My store is opening a lounge but we need some help...

[stj386]

The small shop i work in has recently expanded and we are in the process of making a smoking lounge. The only issue is how to make a profit off having the lounge or at the very least how to break even. We have considered several ideas but many seem to have us stuck in terms of execution. Any ideas would mean the world to me and the guys at my shop!:tu

[Blak Smyth]

What kind of ideas are you looking for?
I know many lounges have a membership fee, like $200/year and members save like 10% off purchases. Also some offer members a locker/storage.
Events are a great way to draw a crowd.
You could sell beverages, coffee is a weapon of choice!

What ideas have you considered so far?

[ysr_racer]

Do not, I repeat DO NOT charge a cover charge.

How will you make money? Buy having customers spend time (and money) in your business. You can't get my money if you can't get me to your shop.

There's a shop with a nice lounge here in So Cal. To use the lounge you have to spend at least $20 or be a member. I never go there.

[Blak Smyth]

Do not, I repeat DO NOT charge a cover charge.

How will you make money? Buy having customers spend time (and money) in your business. You can't get my money if you can't get me to your shop.

There's a shop with a nice lounge here in So Cal. To use the lounge you have to spend at least $20 or be a member. I never go there.

I go to a nice lounge sometimes that has a free lounge for walk-in guests (1 cigar minimum purhcase) and a seperate private lounge for members. Members receive a locker and a discount on all purchases. Also they have private events that only members are invited to.

[sevans105]

Adding coffee is a relatively easy way to add something that has a pretty high profit margin. Obviously, the idea of a lounge is to have as place for guys to hang out and enjoy a cigar or two. During that time, people get hungry and thirsty. Prepackaged snacks, a small fridge with bottled sodas, these are things that guys will want and can greatly impact the bottom line. One shop I know of charges a few bucks a month for a "business membership" Guys bring their laptops down and they have access to a printer, etc. Just a couple ideas.

[grateful1]

The small shop i work in has recently expanded and we are in the process of making a smoking lounge. The only issue is how to make a profit off having the lounge or at the very least how to break even. We have considered several ideas but many seem to have us stuck in terms of execution. Any ideas would mean the world to me and the guys at my shop!:tu

This is bothersome in that they are expanding without knowing how to afford it...(sound familiar)!

Anyhow - run some events with inexpensive treats or wine/booze tastings to get people in the shop and enjoy the lounge.

Aside from that...have great seats with tv's....maybe a coffee /soda area as well.

[ysr_racer]

Free wi-fi too.

You don't need to make a lot off the lounge, it's just a way to get/keep customers in your shop.

I like the "1 cigar minimum purhcase" idea.

[stj386]

I think the idea of the business membership is great!

The only idea i have really is charging a monthly fee to use the room and having that fee go towards store credit.

[grateful1]

I think the idea of the business membership is great!

The only idea i have really is charging a monthly fee to use the room and having that fee go towards store credit.

Not monthly...yearly for lockers.

Personally...charge for the lockers and NOT the lounge.

Also...see about running a poker night for charity (not yours!) or some such thing.

:tu

[mosesbotbol]

There's a ton of stuff you can do to bring profit in

Can you sell liquor, beer, wine, or food? You have to think of add on sales or value added services. Could be anything that you can offer. How about massage tables and time slots? How about poker tournaments?

Without knowing what options are available to you and how much of a budget is available to implement any option; it's hard to give advice.

[proguy747]

Do not charge for a membership. I spend money all the time at the lounge(maxamar). I love to hang out and talk the **** with the guys. Before you know it I am buying several cigars based on others reviews. Amar runs a free lounge and has a ton of repeats. You never feel pressured and are always welcome to bring your own smokes.

You also need to think of the lounge as the real cost to you is the construction of it. You are already paying the rent, electricity, etc.

You would be surprised how many locals would offer there help if you put a sign up asking for help building the lounge. Announce in advance that you plan on this lounge and love insight from your customers.

[Pseudosacred]

I go to a nice lounge sometimes that has a free lounge for walk-in guests (1 cigar minimum purhcase) and a seperate private lounge for members. Members receive a locker and a discount on all purchases. Also they have private events that only members are invited to.

What shops is this?

[CoreyD]

I have been 2 2 lounges. 1 open to public and makes its money off events,cigar purchases and drinks and such. The other has a small i mean small area in its shop to smoke and a comfortable members section with lockers for a price I can't afford to be a member at.

Although I do like the members area when I go with a member I like the open public one better and I actually see more people in it.

[aaron72]

A few ideas that some of the local shops put on:

1. Monday night football during the football season
2. When it's not football season, they do Man Cave Monday where they have a guy movie (action flick) set to play at 7PM
3. On specific days, usually to go along with games or movies they have a food truck (big thing in California) come out and sell food (good food and priced right) to the people there for the event.

Being able to sell alcohol is a big deal, but I know getting the right licensing can be a nightmare.

I also agree not to charge a cover. Going with a 1 cigar purchase minimum is fine.

It's no secret that the clientele is primarily men, so think of events that guys would want to hang out and participate in, poker as was mentioned, darts, sporting events (UFC and such). Lots of ideas out there to be taken advantage of.

[Stephen]

The small shop i work in has recently expanded and we are in the process of making a smoking lounge. The only issue is how to make a profit off having the lounge or at the very least how to break even. We have considered several ideas but many seem to have us stuck in terms of execution. Any ideas would mean the world to me and the guys at my shop!:tu
Install stripper poles.

[ChicagoWhiteSox]

Honestly, you will have to charge a fee for people using the lounge. That is if you don't want to lose money on this expansion. Charge for lockers, rent the lounge out for special events, and offer beverages/food.

[hotreds]

Your question is how to make a profit or break even- well, methinks you'll hafta charge a membership fee. Don't make it too high, and give perks with it: free coffee, 10-15% off purchases, whatnot. Since it's new you might even offer a one-time lifetime membership for $500 or $1000 with 20% off purchases and maybe a real nice member card. Lotsa stuff you could do.

[cjhalbrooks]

I can not understand how you guys didnt think of the STRIPPERS. Strippers or dancers have to pay the owner a cut. Have the boss move out of his office and there you go you have a stripper lounge. THIS IS JUST A JOKE

[ninjavanish]

I think charging for lounge usage is a bad idea.

I've worked at several (highly profitable) cigar stores over the years and none charged for lounge use.

We always rented lockers. And on occasion, the lounge would be reserved for locker members only events. However, if a non locker member wished to attend the event, they could pay a month's equivilant locker fee which would grant them access to the day's event. Typically they would need to RSVP/pay in advance so that beer/pizza/etc could be purchased in sufficient quantity for these member's only events.

The bottom line is... you're selling cigars. Not your lounge. Cigars are where you profit comes from. Not your lounge. Budget the amount of money you spend. Come up with a solid purchasing system that gives you a high level of control and visibility on the outflow and inflow of money and allows you to forecast your sales and profit. Rather than creating new fees for using the new lounge area, consider cutting the bottom line first. Order fewer cigars, less often. Cut SKU's that aren't moving as quickly as you'd like, try to contact some of the companies and see if they will credit you for returning product that hasn't moved in recent months... That last thing you want is a ton of money tied up in stock that sits on your shelves forever. If it hasn't moved in 6 months. Ditch it.

I'd recommend purchasing the services of a CPA if you haven't already.

The primary reason for creating a lounge area is to engage your customers. Show them a high level of customer service, and provide an experience that will keep them coming back to purchase more cigars.

[Blak Smyth]

What shops is this?

Hey maybe we will go there when you are off. They have a great lounge but not an amazing selection, good selection though and great coffee. PM sent!

[Chainsaw13]

Excellent advice Ninja. We happen to have a JR's shop here in the Detroit area. Over the years I've become friends with the manager. Once asking him why the shop didn't expand or move to a larger building and put in a lounge, his philosophy was that it took up floor space for more cigars to sell. Basically if it's something you want to provide to the customer, don't look at it as a money maker.

Also from my personal observations, shops that charge you to use the space don't last long. The few around here that have are now closed up. Others that don't charge seem to be doing just fine, but then they carry the stock people want.

[dwoodward]

Keep in mind this is an extension to your store. If your place is appealing it will bring in more business for your store as well. That's always a plus.

[Islayphile]

Put me in the Do Not Charge for usage of the lounge crowd.

There's no better way to keep a new customer than to sell them a cigar and offer them a place to smoke it right then and there if they wish.

Even if they don't smoke there the first time, they will come back and often with a friend.

Simply make it known that all you ask is that they at least buy 1 cigar from you before using the lounge per visit.

Locker fees, bottle storage etc.. is where any ancillary charges should come in.

[Subvet642]

Personally, I like the stripper idea.

[BHalbrooks]

Free wi-fi too.

You don't need to make a lot off the lounge, it's just a way to get/keep customers in your shop.

I like the "1 cigar minimum purhcase" idea.
Exactly.
Do not, I repeat DO NOT charge a cover charge.

A couple Members have hit the nail on the head. If I were to go to a store that demanded I pay a cover charge, whether it's $200, $500, $1000, they can go **** themselves.
Personally, I like the stripper idea.
:tu

[Bill86]

I think charging for lounge usage is a bad idea.

I've worked at several (highly profitable) cigar stores over the years and none charged for lounge use.

We always rented lockers. And on occasion, the lounge would be reserved for locker members only events. However, if a non locker member wished to attend the event, they could pay a month's equivilant locker fee which would grant them access to the day's event. Typically they would need to RSVP/pay in advance so that beer/pizza/etc could be purchased in sufficient quantity for these member's only events.

The bottom line is... you're selling cigars. Not your lounge. Cigars are where you profit comes from. Not your lounge. Budget the amount of money you spend. Come up with a solid purchasing system that gives you a high level of control and visibility on the outflow and inflow of money and allows you to forecast your sales and profit. Rather than creating new fees for using the new lounge area, consider cutting the bottom line first. Order fewer cigars, less often. Cut SKU's that aren't moving as quickly as you'd like, try to contact some of the companies and see if they will credit you for returning product that hasn't moved in recent months... That last thing you want is a ton of money tied up in stock that sits on your shelves forever. If it hasn't moved in 6 months. Ditch it.

I'd recommend purchasing the services of a CPA if you haven't already.

The primary reason for creating a lounge area is to engage your customers. Show them a high level of customer service, and provide an experience that will keep them coming back to purchase more cigars.

As I was reading through the posts this is exactly what I wanted to say. Ninja hit the nail on the head.

A lounge area is a service to the customers to keep them in your store. You can't charge for a lounge if you want people coming back. You can however sell whatever drinks you are allowed to. Coffee, tea, water, sodas, beer and liquor if you can.

Lockers are a great idea too as mentioned. Charge people a few bucks for bringing in liquor if you can't sell it. Something like $5 or so for a bottle. Locker fees would allow them to avoid this charge. Things like this will gather more customers, their friends, and have them smoking 2-3 cigars each instead of buying a few and leaving. Customers that are regulars will make friends and have another excuse to stop by.

You really just need the space, a few TVs, and a couch. Couple chairs and tables as well. The smoke eaters will be what costs you a bit. Proper air flow as well.

The lounge also gives you additional time to converse with customers, which is where you can educate them and help them with any problems they incur while making sales at the same time. I've sold quite a few lighters and cutters after fixing them for customers. It's always bad butane, another sale by the way, purge the lighter with the mtx scissors toss some Xikar/Vector in it done deal. Customers will frequent your store more often if you have the time to spend with them.

After having the lounge you'll need to create events to bring people in. Regular poker nights with prizes work well. Fantasy football sign ups too. Once you have the lounge you want to always have people there. A dead lounge is a dead shop, people will leave.

FWIW, just my experiences. :2

[tengel78]

I also agree that it would be a bad idea to charge a cover. I personally wouldn't go if I had to pay. But, when I go to my local shop, I always buy something and it's usually more than I planned :).

[emopunker2004]

Free wi-fi too.

You don't need to make a lot off the lounge, it's just a way to get/keep customers in your shop.

I like the "1 cigar minimum purhcase" idea.

Or a $5 cutting fee if you don't buy anything but bring your own.
You planning to serve beer/wine/liquor? Food?

This is my local http://islandgirljax.com/

[ysr_racer]

If you really want to know how to build/run a lounge, buy a ticket to Ft. Lauderdale, drive to Margate, and check out The Smoke Inn. These guys have got it right.

http://www.picturetrail.com/sfx/album/view/23997425

Cover charge? No way I'm paying you money to pay you money.

Like someone said, keep me there long enough and you'll get plenty of my $$$

[BHalbrooks]

:O

[cjhalbrooks]

The Smoke Inn. These guys have got it right.

that is my future man cave

[jcruse64]

Put me in the Do Not Charge for usage of the lounge crowd.

There's no better way to keep a new customer than to sell them a cigar and offer them a place to smoke it right then and there if they wish.

Even if they don't smoke there the first time, they will come back and often with a friend.

I'm with you. I get down to Nashville, TN every few months or so. First store I found to shop in was Uptown's. While I did not make a major purchase on my first visit, I did buy several singles that I can't get in our small town's B&M, and had time to light one up after the sale. I asked if the lounge was free to use, or members-only or by fee, and they said "light up, it's free for ALL cigar smokers". Now when I come to Nashville, I always make it a point to stop in and shop, and usually do not stop with one box. I've also brought my brother in with me, because of their policy. If they had refused me the first time I visited, it would have been the last money I would have spent there, no matter what they carried. My purchases wouldn't make or break them, but multiply me by 5, or 10, or 50, and it adds up over 12 months.

I can definitely understand making visitors pay for any drinks, food, or a cover for special events though. Being generous is one thing, but being unfair to your regular customers is not wise.

Good luck! I love a great lounge.

[cjhalbrooks]

I'm with you. I get down to Nashville, TN every few months or so. First store I found to shop in was Uptown's. While I did not make a major purchase on my first visit, I did buy several singles that I can't get in our small town's B&M, and had time to light one up after the sale. I asked if the lounge was free to use, or members-only or by fee, and they said "light up, it's free for ALL cigar smokers". Now when I come to Nashville, I always make it a point to stop in and shop, and usually do not stop with one box. I've also brought my brother in with me, because of their policy. If they had refused me the first time I visited, it would have been the last money I would have spent there, no matter what they carried. My purchases wouldn't make or break them, but multiply me by 5, or 10, or 50, and it adds up over 12 months.

I can definitely understand making visitors pay for any drinks, food, or a cover for special events though. Being generous is one thing, but being unfair to your regular customers is not wise.

Good luck! I love a great lounge.

i need an addy please

[Bucking W]

Our lounge in Austin is a private lounge except for the retail. Members pay an initiation fee of $1000 then monthly $150. Members have access to the a bar supplied with top shelf labels, locker for cigars and wine, 20% off Cigars. Lockers are located in private walk in humidor. Members are allowed one guest but anymore you pay $50 fee if they want access to bar if not $25. The lounge is very nice and offers private meeting room. Two large screen TV's with all amenities. Sounds expensive but there are approximately 71 members. Keeping it private has brought in a higher end spender and being next to the Capital we have numerous politicians, lobbyist. The owner has some very nice hidden perks as well.

[ninjavanish]

Our lounge in Austin is a private lounge except for the retail. Members pay an initiation fee of $1000 then monthly $150. Members have access to the a bar supplied with top shelf labels, locker for cigars and wine, 20% off Cigars. Lockers are located in private walk in humidor. Members are allowed one guest but anymore you pay $50 fee if they want access to bar if not $25. The lounge is very nice and offers private meeting room. Two large screen TV's with all amenities. Sounds expensive but there are approximately 71 members. Keeping it private has brought in a higher end spender and being next to the Capital we have numerous politicians, lobbyist. The owner has some very nice hidden perks as well.

This is an example of the high-end extreme.

These types of lounges are highly exclusive and very few and far between. There maybe less than 100 cigar lounges of this type nationwide.

Judging from the type of store it sounds like you the OP have... this type of lounge is an absolute no-go for you, the OP until you have an extremely sound financial scenario. Judging from the query you posed as to how to afford a lounge, this is not the route you should pursue. That's not to say that some day you can't get to this level... but there's a hell of a lot of work involved to get you there. Unless of course you are independently wealthy.

[hammondc]

Our lounge in Austin is a private lounge except for the retail. Members pay an initiation fee of $1000 then monthly $150. Members have access to the a bar supplied with top shelf labels, locker for cigars and wine, 20% off Cigars. Lockers are located in private walk in humidor. Members are allowed one guest but anymore you pay $50 fee if they want access to bar if not $25. The lounge is very nice and offers private meeting room. Two large screen TV's with all amenities. Sounds expensive but there are approximately 71 members. Keeping it private has brought in a higher end spender and being next to the Capital we have numerous politicians, lobbyist. The owner has some very nice hidden perks as well.

Damn. I need to come up and be your guest....:D.

Another vote for no charge lounge. There are a few here in SA and onyl one charges. I have never seen many folks in there.

[ysr_racer]

Our lounge in Austin is a private lounge except for the retail. Members pay an initiation fee of $1000 then monthly $150. Members have access to the a bar supplied with top shelf labels, locker for cigars and wine, 20% off Cigars. Lockers are located in private walk in humidor. Members are allowed one guest but anymore you pay $50 fee if they want access to bar if not $25. The lounge is very nice and offers private meeting room. Two large screen TV's with all amenities. Sounds expensive but there are approximately 71 members. Keeping it private has brought in a higher end spender and being next to the Capital we have numerous politicians, lobbyist. The owner has some very nice hidden perks as well.

WOW !! Way out of my league.

[Islayphile]

Whatever route you choose you MUST stay with that decision.

The lounge I frequent started Free, but somewhere along the way the owner was kicking the idea around of starting to charge some sort of fee because of folks taking advantage by not buying any cigars from him and bringing only their own or worse, cigars they purchased from his direct competiton.

I told him it was far better to simply just handle the offenders by barring them further access to his lounge, and since they weren't buying their sticks at his place to begin with, he wouldn't really be losing any customers.

Weigh your options first so that you don't alienate anyone later on.

[hotreds]

I guess it also depends on what you mean by "lounge." Obviously if it's a few chairs in a corner of the shop, that's one thing. If it is a separate entity with chairs, tables, TVs etc, then I think you could charge for that kind of a thing.

[ysr_racer]

Free, but definitely NOT BRING YOUR OWN CIGARS. Do you bring your own food to a restaurant?

Speaking of restaurants, I'm in Chicago for the weekend. There are two delis I like to eat at. One of them has free wifi, guess which one I'm at right now?

[Islayphile]

Free, but definitely NOT BRING YOUR OWN CIGARS. Do you bring your own food to a restaurant?

Speaking of restaurants, I'm in Chicago for the weekend. There are two delis I like to eat at. One of them has free wifi, guess which one I'm at right now?

The owner of my shop doesn't mind if you bring your own every once in a while...

As long as you buy at least one from him before venturing into the lounge.

It has worked out well since if any of us regulars see someone taking advantage we give them a rash of fire and brimstone.

[hotreds]

With your avatar, I think I'd wanna avoid fire and brimstone from you!

[Islayphile]

With your avatar, I think I'd wanna avoid fire and brimstone from you!


:lr



:hn



-(P

[OLS]

This is bothersome in that they are expanding without knowing how to afford it...(sound familiar)!

This was my thought immediately. I was thinking, "Why create a lounge if you don't know how
you will be able to make money from having a lounge". I agree that HAVING it allows you to draw
more customers to the shop, but the large majority of them I believe are already gone over to
the side of having their smokes airlifted to the island and are looking for a place to hang out and
BS with other smokers. So in a way it's a no-win situation, at least IMOO. But when I was young
and full of ideas to make money with, I was going to open a private cigar club.

[awsmith4]

Maybe I am spoiled but I would never pay to smoke in a cigar shop lounge. If it was a bar that is different. The shop next to my office has a small lounge that is maybe 12x16 and he charges non members $20 to smoke there. While its not out of my league I don't go there I just drive another mile or two to a shop that has twice the lounge and its free but he does ask out of courtesy to buy something. I don't expect free beverages but if you are selling cigars and have a lounge it had better be free unless you are offering me something that is special, like a free bar. If you are going to charge for drinks then again that should be your money maker not your cover. If you insist on charging a cover then it should be waved after a purchase is made. If you want a certain atmosphere then enforce a dress code and a purchase minimum but I wouldn't charge a fee on top of a purchase. As many others have said a lounge should be there to promote customer loyalty not as a revenue stream just to have a place to sit.

[Silound]

Are you building a lounge or a club? There is a big difference!

The shop I used to work at was an open room shop, with a walk-in humidor, a lounge area with free coffee, WiFi, and water for the patrons who came in. 2 couches, a couple chairs, a 42" LCD, a table for dominoes and cards, rental lockers, and all that jazz. It was all free for anyone that walked in, and while people abused it frequently, it wasn't bad.

About a year ago, they added a private club lounge with a pool table, dartboard, poker table, another TV with recliners, music system, coke machine, coffee machine, etc etc. This was mostly to get a noisy poker game out of the shop area (bad for business), but also because it was an opportunity to expand the floor space into the adjacent suite that was unoccupied for a cheap price. Membership is $500 a year, or $50 a month, or $10 a day for access, and monthly/yearly members have 24-hr card access. These are separate suites in the building, with a door connecting them, and outside entry to each side.


Charging a membership or day fee for a separate club area is perfectly acceptable, because those are extra amenities, and extra hours, that go above and beyond what a basic shop offers.

Charging just for a place to sit and smoke in the basic shop area is not a great business plan IMO, but some things like local smoking laws, rental agreements, or simple shop space may dictate otherwise.

[mosesbotbol]

Has anyone been to Portmann Tabak private lounge in Switzerland? If you can make it like that; people will pay! Yearly fee and 24 hour access to a very comfortable lounge with beverage service.

[trendo]

Hey sam, I dont know which shop you are from, but if you let me know, I would love to check you out next time I go to oahu.

I know cigars is kind of a hard business in Hawaii, here on maui, we have never really had a successfull B&M. The only guys who seem to last are the ones with outrageous markup, selling to the tourist market.......And even they have other products besides cigars.

My advice would be to go small. Real estate here comes at a huge price. The less money you put into it, the less you will have to get out of it. Sure, we would all like a five star atmosphere to hang out in, but to be honest, I would be more than happy with a small area to sit and bs with friends. Assuming you dont need the space for something else, it really shouldent cost you much to have customers smoke in your store.

Better yet, scrap the whole idea and open one in maui.

[BengalMan]

The small shop i work in has recently expanded and we are in the process of making a smoking lounge. The only issue is how to make a profit off having the lounge or at the very least how to break even. We have considered several ideas but many seem to have us stuck in terms of execution. Any ideas would mean the world to me and the guys at my shop!:tu

What shop Sam? I used to cover Hawaii for Oliva as part of my territory so I'm pretty familiar with the shops out there.

[cigarmonkel]

Start off with a basic lounge, couple nice chairs tables and a TV, throw in a coffee stand or something in there as well. The B&M i frequent in ann arbor lets me smoke my own cigars i bring in as long as i buy cigars from there as well (win win for me! i get to smoke a cigar i bring AND have a reason to buy more!).

You could always do an OPTIONAL lounge membership fee which would include perks, you could have different levels of memberships as well for example:
Level 1: 10% off cigars
Level 2: 10% off cigars, free entry to private events
Level 3: 15% off cigars, free entry to private events, locker space

Put up a small snack stand with some candy and soda and run special promotions for the optional members often. buy X amount of cigars get the cheapest one free or something like that (discount doesn't apply or it could).

[stj386]

The shop is Tobaccos of Hawaii.
The biggest issue I'm worried about is that I remember the last lounge that recently closed on the island. They didn't charge to sit and smoke but their customers didn't buy anything. At times customers would even sell their own cigars in the store.
I know its a bit harsh but it is Hawaii and the weather is almost always nice. We are going to put in some outdoor seating that will be free but we have to charge for the lounge. I mean if we don't charge then its not going to happen at all and people will have to find another place to enjoy their cigars.

Also, I would like to thank every one for responding to this thread. It means a lot to get you input and ideas!

[ninjavanish]

The shop is Tobaccos of Hawaii.
The biggest issue I'm worried about is that I remember the last lounge that recently closed on the island. They didn't charge to sit and smoke but their customers didn't buy anything. At times customers would even sell their own cigars in the store.
I know its a bit harsh but it is Hawaii and the weather is almost always nice. We are going to put in some outdoor seating that will be free but we have to charge for the lounge. I mean if we don't charge then its not going to happen at all and people will have to find another place to enjoy their cigars.

Also, I would like to thank every one for responding to this thread. It means a lot to get you input and ideas!

Ok, that doesn't sound like a problem with not charging for lounge usage. That sounds like a problem with the management/ownership not enforcing some simple rules.

A Customer selling cigars on your premises is a HUGE no-no.

It's your store. Your property. Your livelihood. If you have a customer selling his own cigars on store premises then he needs to be asked to stop. If he refuses, then he needs to be asked to leave. If he refuses, you call the police and have him removed... trust me the law is on your side there.

Secondly, if he is selling any sort of illegal material in your store, you've created a liability that could cost you your tobacco license or even more severe penalties.

Thirdly, it needs to be understood what a customer is. A customer or a patron is someone who contributes to the vitality and profitability of your business, if said person is not doing so (or even detracting from it) then they are not a customer and should be asked to either contribute, if they continuously choose not to, then they must be asked to leave.

[ysr_racer]

Buy a cigar, you get to use the lounge. Don't buy a cigar, you don't get to don't use the lounge.

It's really pretty simple.

[Fia]

Sam..very interesting thread. This topic has been beaten to death here in Hawaii. :bdh Its a fine line between what most have said here about just supporting the store by buying products and making sure it at least breaks even. Note to everyone: the lounge being planned is a separate room connected to their shop with air filtration and not just some chairs in the middle of the store. As mentioned earlier, it is a mgmt decision to enforce the rule of supporting the store and not letting people bring in their own. Which I know in the minimum ToH will do. I dont see you or Justin or Chris having any problem telling people about no outside tobacco.

I dont know if our mainland friends realize how expensive real estate is in hawaii vs other parts of the country. The profit margin remains the same on the cigars here as on the mainland yet Hawaii businesses have WAY more overhead especially when it comes to rent. There is no other lounge in Hawaii to smoke in after south pacific pipes and cigars went out of business. In fact, Tobaccos of Hawaii is one of only 2 stand alone tobacco stores on the island. There are only 4 in the whole state that I know of with Tobaccos of Hawaii being the most successful. Most of the cigar business is from wine and liquor retailers using cigars as additional business. With our high cost of business here in Hawaii and a 50% cigar tax which leads to lots of lost cigar sales to the internet, its easy to understand why there are so few tobacconists left. 15 years ago, there were close to 10 just on Oahu. South Pacific Pipes and Cigars went out of business in part due to some people abusing their lounge and not supporting the business but it was mostly poor mgmt by the owner. That being said Tobaccos of Hawaii has much better business practices.

Another problem is that there is homeless population in the area and they come into their shop, drop a handful of coins on the counter and buy a cheap cigar. I remember one time Justin had to light a cedar spill to get rid of the smell after a homeless guy bought a cheap cigar!:pu I dont know if I would want them hanging out in the lounge.

I have talked to a lot of the regulars on the cigar scene here and they cant wait for the lounge to open. I have mentioned to them the possibility of a fee and they seem to be fine with it. I think they appreciate just having a place to hang out. I would say that the fee should be reasonable. Im sure there is a portion of guys who wouldnt mind paying a modest membership but might not be able to afford or justify to their wives a steeper price! :r The tough part is getting it right on the first try..I dont envy the decision you folks have to make.

There has been some good suggestions about other ways of making the space profitable like offering drinks for sale (which you already have). I think some other things for the lounge that would be nice to have free if there is indeed a membership fee are free coffee, wifi, movies, etc. Might be able to have events in the lounge like pay per view mma, etc.

Also remember having the lounge space will allow you to have events which you currently dont have. I tried to get events going with South Pacific Pipes and Cigars. We did a couple and they made a nice chunk of money in the few hours of their events. The profits from the event could help offset the rent on the lounge. In fact, if you set up a monthly event on the same day the guys could plan around it and you would get even better participation. Also a great way to introduce new lines or cigar releases.

Another thing that needs to be addressed are the tourists. We always have visitors to the islands and there will always be that portion who like to sit down and have a smoke. With your proximity to Waikiki you will see a lot of that.

ToH is good people and I look forward to the new lounge and the great camaraderie that Im sure will follow!:tu

[BengalMan]

The shop is Tobaccos of Hawaii.
The biggest issue I'm worried about is that I remember the last lounge that recently closed on the island. They didn't charge to sit and smoke but their customers didn't buy anything. At times customers would even sell their own cigars in the store.
I know its a bit harsh but it is Hawaii and the weather is almost always nice. We are going to put in some outdoor seating that will be free but we have to charge for the lounge. I mean if we don't charge then its not going to happen at all and people will have to find another place to enjoy their cigars.

Also, I would like to thank every one for responding to this thread. It means a lot to get you input and ideas!

Sam, I have some ideas and things that would help Chris out with this. Too much to type. I shot him an email and will hopefully be able to help him out with this project.

[BengalMan]

I agree Jon, Chris and Justin are both good people that know how to run a successful business. When I was out on Oahu last year visiting accounts, I hung out with both of them for almost the whole day. Chris had mentioned that he eventually wanted to do something like this, glad to see it's finally happening. They are big supporters of the Oliva/Cain/Nub brands and I really hope they get this lounge up and running. With there being so few places to smoke on the island due to the crazy smoking ban, this will be huge for both locals and tourists.

[ysr_racer]

I can't believe somebody would bring their own cigar to a cigar lounge. Do you bring your own eggs and bacon to Denny's?

[cjhalbrooks]

I can't believe somebody would bring their own cigar to a cigar lounge. Do you bring your own eggs and bacon to Denny's?

Okay wait i have done this.. But when i do i make sure to buy a cigar from the owner. So i don't see why it would be a problem.

[44stampede]

I can't believe somebody would bring their own cigar to a cigar lounge. Do you bring your own eggs and bacon to Denny's?
I would bring my own too but if I did I more than make it up with the stupidly expensive scotch.

[cigarmonkel]

I can't believe somebody would bring their own cigar to a cigar lounge. Do you bring your own eggs and bacon to Denny's?

I as well have done this. I have a lot of cigars i love to smoke which my B&M doesn't carry or can't keep on the shelves. I ALWAYS make sure to buy as many cigars from them as i smoke while i'm there and make sure they are ones that i will smoke again and not some cheap-o's. I personally don't see a problem with it and neither does the owner since he lets me continue to do so.

[Fia]

I as well have done this. I have a lot of cigars i love to smoke which my B&M doesn't carry or can't keep on the shelves. I ALWAYS make sure to buy as many cigars from them as i smoke while i'm there and make sure they are ones that i will smoke again and not some cheap-o's. I personally don't see a problem with it and neither does the owner since he lets me continue to do so.

That makes sense but not every one has sense. Some guys would go into the shop that closed down with their zip log bag from Holts or CI and sit down and start smoking. They would even read the catalogs, planning their next purchase to boot. Had another guy that came in every day showing off his Cubans and smoking them but never buy from the store. Along those same lines they allowed pipe smokers to fill a bowl from their bulk blends for free to sample the different blends. There were some that "sample" every time they came in and never buy any pipe tobacco. Near the end of the business their inventory was so bad you couldn't blame someone for bringing their own. There was nothing decent to buy. If that happened when I was in there, I would buy a magazine or something. That's a bi reason why I would never subscribe to cigar or pipe magazines just so I could buy something from them.
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[ysr_racer]

I'm going to Starbucks tomorrow to use their wi-fi, think they'll mind if I bring a cup of coffee and a bagel from home?

See how silly that sounds?

[44stampede]

That makes sense but not every one has sense. Some guys would go into the shop that closed down with their zip log bag from Holts or CI and sit down and start smoking. They would even read the catalogs, planning their next purchase to boot. Had another guy that came in every day showing off his Cubans and smoking them but never buy from the store. Along those same lines they allowed pipe smokers to fill a bowl from their bulk blends for free to sample the different blends. There were some that "sample" every time they came in and never buy any pipe tobacco. Near the end of the business their inventory was so bad you couldn't blame someone for bringing their own. There was nothing decent to buy. If that happened when I was in there, I would buy a magazine or something. That's a bi reason why I would never subscribe to cigar or pipe magazines just so I could buy something from them.
Posted via Mobile Device
Most people have no concept of what it takes to run a business. It sounds like on both ends of this scenario. The owner should never have let it get to this. The main fault is theirs. Maybe they were at their wits end and felt like this is better than an empty place. Sounds like it is and was not easy place to run a biz of this sort in that location.
You can't always rely on peoples good nature to have a business do well. It's true that most people will "do the right thing" but some won't and they can bring friends...

[mosesbotbol]

I'm going to Starbucks tomorrow to use their wi-fi, think they'll mind if I bring a cup of coffee and a bagel from home?

See how silly that sounds?

Lighting fee. I use to be opposed to it as I remember just going to any bar and smoking a cigar, but in most states that is a bye gone era. The rare occasion I do smoke in public, if they need a lighting fee, then that is gladly paid.

[ysr_racer]

I guess I see that. It's kind of like a corkage fee at a restaurant.

[Fia]

I guess I see that. It's kind of like a corkage fee at a restaurant.

Agreed!!!

[oooo35980]

Wow how did I miss this thread? ToH opening a lounge? Awesome, count me in, I don't think anyone would mind a modest entry fee seeing as it would be the only place like it on island.

[Fia]

Wow how did I miss this thread? ToH opening a lounge? Awesome, count me in, I don't think anyone would mind a modest entry fee seeing as it would be the only place like it on island.

Hopefully in the next month or so. I was there a few days ago checking it out. They are even installing a heavy duty industrial grade air filter!

[oooo35980]

Awesome, I love that place, every time the wife and I are downtown we stop in and the guy behind the counter gives my son a box to play with while I try to remember what cigars I've been meaning to try.