they franchise Flynn before the March 5 deadline, they would be on the hook for a $14.4 million salary, but their intention would be to do a sign-and-trade.

In other words, they would shop Flynn to those interested in him and take the best offer. Flynn would have to agree to renegotiate the one-year deal into a long-term contract before any team would be willing to make a trade.

[shilala]

I could definitely see Pitt taking a O-Line late in the first round. Cordy Glenn from Georgia would be a great fit if he lasts that long. The dude is 6'4 340 an absolute monster!!

That would be priceless. We need more help on the ends than in the middle, but that'd allow things to get shuffled around a bit. :tu

As a Rams fan I'm hoping that Cleveland trades their #4 and #22 for the #2 overall. If that happens I would like the Rams to get Blackmon @ #4 and hopefully get either Peter Konz (maybe too high for a center) or Jonathan Martin if available.

I think Flynn is gone from GB.. I think they would take a late first or early second rounder and get rid of him. GB has a few needs that should be addressed in the first two rounds.

I've heard that 4 and 22 to 2 scenario. That puts them on RG3. It just doesn't make sense. For them to go after a QB nullifies everything they did the last two years and leaves them at start over.
Add to that, Colt is a good enough QB. He's not Aaron Rodgers but he's sure not Tim Tebow or Rex Grossman.
Cleveland could grab Blackmon at #4 or give up their #4 and go after Mike Wallace. They need a wideout, bad. They might even be able to get Hillis to Burgh in a deal, but that leaves them with no running game. Cleveland needs Hillis, but I really don't think Hillis wants Cleveland. That's understandable, because the fans here will turn on a guy in a heartbeat. While he was hurt this year the talk radio was slap full of "Hillis is laying down" comments and "Hillis needs to be gone" comments, and that never ends. Why anyone would want to play in this town is beyond me. It really is pathetic, I've never seen anything quite like it. I think it comes from the Browns leaving.

Agreed on Flynn. I just hope for Green Bay's sake they can keep him.

[shilala]

From JSonline: This was a result of the Finley signing

http://www.jsonline.com/sports/packers/finleyearly22212-140081103.html

Not having to use the franchise tag puts the Packers in a position of strength heading into the off-season. They're unlikely to use it on center Scott Wells, who will be an unrestricted free agent, because the franchise salary for an offensive lineman is $8.4 million, which is likely more than they would be willing to pay.

But they could use it on quarterback Matt Flynn, which could put them in the middle of a bidding war for the young backup's services. If they franchise Flynn before the March 5 deadline, they would be on the hook for a $14.4 million salary, but their intention would be to do a sign-and-trade.

In other words, they would shop Flynn to those interested in him and take the best offer. Flynn would have to agree to renegotiate the one-year deal into a long-term contract before any team would be willing to make a trade.

Henne is an unrestricted free agent this year in Miami and reports are that Miami is not offering him a contract.
That pretty much lines up Green Bay to sign and deal Flynn. They could easily get a draft pick, I'd think. Depends how hot Miami is for Flynn, and I think they're as hot as they get.

[14holestogie]

I believe the Packers franchise Flynn (they would be dumb NOT to) and trade him for a couple of high draft picks. They have Harrell ready to progress through their QB school, which has been the best league wide producer of starting qb's since the mid-90's. They'll draft another project in the later rounds for a 3rd stringer. :2

[shilala]

Miami has #8, Tim. Green Bay could use it.
What's the talk there? What kind of draft scenarios/player moves are you guys looking at?

[Stephen]

Miami has #8, Tim. Green Bay could use it.
What's the talk there? What kind of draft scenarios/player moves are you guys looking at?
No way in Hell do they get the #8 for Flynn. I'd be estatic with similar compensation that the Patriots received for Cassel, although I don't see that happening, either.

[Stephen]

Not having to use the franchise tag puts the Packers in a position of strength heading into the off-season. They're unlikely to use it on center Scott Wells, who will be an unrestricted free agent, because the franchise salary for an offensive lineman is $8.4 million, which is likely more than they would be willing to pay.
As an aside, am I the only one who thinks it's retarded that when franchising a player, offensive lineman are lumped all together, but no other position is (secondary, defensive line)?

[Stephen]

But if the money isn't there, it isn't there, and Green Bay has lots of needs.
http://i1.kym-cdn.com/entries/icons/original/000/000/015/orly.jpg
No clue what the Steelers are looking to do aside from deal Wallace. I could see a Wallace for Hillis trade with Cleveland, or I should say I'd love to see Hillis in Burgh.
Hillis is an UFA.
We could use a big, heavy, strong QB to back up Ben. Leftwich should be ready and Batch and Dixon will likely be gone.

I could go on forever, but there's some starters. :D
Watching Todd Haley and Roethlisberger interact, if nothing else, should be entertaining next season.:D

[14holestogie]

Miami has #8, Tim. Green Bay could use it.
What's the talk there? What kind of draft scenarios/player moves are you guys looking at?

I think #8 might be kinda high for Flynn as well, but stranger things have happened with desperate teams. As far as talking about other moves, Ted and Mike play it pretty close to the vest, but I'd hope we'd be looking for a pass rusher / secondary upgrades.

[shilala]

What about Peyton? Is he staying or gone?
He has spurs and needs another neck operation right now, or has had it already, I haven't kept up. I know he wants to play and I want to watch him, but for his own good, I hope he doesn't take another snap.
He would totally own a broadcast booth job and I think he can have some fun as far as his acting talent goes if that interests him.

[shilala]

Ya, Rly. A defense would kick ass. :tu
http://i1.kym-cdn.com/entries/icons/original/000/000/015/orly.jpg

[Stephen]

Ya, Rly. A defense would kick ass. :tu
You'd be amazed by what one measley pass rusher would do so that Matthews isn't triple teamed and the secondary isn't asked to cover for eight to ten seconds every pass. They're one year removed from being the #2 overall defense, remember? They lost Jenkins to free agency, and there went the pressure from the opposite side of Matthews.

[Stephen]

What about Peyton? Is he staying or gone?
He has spurs and needs another neck operation right now, or has had it already, I haven't kept up. I know he wants to play and I want to watch him, but for his own good, I hope he doesn't take another snap.
He would totally own a broadcast booth job and I think he can have some fun as far as his acting talent goes if that interests him.
From everything I've read/heard, the problem isn't with his neck at this point, it's with his arm, or more specifically lack of arm strength, a byproduct of all the nerve damage suffered.

[shilala]

You'd be amazed by what one measley pass rusher would do so that Matthews isn't triple teamed and the secondary isn't asked to cover for eight to ten seconds every pass. They're one year removed from being the #2 overall defense, remember? They lost Jenkins to free agency, and there went the pressure from the opposite side of Matthews.
Even if that's all it is, and I give you that, it's a tough spot to fill. That's gotta come from free agency, not the draft.
If the Pack wants to stop that bleeding, there's no 14 million for Flynn, so he's a memory. And if they can wrangle the 8th pick from Miami, can they pay for it ?
I'm not even arguing, just asking. :)

[shilala]

From everything I've read/heard, the problem isn't with his neck at this point, it's with his arm, or more specifically lack of arm strength, a byproduct of all the nerve damage suffered.
That makes good sense, but he does have another operation coming up to remove bone spurs that have formed in his neck.
I think he's due his 18 million come March 7th, I can't see that happening, no matter what. Irsay couldn't call himself a businessman if he paid up. I do see Peyton being stubborn enough to set up shop in Arizona and fail miserably. Hopefully he'll just see the light and pull the plug.
I'm guessing the Colts wouldn't have any claim to his merchandising after this is all done. I don't think Peyton will have any trouble pulling in 18 million this year doing whatever he chooses, or at least making more than enough to put food on the table.

[JenksAnejo]

That would be priceless. We need more help on the ends than in the middle, but that'd allow things to get shuffled around a bit.

Agreed, Glenn is projected as both guard and tackle. That's why I think Pitt would be such a good fit; however, with that being said I don't see him lasting after Cincinatti's 2nd first round pick.

[JenksAnejo]

Another player I could see Pitt getting is Dontari Poe out of Memphis. 6'5 360 would absolutley solidify their line for the next decade! Hayward, Poe, Hood that would be sick nasty!

Who is the biggest sleeper in this years draft? I say Quention Couples, everyone has been so down on him lately but feel like this dude could be a STUD! Please, please, please, fall to Dallas @ #14!!

[Stephen]

Even if that's all it is, and I give you that, it's a tough spot to fill. That's gotta come from free agency, not the draft.
If the Pack wants to stop that bleeding, there's no 14 million for Flynn, so he's a memory. And if they can wrangle the 8th pick from Miami, can they pay for it ?
I'm not even arguing, just asking. :)
Even if they could pay for it (which admittedly I'm not up to speed on their cap situation), Ted Thompson simply doesn't run his football team that way. His first year he brought in Ryan Pickett and Charles Woodson, and after that, bupkis. It's really not a good year to be chasing a pass rush in free agency; especially for a 3-4 team. Personally, I'm hoping/wishing/praying that Courtney Upshaw falls to the Packers in the first round.:)

[awsmith4]

As a Falcons fan the draft this year will mean nothing until day 2. I like Julio but it sure would have been be nice to draft a top DE to add to our pass rush.

[JenksAnejo]

Get rid of Flynn and sign Mario Williams to a huge deal! :noon

[Stephen]

Get rid of Flynn and sign Mario Williams to a huge deal! :noon
Williams is best suited with his hand on the ground as a 4-3 DE.:2

[shilala]

Agreed, Glenn is projected as both guard and tackle. That's why I think Pitt would be such a good fit; however, with that being said I don't see him lasting after Cincinatti's 2nd first round pick.
We get Willie Colon back next year and a few (untested) kids that got hurt in camp or pre-camp. The Steelers always draft so low that they can't land a premiere Left Guard or Left Tackle, that's a big part of why Ben gets hurt. The D suffered this year, but I think that's age.
We're gonna be in big trouble in the next couple years if we don't solidify some keys spots with prospects.

[shilala]

I just realized that all 3 backup QB's in Pittsburgh are Free agents this year. Oh, to shed Dennis Dixon. What a wonderful birthday present that would be.
I wonder if Vince Young could play ball in Burgh? He's as big as Ben. Maybe he can play a little better without time to think? (long stretch)

[JenksAnejo]

Williams is best suited with his hand on the ground as a 4-3 DE.

I don't disagree with that at all, but if GB can do it why the heck not? The dude has proved he can play as a 3-4 DE, 3-4 OLB and a 4-3 DE

[Stephen]

I don't disagree with that at all, but if GB can do it why the heck not? The dude has proved he can play as a 3-4 DE, 3-4 OLB and a 4-3 DE
I think they could do it but I don't think they will do it. In the end, I think a team that runs a 4-3 is going to throw tons of money his way. Houston with Barwin and Reed (who are young, cheap, and talented) didn't miss Williams all that much, and could really use the cap space on other areas of need.

[Stephen]

From what I'm hearing, talks are heating up between the Browns/Packers for Flynn. That'd be nice if we can wrangle their second round pick out of them and use it on someone like Brandon Thompson.:tu

Nick Perry had a nice showing at the combine. He sure would look nice opposite Clay Matthews.:banger

[Stephen]

Also, according to the ESPN, the Rams have decided to trade the #2 pick. Possible suitors? The aforementioned Browns, Redskins, and Dolphins. Anyone see a surprise team want/need to jump up there and has the gumption to do so? The only other team I could even see realistically attempting it would be Seattle, but with both teams being in the same division I find it highly unlikely. Even looking at teams that might be interested in moving up to nab Kalil, but I just don't see any others.

[JenksAnejo]

I'm ecstatic that the Rams are trading their 2nd overall. I hope they end up trading with Washington, and getting their #6, a 2nd rounder this year, and a first rounder next year. With the #6 overall we could get Justin Blackmon, and in the 2nd round I could see us getting the big LT out of Iowa St. or Peter Konz center from Wisconsin if he is still available.

[Stephen]

I'm ecstatic that the Rams are trading their 2nd overall. I hope they end up trading with Washington, and getting their #6, a 2nd rounder this year, and a first rounder next year. With the #6 overall we could get Justin Blackmon, and in the 2nd round I could see us getting the big LT out of Iowa St. or Peter Konz center from Wisconsin if he is still available.
I know you'll disagree with me, but I'm just not a fan of Blackmon, especially when being considered with a top five pick.:2

[shilala]

From what I'm hearing, talks are heating up between the Browns/Packers for Flynn. That'd be nice if we can wrangle their second round pick out of them and use it on someone like Brandon Thompson.:tu

Nick Perry had a nice showing at the combine. He sure would look nice opposite Clay Matthews.:banger
I'm enjoying all the draft talk that involves Cleveland, and they are probably in the driver's seat for the Rams #2 spot. They have #4, #22, and #37. The things they can do are endless.
I just do not see Mike Holmgren giving up on Colt McCoy, period. He's conservative and he's in what, his second year at Cleveland?
They have 3 guys on offense, maybe 4 that could start on another team in the NFL. To dig into those excellent draft positions, start throwing them away, and abandoning the potential draft of a lifetime for a QB like RG3 who hasn't even played in a pro-style offense would be nuts.
Don't get me wrong, I think RG3 is awesome, but he's not a fit for Holmgren's conservatism and he completely dulls the edge they have in this draft.
I really think he stays with McCoy, and maybe even trades off that 4 spot for some sweet meat a little deeper in the draft (or in free agency) if he can gain advantage. He takes a lot of pride in finding raw talent and making a team work, we'll see.

[Blak Smyth]

I just hope the Redskins find some way to land a solid young QB to build around. I am sick of being a place retired QBs come to die!

[Stephen]

I'm enjoying all the draft talk that involves Cleveland, and they are probably in the driver's seat for the Rams #2 spot. They have #4, #22, and #37. The things they can do are endless.
I just do not see Mike Holmgren giving up on Colt McCoy, period. He's conservative and he's in what, his second year at Cleveland?
They have 3 guys on offense, maybe 4 that could start on another team in the NFL. To dig into those excellent draft positions, start throwing them away, and abandoning the potential draft of a lifetime for a QB like RG3 who hasn't even played in a pro-style offense would be nuts.
Don't get me wrong, I think RG3 is awesome, but he's not a fit for Holmgren's conservatism and he completely dulls the edge they have in this draft.
I really think he stays with McCoy, and maybe even trades off that 4 spot for some sweet meat a little deeper in the draft (or in free agency) if he can gain advantage. He takes a lot of pride in finding raw talent and making a team work, we'll see.
And, IMO, Colt McCoy isn't one of them. I think he'd make a decent backup, but when I see Colt I just don't see a starting NFL quarterback. Now, get on the horn with those Cleveland fellas and tell them to go ahead and send that second round pick on up to Green Bay. We'll send Flynn in return. Hell, we'll even throw some cheese curds in for good measure.

[JenksAnejo]

I know you'll disagree with me, but I'm just not a fan of Blackmon, especially when being considered with a top five pick.

Just wondering what you don't like about him? Not arguing or anything, I don't think he's a top 5 pick either. That's why I hope the Rams slide back and draft him at #6 or #8. I see Blackmon running a 4.6 and being a very good possesion receiver in the NFL.

[Stephen]

Just wondering what you don't like about him? Not arguing or anything, I don't think he's a top 5 pick either. That's why I hope the Rams slide back and draft him at #6 or #8. I see Blackmon running a 4.6 and being a very good possesion receiver in the NFL.
I guess part of it stems from the fact that he's being projected as a top five pick. Personally, I think his absolute ceiling is Reggie Wayne. While there's nothing necessarily wrong with Reggie Wayne, you don't spend a top five pick on that, either. He doesn't have near the size/speed/playmaking ability of those who have been taken that high (Andre Johnson/Larry Fitzgerald/Calvin Johnson come to mind) in the past. He's nowhere near that. He's not as big nor as fast as previously thought, which might help quell the top five chatter. To his credit he is a solid route runner and does have solid hands.

Again, all just my personal observation and opinion.

[Wanger]

I just hope the Redskins find some way to land a solid young QB to build around. I am sick of being a place retired QBs come to die!

I thought that was here in MN. :confused:

The Vikes have some big needs. Mostly at WR and DB. Seems that a lot of people are high on Kalil for their spot. If they do that, then I'd hope for them to be a player in the FA market for the other needs that they have. Maybe they trade down and get someone like a Claiborne or Blackmon (I know that some aren't a fan of his, but he fits a need that they have).

[OLS]

I think it's way past time to get this thing started.

I'm in love with Matt Flynn. I have been for a few years now. It's nice to see him on the market, and I'd like to see him in Miami, but there's a lot of lip going on here in Cleveland about him. No respect lip because Cleveland fans are borderline retarded, but they've totally abandoned Colt McCoy, who's a serviceable QB, and they're all hollering for a QB when they have gaping holes to fill elsewhere.D

Matt Flynn is every franchise's dream, a relatilvely unknown, REALLY SMART quarterback that has most
of the skills. He is not a Aaron Rodgers prototype, but he is not far off a Eli Manning proto, minus the
escapablilty factor. He can avoid some rush, but he cannot rise from the dead like Eli. He would make
a great starting QB, but there is a kind of cautionary tale to be learned from Jake Delhomme. Same type QB,
had some dismal years doing time as a backup, was a star as a starter, but all too quickly began to show that
he didn't exactly have it ALL in the bag of tricks. All that said, obviously I love Matt Flynn, he is a LSU
product and a genuine leader of men. Anyone would be lucky to get him. Not sure Cleveland fans would long
be in love with him, though, Colt McCoy might yet be something worth what they paid him. If they banish
McCoy to the bench or the waiver wire, it will be quite a wicked thing. Might not recover.

[Stephen]

I thought that was here in MN. :confused:
No, they just take the Packers castaways...:r
The Vikes have some big needs. Mostly at WR and DB. Seems that a lot of people are high on Kalil for their spot. If they do that, then I'd hope for them to be a player in the FA market for the other needs that they have. Maybe they trade down and get someone like a Claiborne or Blackmon (I know that some aren't a fan of his, but he fits a need that they have).
Matt Kalil is the best OT prospect to come out since Jake Long.:2

[OLS]

I know one thing Scott, Bringing in Mike Wallace would light up Colt McCoy. He is sho nuf the real deal. I would take him
over a high-price on Blackmon. Many would not.

[JenksAnejo]

I wouldn't exactly call 4-5 years for $5 million a year a high price on a WR. Wallace is the real deal but will eventually someone will have to pay him near $10 million a year to sign him long term. We will see how Blackmon does in the NFL; I have doubted him his whole career at OSU and he continued to prove me wrong.

[JenksAnejo]

Matt Kalil is the best OT prospect to come out since Jake Long.

Absolutely, no doubt about it! If the Rams don't trade out of the #2 spot they better draft Kalil. The dude has pro-bowler written all over him!

[OLS]

I am using the word "high-priced" like I did "waiver-wire", not literally. I am only saying that I would take Wallace in
a second over Blackmon, and if the price was equally hard to swallow on both of them, I'd rather have Wallace.

[OLS]

The dude has pro-bowler written all over him!haha, I thought you meant Professional Bowler there for a second.:r

[Stephen]

I know one thing Scott, Bringing in Mike Wallace would light up Colt McCoy. He is sho nuf the real deal. I would take him
over a high-price on Blackmon. Many would not.
Mike Wallace is a burner. Colt McCoy makes Chad Pennington look like John Elway. I don't see the connection...

[JenksAnejo]

I am using the word "high-priced" like I did "waiver-wire", not literally. I am only saying that I would take Wallace in
a second over Blackmon, and if the price was equally hard to swallow on both of them, I'd rather have Wallace.


You and me both brother! Wallace is a stud and can stretch the field. Blackmon reminds me of a slower Terrell Owens.


(Unless he comes out and runs a 4.4 on his pro day which I don't see happening)

[mkarnold1]

Absolutely, no doubt about it! If the Rams don't trade out of the #2 spot they better draft Kalil. The dude has pro-bowler written all over him!

The Vikes need to take this Kalil kid at 3. With a talent like him at left tackle they can move Charlie Johnson to left guard, a position that he's actually very good at, and kill 2 birds with one stone.

[OLS]

The connection Stephen, is that everyone is hollering about McCoy being crap. Maybe if he had Wallace,
he would look like Peyton Manning........duh. :r

[Stephen]

The connection Stephen, is that everyone is hollering about McCoy being crap. Maybe if he had Wallace,
he would look like Peyton Manning........duh. :r
Can't make a silk purse out of a sow's ear, Brad. Wallace's game doesn't play to McCoy's strengths at all.

[JenksAnejo]

Another prospect who bleeds pro-bowl talent is David DeCastro from Stanford. I've never seen two can't miss offensive line prospects like this in the same draft. I have also never seen an offensive guard projected to go in the top 15 before either.

[shilala]

But Wallace's game stretches the field and buys McCoy some time to breath and become an NFL quarterback. That's a long stretch, and I don't think McCoy's arm chases down Wallace, but Ben ain't no Aaron Rodgers, and Wallace made him look like a real quarterback.
I can see where Brad is coming from, at the very least. And I really don't think McCoy will flesh out that bad. He's only had one year in the lights, and not even a full year. I'd certainly take him in front of Seneca Wallace.
He's a good kid, good athlete, and very coachable. If he's working his ass off this offseason, I think he moves up a few rungs and becomes a mid-level qb if he has something to throw to. Wallace would be that, not necessarily the target, but he'd get Little, Massaquoi and Cribbs open.
I think, if Massaquoi wanted to play over the middle and had the gumption or balls to do it, he'd excel. The last few years he's just been a turd in the punch bowl. I think Wallace would change that, or at least have some impact.

[shilala]

If only Kalil could possibly end up in Burgh. He's instant 10 years of pro-bowl. If he's still around at #4, he'd be huge for Cleveland. Add him to the Wallace argument and things are looking way up.

I think the best we can do is Cordy Glenn. I don't even know where we draft, I haven't looked. I don't start getting frustrated with my Steelers till camp. I think I'll keep it that way. :)

[Stephen]

But Wallace's game stretches the field and buys McCoy some time to breath and become an NFL quarterback. That's a long stretch, and I don't think McCoy's arm chases down Wallace, but Ben ain't no Aaron Rodgers, and Wallace made him look like a real quarterback.
I can see where Brad is coming from, at the very least. And I really don't think McCoy will flesh out that bad. He's only had one year in the lights, and not even a full year. I'd certainly take him in front of Seneca Wallace.
He's a good kid, good athlete, and very coachable. If he's working his ass off this offseason, I think he moves up a few rungs and becomes a mid-level qb if he has something to throw to. Wallace would be that, not necessarily the target, but he'd get Little, Massaquoi and Cribbs open.
I think, if Massaquoi wanted to play over the middle and had the gumption or balls to do it, he'd excel. The last few years he's just been a turd in the punch bowl. I think Wallace would change that, or at least have some impact.
There's never been a question about Roethlisberger's arm, which is what I'm talking about. Why would teams have to respect Wallace deep if defenses know that McCoy isn't a threat to get him the ball anyways? He's not a franchise quarterback, and in today's NFL teams simply can't win (consistently) without one. In short, if you don't have one, you best be looking for one.:2

[shilala]

There's never been a question about Roethlisberger's arm, which is what I'm talking about. Why would teams have to respect Wallace deep if defenses know that McCoy isn't a threat to get him the ball anyways? He's not a franchise quarterback, and in today's NFL teams simply can't win (consistently) without one. In short, if you don't have one, you best be looking for one.:2
I'm forced to suffer through a lot of Cleveland football being that I'm in Cleveland and two of the brother-in-laws are fans. Plus it used to be fun to watch them lose.
That said, I think Colt's shortcomings aren't so much physical, they're mental. He's scared to death, and rightfully so. It's tough for any qb to to get splattered relentlessly. It'll ruin a young qb.
The boy can sling the ball. He seldom has opportunity to show that ability because he's backing up all the time, and he's developed that "throw off the front foot while I'm backing up" thing that doesn't work.
He almost never has a receiver open because they don't have a guy fast enough to open the field up. They can't even open up a little 10-yard out move, or a short timing pass because both teams are always playing on a 20 yard field when the Browns have the ball. They simply have no way to stretch the field and cannot get a wr open.
Wallace changes that immediately.

[JenksAnejo]

I think the best we can do is Cordy Glenn. I don't even know where we draft, I haven't looked. I don't start getting frustrated with my Steelers till camp. I think I'll keep it that way.


Perhaps Jonathan Martin will fall to the Steelers. He was once projected to be a top 15 pick until Riley Rieff came along. Cordy Glenn would be huge for the Steelers. He can play tackle or guard; I think the Steelers pick around # 26.

[shilala]

Perhaps Jonathan Martin will fall to the Steelers. He was once projected to be a top 15 pick until Riley Rieff came along. Cordy Glenn would be huge for the Steelers. He can play tackle or guard; I think the Steelers pick around # 26.
It doesn't look like they can get Glenn, he's expected to go around 23rd. Unless, of course, they get something for Wallace. But last I heard they intend to keep Wallace and Ben even restructured his contract so they could do so.
Which makes all this Wallace talk moot, but it's fun. :)

[JenksAnejo]

Yeah, Cincinatti will snag him with one of their picks. :)

[Stephen]

I'm forced to suffer through a lot of Cleveland football being that I'm in Cleveland and two of the brother-in-laws are fans. Plus it used to be fun to watch them lose.
That said, I think Colt's shortcomings aren't so much physical, they're mental. He's scared to death, and rightfully so. It's tough for any qb to to get splattered relentlessly. It'll ruin a young qb.
The boy can sling the ball. He seldom has opportunity to show that ability because he's backing up all the time, and he's developed that "throw off the front foot while I'm backing up" thing that doesn't work.
He almost never has a receiver open because they don't have a guy fast enough to open the field up. They can't even open up a little 10-yard out move, or a short timing pass because both teams are always playing on a 20 yard field when the Browns have the ball. They simply have no way to stretch the field and cannot get a wr open.
Wallace changes that immediately.
Eh, I watched him for four years at Texas. In the end, he compounded a lot of stats in a league that's forgotten how to play defense.

The Browns aren't giving him a lot to work with, to be sure, but getting a deep threat doesn't change the fact that McCoy has a noodle for an arm that defenses aren't going to have to respect.

[JenksAnejo]

I have to agree with Stephen. Colt McCoy is not an NFL QB; I was shocked when he was drafted in the 2nd/3rd round. The Big XII's defense are weak as hell in a leauge full of teams that only run the spread.

[Stephen]

I have to agree with Stephen. Colt McCoy is not an NFL QB; I was shocked when he was drafted in the 2nd/3rd round. The Big XII's defense are weak as hell in a leauge full of teams that only run the spread.
Went in the bottom of the third of the 2010 draft. Which makes me wonder; how many quarterbacks were three/four year starters at major college programs and were drafted as low as McCoy went on to have any kind of success in the NFL. Joe Montana and...?

[JenksAnejo]

..I can't think of any

[smitty81]

I'm excited to see where Nebraska's Lavante David ends up and when he will be picked.

[Stephen]

My favorite part of the NFL combine weekend by far. (http://www.nfl.com/videos/nfl-combine/09000d5d82745c18/Eisen-versus-the-rest-of-the-field)

[Stephen]

I'm excited to see where Nebraska's Lavante David ends up and when he will be picked.
Has a chance to be picked in the second, but I see him going at earliest in the third.

[JenksAnejo]

Stephen what did you think of Dontari Poe? That guy is a beast!

[Stephen]

Stephen what did you think of Dontari Poe? That guy is a beast!
A guy that big shouldn't be able to move like that. It simply isn't fair. He's raw though (from watching him on film) and needs to be coached up. That being said, I don't think he falls out of the top 15, but definitely a boom or bust player. Personally, I think the perfect landing spot would be with the Chiefs, who have the 11th pick, although I could see him going as high as six to Washington (unlikely) or eight to Carolina (entirely possible).

[shilala]

He definately shot up the draft order with his showing at the combine. He'd be an amazing fit for the Steelers, but the odds of him lasting till 24 are slim to none at this point.

[Stephen]

He definately shot up the draft order with his showing at the combine. He'd be an amazing fit for the Steelers, but the odds of him lasting till 24 are slim to none at this point.
Scott, any truth to the rumor that the Steelers are going to cut ties with Hampton and slide Ziggy Hood inside? If true, that could allow the Steelers to draft a five-technique guy like Fletcher Cox or Devon Still (if he's still around). If DeCastro happens to fall in your laps, you guys have to take him, right?

[shilala]

They're looking for Casey's heir apparent, Stephen. Poe was going to be that guy before the combine happened.
I think Hampton has one year left on his 3 year deal that included a lot of guaranteed money. At the end of that deal he'll have been around for 12 years. That's probably a little long in the tooth, no? I'm not sure what the life expectancy is for a nose tackle, but that seems about right.

[Stephen]

They're looking for Casey's heir apparent, Stephen. Poe was going to be that guy before the combine happened.
I think Hampton has one year left on his 3 year deal that included a lot of guaranteed money. At the end of that deal he'll have been around for 12 years. That's probably a little long in the tooth, no? I'm not sure what the life expectancy is for a nose tackle, but that seems about right.
He's also coming off a third acl surgery, no? Not to mention his backup Chris Hoke retired. That Steel Curtain looks to have a lot of rust on it...

[Stephen]

Talking about the lack of defense yesterday in the Big XII and Casey Hampton today, it reminded me of those Longhorns teams back in the late 90's early 2000's that had both Shaun Rogers and Casey Hampton as their starting DT's.

[shilala]

He's also coming off a third acl surgery, no? Not to mention his backup Chris Hoke retired. That Steel Curtain looks to have a lot of rust on it...
Yup. And Aaron Smith will likely retire. He needs neck surgery and the docs told him one hit in the right spot and he'll be coming off the field on a board and be peeing in a bag for the rest of his days.
Evidently that diagnosis has eased, because I haven't heard anything about his retirement.
The Steel Curtain is definately rusty. Despite their ranking last year, their numbers were way off from the year before. We're used to fielding a suffocating D and a marginal offense. That has always worked. With this new crap where we don't need a halfback and we want to sling the ball and make people go "Whee!!!", I really don't have any idea what kind of identity Pittsburgh is looking for.
You can't do it all under the cap.
If we're planning to have no o-line like we have for years, and no substantial D, I guess we'll just settle for Ben throwing to Wallace twice a game so we can go "Wheeee!!!"
I really have no idea what they're doing, my friend. If you can figure it out, you need to tune me in. They're driving me nuts.
If Hines Ward isn't back this year, and Heath Miller for some reason no longer shows up, I really don't have much left to root for.

I should mention that Casey may or may not be ready for camp. He may start the season on the PUP.

[JenksAnejo]

If DeCastro happens to fall in your laps, you guys have to take him, right?


I could never see this happening. I know it's a what if scenario; however, there are so many teams that need interior lineman help and DeCastro is the best guard prospect we've seen in the last decade.

[Stephen]

I could never see this happening. I know it's a what if scenario; however, there are so many teams that need interior lineman help and DeCastro is the best guard prospect we've seen in the last decade.
Eh, there's been lots of guards who were held in similar regard, and were even thought more of because of their potential to play multiple positions along the line (Mike Iupati/Branden Albert/Mike Pouncey immediately comes to mind). DeCastro doesn't offer that; what you see is what you get (albeit a talented guard). So even if DeCastro is a better player, because he plays a position that frankly is about the least important position on the team, he's not going to be drafted relative to his (perceived) talent. Does that make any sense?

*edit* And I'm not saying that DeCastro will assuredly fall to the Steelers. I will say, though, that's he much more likely to fall to the Steelers than he is to get drafted in the top 15.

[JenksAnejo]

It's not just me who thinks this kid is special. Also where did you see that DeCastro is only stuck in one position?

8. Miami Dolphins - David DeCastro, G, Stanford - Positional value aside, DeCastro has the highest floor in the 2012 NFL draft. Historically, we have seen a few guards go in the top 10, and they're trending upwards as a position group which makes this a reality

If you've been following the NFL Draft beat, you're pretty aware of the impressive skills of one David DeCastro.

I know that Bleacher Report's team down at the NFL Combine right now are loving what they see from the Stanford product, with Andrew Kulha recently tweeting about how fundamentally sound DeCastro is.

The great thing about this guy is he can play guard or center, which gives the Cowboys options as to where they want to put what would have to be their first round pick.
[

David DeCastro is, in my estimation, the best offensive lineman in this draft class. I firmly believe that.

I think that Matt Kalil shows some spectacular potential and elite characteristics, but the bottom line is that he showed weakness on his inside shoulder and got beat too often to stack up with DeCastro.

David is also a better performer at his position than Riley Reiff was at his position. His combine performance is what I would call sneaky good, not unlike John Moffitt's performance a year ago. DeCastro showed what he needed to show, which is an exception combination of brutal strength, and the ability to move well on his feet.

These were just a couple of the first mock drafts that I pulled up. Each one had him going in the top 11.

[Stephen]

It's not just me who thinks this kid is special.
Not saying that he isn't a good guard project. But being the best guard project is akin to being the tallest midget. In other words, elite offensive lineman aren't wasted (relatively speaking) at guard. I went looking, and the last guard to get drafted in the top ten was Chris Naeole back in 1997. I don't know much about the two guys drafted in the top ten in 1986 to comment (Brian Jozwiak/John Rienstra). Also where did you see that DeCastro is only stuck in one position?
Because he doesn't have the feet/hips to play outside. Woe unto the quarterback whose team drafts this guy and tries to make him a tackle.


Not intending to be mean-spirited, just passing along some of the things I've learned over the years watching/playing/coaching football. Hey, to show there's no hard feelings, if DeCastro does end up getting picked in the top ten, I'll send you a nice fiver to celebrate.:)

[JenksAnejo]

Oh no man, no hard feelings at all! Just discussing some football is all! I hope you didn't think anything I said was mean spirited.

We will differ on our opinions on a lot of things, but that's ok it makes things more interesting to talk about.

No need to send a fiver brother! :)

[JenksAnejo]

Come to think of it you and shilala both will be sending me a 5-pack at the end of baseball season. :r

[shilala]

I looked around a bit, and there's a lot of hack talk about the Steelers picking up a Tight End at 24. Specifically, Cody Fleener.
It never occurred to me that we could use a tight end to work with Heath, but that'd be a huge move, offensively.

I do know that we have kids from last year that should be ready to go this year on the o-line. There were a number of season-ending injuries at camp. I have no idea what the Steelers have in the bag defense-wise, maybe they think they're solid enough to play shootout ball now?
Once again, it's a lot of guessing. I have no earthly idea what they're doing or what direction they're heading. They're been heading towards an all-pass offense with Ariens, so they hire a coach who likes to run. Mendenhall is broke down, Moore in an unrestricted free agent as is another one of our rb's (I forget which). That leaves us John Clay. Who's John Clay? Exactly. :lr
If someone has any clue, I would LOVE to hear what you got. I don't even care if you're clueless, at least if you have an idea, that's somewhere to start. It's more than I have. :D

[Stephen]

Come to think of it you and shilala both will be sending me a 5-pack at the end of baseball season. :r
Scott says he's the man when it comes to fantasy baseball. I haven't played in nearly a decade so I know someone's gonna be having a smoke on me come September.:r

Funny, but I think the key to the entire 2012 NFL draft is Matt Kalil.

[JenksAnejo]

Funny, but I think the key to the entire 2012 NFL draft is Matt Kalil.


I think he is a very big key! I've been saying if the Rams don't trade out of the #2 spot they should definitely draft Kalil. This would allow them to move Roger Saffold over to RT and slide Jaison Smith inside to LG. This improves 3 positions on their OL using one pick; however, I think Washington is going to end up throwing the boat for the #2 overall. I've heard a few scenario's where they are going to give up 1st, 2nd and 3rd picks in this draft as well as 1st and 2nd's next year. That's a deal that you can't pass up!

I haven't played fantasy baseball in a few years but it seems like it will be fun doing it for smokes!

[shilala]

I agree about Kalil, Stephen. QB's are a 50/50 shot. I don't care how good Luck or RG3 are, either can wash out. Of Luck and RG3, I think Robert has the best chance to succeed. He will bust his ass till he dies, he's coachable, and if he fails, it won't be for the lack of giving it everything he has.
Kalil is plug and play, very likely a pro-bowler next year, and barring injury should crank out 10 good, solid pro-bowl seasons.
He could easily go number one in the draft were it not for Indy's dire need of a qb. It wouldn't surprise me at all if he goes second, shocking the entire world. Depends where the Rams send their pick. Minnesota would be in big trouble at that point, but I think they'd pass on RG3, and he may end up in Cleveland, although I still think Cleveland sticlks with McCoy. If RG3 falls in their lap at 4, I could see that changing everything. I know it'd change my mind, even if I'd decided to stick with McCoy. You don't look that gift-horse in the mouth. (Although Minnesota would because they're retarded.)

[shilala]

I think he is a very big key! I've been saying if the Rams don't trade out of the #2 spot they should definitely draft Kalil. This would allow them to move Roger Saffold over to RT and slide Jaison Smith inside to LG. This improves 3 positions on their OL using one pick; however, I think Washington is going to end up throwing the boat for the #2 overall. I've heard a few scenario's where they are going to give up 1st, 2nd and 3rd picks in this draft as well as 1st and 2nd's next year. That's a deal that you can't pass up!

I haven't played fantasy baseball in a few years but it seems like it will be fun doing it for smokes!

The Rams have said they want a marquis WR to show Bradford off. Someone for people to come out and see. If they trade their pick to the Steelers for Wallace (who they're supposed to be keeping), the Steelers would bring Kalil on, I'd think.
Oh, to have RG3 on the bench behind Ben. That'd be sweet. I can dream for a minute, right? :D

[Stephen]

Yeah, I think it all boils down to how much the Rams love Kalil, and weighing that against whatever offers come their way for a team to draft RGIII. If the Rams do trade out, Kalil for sure goes to the Vikings. Either way, the Vikings are in a pretty good spot (they either get Kalil or get a bounty of picks to move down so a team can draft RGIII). I bet the Browns are loving the fact that they beat the Dolphins 17-16 and the Seahawks 6-3 right about now...:r

[Stephen]

The Rams have said they want a marquis WR to show Bradford off. Someone for people to come out and see. If they trade their pick to the Steelers for Wallace (who they're supposed to be keeping), the Steelers would bring Kalil on, I'd think.
Oh, to have RG3 on the bench behind Ben. That'd be sweet. I can dream for a minute, right? :D
Randy Moss to the Rams.;)

[shilala]

OOOOooooo, Randy Moss. Maybe they can bust out TO, too. :D
I'm not sure who the Rams are courting, but that's their plan. I don't think they're thinking a wr from the draft, they need asses in seats and think they're good enough to win with a good wide receiver.
Regardless, if they still suck, they're likely to make some noise or at least put up some big plays.

[Wanger]

Yeah, I think it all boils down to how much the Rams love Kalil, and weighing that against whatever offers come their way for a team to draft RGIII. If the Rams do trade out, Kalil for sure goes to the Vikings. Either way, the Vikings are in a pretty good spot (they either get Kalil or get a bounty of picks to move down so a team can draft RGIII). I bet the Browns are loving the fact that they beat the Dolphins 17-16 and the Seahawks 6-3 right about now...:r

Agreed. No matter what they'll get some of their bigger holes filled. It's tough to feel that LT is as dire of a need as others do, since the holes that they have other places are the size of the Grand Canyon. BUT...I really think that Ponder is going to be a solid QB, one who they have been searching for (in a young QB, not someone ready to be put out to pasture), so Drafting RG3 is not where they would go, IMO. Now if by some act of Dog, Luck falls to them, I would take him and trade Ponder (or keep Ponder as the backup and move Webb to WR). I just haven't watched enough of RG3 to be that high on him (remember that Geno Toretta even won a Heisman, so that award doesn't mean a lot, IMO). And if the best thing to do is to add a potentially elite LT to keep his jersey clean, then they need to do it. As I said before, if that's the case, they definitely need to be a player in the FA scene, as far as WR and DB go. Wallace in Purple? I think he'd make a nice compliment to Harvin. Harvin is a great slot receiver, but having him outside is a waste of his talents, IMO. He's tough over the middle, and will take the punishment. Plus running out of the slot, he's a threat for a handoff when he's in motion. Rudolph (TE) has shown some promise. He seems to have massive hands, and I saw him make several great catches last year. So getting someone on the outside seems to be a spot they really need to address somehow this offseason.

[shilala]

I just saw that the Steelers will NOT franchise Wallace. They can't. They're 2.75 million under the cap right now and the franchise tag would cost them 9.5 million.
It appears we'll be getting someone's #1 draft pick.
Does anyone else smell Wallace for the Ram's #2?

[Stephen]

I just saw that the Steelers will NOT franchise Wallace. They can't. They're 2.75 million under the cap right now and the franchise tag would cost them 9.5 million.
It appears we'll be getting someone's #1 draft pick.
Does anyone else smell Wallace for the Ram's #2?
I saw on ESPN where they were reporting that the Steelers were just going to put a first round tender on him instead of the franchise tag(2.7 million vs. 9.4 million). Honestly, I don't see a team giving him a big contract AND giving up a first round pick, not with the crop of free agent wide receivers that are going to be available. Certainly is possible, though.

[shilala]

I'm a bit lost on a "first round tender".
I understand that the reason his restricted free agency demands a first round pick is because he went in the first round.
I know franchise amounts are set by the CBA, as are tenders.
I just fail to see what the point is in the Steelers offering him a one-year 2.7 million deal? Any other team can beat that by a buck and give up a first round draft pick, right?
Or do the Steelers then have the opportunity to beat that offer, repeating ad nauseum?
Or does the dealing stop as soon as the Steelers beat any and all offers made for Wallace?
I'd think it'd be a better move to NOT offer him a deal, see if others come up with a number, then beat it, since they only have 2.75 million to play with anyways. The hope being that the highest offer for Wallace would be maybe 1.5 million.
I'll leave it at that because I really want to understand the tender offer and I have never been able to get my head around it.

[shilala]

I saw on ESPN where they were reporting that the Steelers were just going to put a first round tender on him instead of the franchise tag(2.7 million vs. 9.4 million). Honestly, I don't see a team giving him a big contract AND giving up a first round pick, not with the crop of free agent wide receivers that are going to be available. Certainly is possible, though.
If someone can tie him up for a 5 year/30 million deal (or something ridiculous) based on the strength of their bargaining position because of that flush pool of wide receivers, it'd totally be worth a draft pick when you're trading it for an established, excellent receiver.
Didn't Jimmy Johnson come up with some sort of draft value scheme that everyone uses, as in what a draft pick's value is dollar-wise?

[Stephen]

I'm a bit lost on a "first round tender".
I understand that the reason his restricted free agency demands a first round pick is because he went in the first round.
I know franchise amounts are set by the CBA, as are tenders.
I just fail to see what the point is in the Steelers offering him a one-year 2.7 million deal? Any other team can beat that by a buck and give up a first round draft pick, right?
Or do the Steelers then have the opportunity to beat that offer, repeating ad nauseum?
Or does the dealing stop as soon as the Steelers beat any and all offers made for Wallace?
I'd think it'd be a better move to NOT offer him a deal, see if others come up with a number, then beat it, since they only have 2.75 million to play with anyways. The hope being that the highest offer for Wallace would be maybe 1.5 million.
I'll leave it at that because I really want to understand the tender offer and I have never been able to get my head around it.
A first round tender has nothing to do with where he was drafted (he was drafted in the 3rd round BTW) but what kind of protection the franchise puts on his rights (there are varying levels of tenders a franchise can use). So in this case, they put a first round tender on him (this year being 2.7 million) and Wallace is free to seek out a deal with any other team. So, let's say the Rams offer and Wallace agrees to a 5/30 deal. The Steelers then get the right to match that offer. If they choose not to, the Rams sign Wallace to the already agreed upon contract and the Steelers get the Rams 1st round pick as compensation. Make sense?

[Stephen]

So Peyton Manning has a $28 million roster bonus due next week. There's no way that Irsay pays that, right?

[shilala]

Aaron Smith and Hines Ward got chopped yesterday. That leaves 4 million in cap money for Ward, no idea if Aaron was still under contract.
Ward agreed to play for league minimum and the Steelers still wouldn't have him back. They'll suffer for that. No one on that wide receiver core can block, cheat, or take a hit like Hines.
I'd have much rather seen Wallace go and Ward stay. Bastids. I'm about one inch from becoming a Tampa Bay fan.

[shilala]

A first round tender has nothing to do with where he was drafted (he was drafted in the 3rd round BTW) but what kind of protection the franchise puts on his rights (there are varying levels of tenders a franchise can use). So in this case, they put a first round tender on him (this year being 2.7 million) and Wallace is free to seek out a deal with any other team. So, let's say the Rams offer and Wallace agrees to a 5/30 deal. The Steelers then get the right to match that offer. If they choose not to, the Rams sign Wallace to the already agreed upon contract and the Steelers get the Rams 1st round pick as compensation. Make sense?
Yup, perfect sense.
But now it begs the question as to why, as a restricted free agent, Ward commands a first round pick if someone picks him up?
Or am I just mixing up the tender offer with restricted free agent rules?

[shilala]

So Peyton Manning has a $28 million roster bonus due next week. There's no way that Irsay pays that, right?
I can't see it.
I can't see Peyton playing next year, either, in common-sense land. Equally, I'm also afraid he's too much of a gamer a la Farve and he'll play until he gets knocked right out of his shoes.
After the talk here and reading up a bit, I can't see Peyton passing a physical and being picked up. I think he's too hurt to catch on with a team right now. If he's released, and I have to think he will be, he may get picked up right around camp time.
In a perfect world, I'd like to see him stay in Indy in some sort of coaching capacity. I think him and Irsay are on the same page and truly love each other and are good friends. If that can work, I think it happens.
Last year Peyton rewrote his contract to protect the club from his failing health. He didn't want the organization to pay him for what they didn't get. The fact that Irsay wrote the last $8 million check is testament to what those two have going. I think they both knew, in the back of their heads, that was severance pay.

[Stephen]

Yup, perfect sense.
But now it begs the question as to why, as a restricted free agent, Ward commands a first round pick if someone picks him up?
Or am I just mixing up the tender offer with restricted free agent rules?
Hines Ward was under contract and the Steelers released him. Mike Wallace is a RFA, which means that although Wallace can shop around, the Steelers still own his rights. It's been awhile, but I believe this (RFA) applies to every player after they've completed three years of service that wasn't drafted in the first round. By all means, if this is incorrect, someone come straighten us out.:r

[Stephen]

I can't see it.
I can't see Peyton playing next year, either, in common-sense land. Equally, I'm also afraid he's too much of a gamer a la Farve and he'll play until he gets knocked right out of his shoes.
After the talk here and reading up a bit, I can't see Peyton passing a physical and being picked up. I think he's too hurt to catch on with a team right now. If he's released, and I have to think he will be, he may get picked up right around camp time.
In a perfect world, I'd like to see him stay in Indy in some sort of coaching capacity. I think him and Irsay are on the same page and truly love each other and are good friends. If that can work, I think it happens.
Last year Peyton rewrote his contract to protect the club from his failing health. He didn't want the organization to pay him for what they didn't get. The fact that Irsay wrote the last $8 million check is testament to what those two have going. I think they both knew, in the back of their heads, that was severance pay.
Yeah, to me it said a lot that the club paid him all his monies AND didn't put him on the IR. That was a gracious move on their part that got buried in the news behind what kind of toilet paper Tebow uses to wipe his arse with.

[shilala]

Hines Ward was under contract and the Steelers released him. Mike Wallace is a RFA, which means that although Wallace can shop around, the Steelers still own his rights. It's been awhile, but I believe this (RFA) applies to every player after they've completed three years of service that wasn't drafted in the first round. By all means, if this is incorrect, someone come straighten us out.:r
I meant Wallace, duh.
The snot medicine has taken me to outer space. :)
I read the restricted free agent rules the other day, if I'd have thought for one minute before typing, I'd have already known the answer.
I actually pulled the rules up because the guys on the radio show I was listening to didn't know the answer, either.

[shilala]

Yeah, to me it said a lot that the club paid him all his monies AND didn't put him on the IR. That was a gracious move on their part that got buried in the news behind what kind of toilet paper Tebow uses to wipe his arse with.
Right. If they put him on the PUP, they don't have to pay him the 8 million. That speaks volumes. It's why I don't really imagine any friction or hidden agenda between Irsay and Manning.
The only thing I can see between the two is Irsay saying "Peyton, you're done. For the love of all that is Holy, please stop before you have no body left to enjoy your millions."
And Peyton is saying "I gotta play. My kid brother has two rings, I have one. I need at least two to get to the HOF, etc..."
Isn't it nuts that Eli has two rings to Peyton's one? I mean, really? No one on earth even puts Eli close to Peyton so far as QB talent goes. I think it's because Eli is coachable while Peyton isn't, so much. Peyton puts the whole team on his shoulders and carries that weight around. Eli just plays ball. He's okay with sucking. Peyton is not.
They sure are two different players. That extra ring really puts Eli on an even keel with Peyton at the family dinner table, for sure. :)

[shilala]

And that was you and me discussing what kind of bumwad I wipe my ass with. :lr

[Stephen]

Right. If they put him on the PUP, they don't have to pay him the 8 million. That speaks volumes. It's why I don't really imagine any friction or hidden agenda between Irsay and Manning.
The only thing I can see between the two is Irsay saying "Peyton, you're done. For the love of all that is Holy, please stop before you have no body left to enjoy your millions."
And Peyton is saying "I gotta play. My kid brother has two rings, I have one. I need at least two to get to the HOF, etc..."
Isn't it nuts that Eli has two rings to Peyton's one? I mean, really? No one on earth even puts Eli close to Peyton so far as QB talent goes. I think it's because Eli is coachable while Peyton isn't, so much. Peyton puts the whole team on his shoulders and carries that weight around. Eli just plays ball. He's okay with sucking. Peyton is not.
They sure are two different players. That extra ring really puts Eli on an even keel with Peyton at the family dinner table, for sure. :)
Well that, and those Giants teams are light years more talented than anything Peyton's ever stepped onto a field with.

[JenksAnejo]

Well that, and those Giants teams are light years more talented than anything Peyton's ever stepped onto a field with.

This! The D-line from the Giants has been unbelievable during their last 2 super bowl runs.

[shilala]

Ward, Farrior and Cooke are gone now. I wouldn't be surprised if Hampton is next. The Steelers are cleaning house, much like they do every couple years.
They've historically erred on the side of caution, getting rid of players a year early rather than a year too late. I'm still disgusted about Ward being gone, but from a business angle that's clearly the right move.

[Stephen]

Kiper & McShay released their post-combine mock drafts this afternoon. McShay's looks ok; Kiper's is a train wreck...:2

[shilala]

I honestly don't even know the draft date. Is it the 17th?

[Stephen]

I honestly don't even know the draft date. Is it the 17th?
April 26-28, 2012.:banger

[Stephen]

I honestly don't even know the draft date. Is it the 17th?
Also, in case you were wondering, both Kiper and McShay had the Steelers taking Dont'a Hightower, ILB from Alabama.:tu

[shilala]

It looks like we're gonna need an inside linebacker. It's believable. And not at all out of order the way Steelers do things. That could definately end up happening.

[Stephen]

It looks like we're gonna need an inside linebacker. It's believable. And not at all out of order the way Steelers do things. That could definately end up happening.
He'd look great alongside Timmons. Hightower is a thumper.:tu

[JenksAnejo]

Wow Blackmon killed it at the Pro-day.. 4.41 40 time

[Stephen]

So the Rams traded the #2 pick in this year's draft to the Redskins for:

1st round pick in 2012 (#6 overall)
1st round pick in 2013
1st round pick in 2014
2nd round pick in 2012 (#39 overall)

So I guess my question is...Did Al Davis' ghost broker this deal at the behest of the Redskins organization? The Rams didn't fleece the Redskins; they threw them in the chipper shredder.

With that said, I could definitely see the Browns raining on the Rams parade by drafting Blackmon with the #4 overall. If that were to happen, the Rams should do the smart thing and draft Trent Richardson. He's one of the four elite prospects in this draft (along with Luck/RGIII/Kalil) but in today's NFL RB isn't near a premium position it once was.

[shilala]

The Skins are hopeless. Until Dan Snyder strokes out, that team is doomed. He's the epitome of a hands-on owner that has no clue of how to build a ball team, but that really doesn't matter when you're the highest grossing team in the league. (Or are they 2nd now?)
I think this whole draft-guessing thing is more or less suspended until we see what Peyton does. He's likely to wrap up a team in the next week or so. Even though he went to see Elway, I can't see him playing there. Heck is, they definately have the parts, and if Peyton and Reggie Wayne show up, Denver is a threat. Maybe not a deep playoff threat, but by the end of next season I think Peyton can have them ready for a deep run with a minimum of shoring up player-wise. Elway is a winner and Peyton has to have huge respect for that, even though it's a cold-weather team and his numbers are hideous in the cold. All in all, Denver doesn't make sense.
Miami wants him in the worst kind of way, but AZ is a very valid option, too.
Who do you think is more poised to go to the show with Peyton and Wayne, AZ or Miami? I'd go with Miami. I've contended they're a QB away for the last 3 years, although AZ would do whatever it takes.
Which offense is more suited to Manning/Wayne?
(I'm pressing the Manning/Wayne issue because it's widely held that wherever Peyton goes, he's taking Reggie. So let's go with that scenario for now till we see what shakes out.)
I'd love to see Peyton in Miami, by the way. I think Flynn makes them a threat for years, but they want to sell tickets now because they're bleeding from the throat.

[Stephen]

Who do you think is more poised to go to the show with Peyton and Wayne, AZ or Miami?
If you're asking which team is more likely to go to the playoffs with Manning (assuming he's anywhere near the Manning of old of course) & Wayne, that's easy. Arizona. The Cardinals are much more likely to win the NFC West than the Dolphins are the AFC East.:2

[JenksAnejo]

I would hate to see the Rams draft Richardson with #6. They have way too many other needs than a RB. I could see them getting Brockers or some other help on defense if Blackmon gets drafted.

I'm really excited about the potential of the extra first rounders in '13 and '14 they both have potential to be top 5; the picks could possibly be top 10 or even higher depending on how RG 3 does.

[Stephen]

I would hate to see the Rams draft Richardson with #6. They have way too many other needs than a RB. I could see them getting Brockers or some other help on defense if Blackmon gets drafted.
While they might have bigger needs, it shouldn't be at the expense of drafting a lesser player (especially picking in the top ten). Jeff Fisher runs the piss out of the ball, and I just don't see Jackson holding up to the pounding and having someone like Richardson there will be invaluable in protecting the defense/Bradford. As an aside, I think Brockers is a bust waiting to happen.:2
I'm really excited about the potential of the extra first rounders in '13 and '14 they both have potential to be top 5; the picks could possibly be top 10 or even higher depending on how RG 3 does.
If they're smart, they can parlay that #2 pick that they weren't going to use on RGIII anyways into the foundation of the next half decade. At the very least, this trade gives fans both of the Rams and Redskins something to be excited about.

[shilala]

If you're asking which team is more likely to go to the playoffs with Manning (assuming he's anywhere near the Manning of old of course) & Wayne, that's easy. Arizona. The Cardinals are much more likely to win the NFC West than the Dolphins are the AFC East.:2
I kind of agree.
Do you think Whisenhunt would give Manning the leash he needs? I think it'd be a struggle for him to do it. To go from tight end coach to offensive coordinator to head coach to letting Peyton have full control of the offense, that's a stretch.
On the other hand, I think Philben would be relieved. :lr

[JenksAnejo]

I honestly haven't watched enough film of Brockers to make an informed opinion. I have just seen some projections that have him going high. If blackmon is drafted by Cleveland maybe Claiborne will fall to 6. That's the best case scenario IMO. I think Claiborne is the 3rd best prospect in this class.

[shilala]

If they're smart, they can parlay that #2 pick that they weren't going to use on RGIII anyways into the foundation of the next half decade. At the very least, this trade gives fans both of the Rams and Redskins something to be excited about.
I think the Rams just made the deal of the century.
I'm excited to see RG3 come in and play ball, so much so that I'm gonna have to get Directv this Fall, even though I hate it. I had the Directv experience in the past and had never-ending problems and they were worse than dealing with Verizon (may Verizon burn in hell for eternity). ;)
I have more faith in 3 than Luck, and I have no idea why. It's just a gut feeling, even though I know Luck will work out because the Colts are just way too lucky for him not to work out.
If the Rams are smart, as you suggested, they can really make things happen this year. They could certainly go .500, I'd think. Regardless, their fans are going to get to see a better brand of ball. :tu

[Stephen]

I think the Rams just made the deal of the century.
I'm excited to see RG3 come in and play ball, so much so that I'm gonna have to get Directv this Fall, even though I hate it. I had the Directv experience in the past and had never-ending problems and they were worse than dealing with Verizon (may Verizon burn in hell for eternity). ;)
I have more faith in 3 than Luck, and I have no idea why. It's just a gut feeling, even though I know Luck will work out because the Colts are just way too lucky for him not to work out.
If the Rams are smart, as you suggested, they can really make things happen this year. They could certainly go .500, I'd think. Regardless, their fans are going to get to see a better brand of ball. :tu
I have to admit, and it's based on nothing more than conjecture, but I think RGIII running Shanahan's offense will be a force. Elway and Plummer were deadly with those bootlegs; can you imagine someone with RGIII's ability running them?

[Stephen]

I honestly haven't watched enough film of Brockers to make an informed opinion. I have just seen some projections that have him going high.
He's incredibly raw (just a RSS) and the team that drafts him is going to have to be patient.
If blackmon is drafted by Cleveland maybe Claiborne will fall to 6. That's the best case scenario IMO. I think Claiborne is the 3rd best prospect in this class.
Better than one of Luck/RGIII/Kalil? You're the first person I've heard say that.

The draft could easily fall Luck/RGIII/Kalil/Blackmon/Claiborne. Who do the Rams take then? Personally, I think there's a significant dropoff after the top six guys.

[JenksAnejo]

The one game I watched Griffin live he was terrible. Baylor didn't score till late in the 4th quarter against a pretty average OSU defense. I like Luck #1 Kalil #2 Claiborne #3. Hell I could be wrong about RG3; however, I just don't think he is the 2nd best prospect in the draft. He is a tremendous athlete but QB is the hardest position in sports to play.

I was wrong about Newton last year and I'll be wrong again sooner than later.

[shilala]

I have to admit, and it's based on nothing more than conjecture, but I think RGIII running Shanahan's offense will be a force. Elway and Plummer were deadly with those bootlegs; can you imagine someone with RGIII's ability running them?
I sure can. So much so that I'm willing to suffer through Directv. I want to see this kid develop. I feel robbed that I didn't get to see Cam Newton this year.
I told Weeze we can go into a football coma if we get Directv and she was all aboard immediately. She was just kinda pissed that I put up the HD antenna and went through all that crap and spent all that money for nothing. Fortunately I can still use it somewhere in the house. I just need to fix it.

[Blak Smyth]

RG3? Once again I am an excited Redskins fan, usually followed shortly by disappointment.
I have high hopes, but don't watch college ball to have an opinion other than what I am told about this kid.

[Stephen]

The one game I watched Griffin live he was terrible. Baylor didn't score till late in the 4th quarter against a pretty average OSU defense. I like Luck #1 Kalil #2 Claiborne #3. Hell I could be wrong about RG3; however, I just don't think he is the 2nd best prospect in the draft. He is a tremendous athlete but QB is the hardest position in sports to play.
And that's fair. For some reason OK St. had his number both seasons (both played in Stillwater).
I was wrong about Newton last year and I'll be wrong again sooner than later.
Nobody thought he'd be able to do what he did last year. I'll be the first to stand in line and take my helping of crow on Newton. I didn't think he'd amount to much; there were just so many things working against him.

[shilala]

There was talk yesterday that Washington's trade for RG3 will be disallowed as part of Dan Snyder's punishment for taking advantage of the no-cap period when the CBA expired.
As it goes, Snyder was warned repeatedly to quit being a dick and he chose to do whatever he wanted. Now he's gonna pay the piper.
I'm excited to see how this story develops. It'll have to develop quickly with the draft coming, but as of yet, no official punishment has been levied that I'm aware of. I've been out of the loop for a couple days, so I'll have to check up on it.

[shilala]

Holmgren got on the radio last night and said "it wouldn't be fair to Colt, he's our boy, etc.".
He finally iced the cake on what I've been saying all along, no qb for the Browns. They did make an overture, but let that die on the vine. They let the Skins close the draft spot trade deal without even talking to the Rams about the proposal they sent, or trying to counter. It must have been a really crappy offer is all I can figure.
If this Snyder trade is disallowed (based on no cap room, as in they are currently over max), maybe Holmgren eats his words and tries again?
Maybe Snyder can sue the Skins fans again and try to get some cap room?
This is such a wonderful soap opera. :D

[smitty81]

Whos watching?

[Blak Smyth]

Whos watching?

I have been but it's gonna be kinda boring now that the 2nd pick is over. Haha

[OLS]

What is??? Is there something going on tonight???

[JenksAnejo]

GO RAMS!!! I'm pumped about the trade! I'm praying Michael Floyd falls to 14.

[smitty81]

na, I'll keep watching to see if Nebraska's Lavante David can make the first round. So far the mock draft has been way off.

Also gotta watch to see the Chiefs and Lions picks since my Raiders pissed their picks away.

[smitty81]

GO RAMS!!! I'm pumped about the trade! I'm praying Michael Floyd falls to 14.

Rams will pick Michael Brockers.

[smitty81]

Brandon Weeden to the Browns...............didn't see that one coming.

[Bleez]

Pumped about the Jags getting Blackmon!!!

[smitty81]

Pumped about the Jags getting Blackmon!!!

I like Blackmon, He reminds me of Randy Moss in ways.

[Bleez]

I like Blackmon, He reminds me of Randy Moss in ways.

If he plays like the Real Randy Moss thatll be great. As long as he shows more maturity.:2

[Bleez]

Holmgren got on the radio last night and said "it wouldn't be fair to Colt, he's our boy, etc.".
He finally iced the cake on what I've been saying all along, no qb for the Browns. They did make an overture, but let that die on the vine. They let the Skins close the draft spot trade deal without even talking to the Rams about the proposal they sent, or trying to counter. It must have been a really crappy offer is all I can figure.
If this Snyder trade is disallowed (based on no cap room, as in they are currently over max), maybe Holmgren eats his words and tries again?
Maybe Snyder can sue the Skins fans again and try to get some cap room?
This is such a wonderful soap opera. :D

Interesting that they took Weedon. I hope TR3 serves the Browns well.

[shilala]

I never even considered Weeden going to the Browns for about umpteen reasons. I think they really may have done well with him, if only to have a future maybe on the bench.
I can see him playing real soon, it's his job to take. The whole deal just makes the Browns a better team, if only by raising the level of competition.
I was floored and disgusted with the Trent Richardson pick, but Stephen assures me he's the real deal.
I think Miami is happy with Tanehill, and Minnesota has to be ecstatic about Kalil.
I'm looking forward to the Browns getting better so they can become a decent ball club, that way when my Steelers crush them, I can thoroughly enjoy the pain in these Browns fans eyes. That's cruel, isn't it? I'm gonna love it. :D

[Stephen]

There were three (realistic) guys that I wanted for Green Bay. Luckily for me (and the Packers) the final name on the list is who they called at the podium (Nick Perry). As much as it pains me to say, I really liked the move the Cowboys made to nab Claiborne. This offseason they went from having a bad secondary to having a pretty good one (Carr/Claiborne).

[JenksAnejo]

I love the Steelers draft; Adams and DeCastro are both solid OL!

[awsmith4]

After sitting Thursday out, the Falcons at least added 600lbs to the team

[Jasonw560]

Great to see Clairborn and Carr as the CBs now. The Cowboys are shopping Mike Jenkins around now. Maybe Cleveland is in the market. The best part is, the Cowboys only lost a 2nd round pick. Still blew every Cowboys fans' minds. We all thought they were going with Barron.

With RGIII, the verdict is still out. I really don't know how a Shanahan run offense will be for him. He's more of a Cam Newton style QB, amd needs freer rein than that the Shanahans will probably give him.

As for McCoy being serviceable, he's a primadonna. The National Championship game, when he " hurt his sholder"? Please. Daddy didn't want his cash cow hurt, so he took a dive. He sacrificed UT's chances. And I'm not saying that just because I loathe UT with the passion of a million burning red supergiant suns.

[mase]

Anyone know why Bobby Massie is freefalling? He was projected as an early RD 2 pick. Was he caught with dead hookers the night before the draft? Kiper looks like a idiot for having him so high.

[E.J.]

Seattle fans are going to be very happy with Bobby Wagner, trust me....kid is great.

[Jasonw560]

Overall, I'm pretty pleased with Dallas's picks. Filled what needed to be filled. We'll see which ones are boons and which ones are busts come week 1.

Going over all of it, IMO, the biggest sleeper pick is Tannehill to Miami.

What are some of your favorite picks, or real head scratchers?

[E.J.]

I :r at Burfict going undrafted...

Love that Seattle went Utah State squared... Both those guys will make Seahawks fans smile.