8 year old kid gets pepper sprayed by the police.

[shilala]

Here's a link. (http://www.ohio.com/news/break_news/119328204.html)

I watched a big do-up/interview on this last night.
The background here is the kid had gone to a special behavioral school for some time, and the doctors decided that he was ready to get mainstreamed back into regular school via the special behavioral unit they have at the elementary school.
Aiden freaked out, tore off a piece of sharp moulding, and ran everyone out of the room with it. He bunkerized his new compound, and announced that if anyone came in, they were getting killed.
He was good enough to tell the cops the same thing when they arrived, so he earned himself a heaping helping of pepper spray.
Amazingly enough, he IMMEDIATELY came around to everyone else's way of thinking.

Charges have not been filed against the kid or the police. The kid's mother and grandmother still clearly have no clue, but they're pretty smart about cutting their losses.

In the interview, there wasn't much the young man truly understood, but he definately understood that pepper spray sucks.
When I watched the story, I have to admit that I was thrilled that the police put a swift and immediate end to this kid's act. They made a clear impression on him that will last a lifetime. The impression that even precious flowers eventually suffer consequences.
I honestly believe that this single action by the police may give this kid a new lease on life, or at least they gave him an opportunity to change. How long it will last depends on the parents (who might just have learned a lesson, too).

If any of you guys have caught this story or saw the interview, what did you think?
To qualify my position, if any of my kids were ever acting like this, I would certainly hope the police would take similar action. And then come back next week to reinforce the point they were trying to make.

[Darrell]

My parents would have charged the classroom themselves and beat my ass all the way home. The Police would have been the LEAST of my worries. :r

[kydsid]

The cops would never have made it for me until after my dad had choked me out. As a child of parents who were almost in their 40's when they had me I was a generation apart and missed the whole Dr Spock praise praise praise and no punishment generation. This kid seemed to be the pentultimate example of never being told no. Hopefully this tough slap in the face will bring him around but I doubt mom and gradma will reinforce the idea.

[Bunker]

I like a nice feel-good story to start the week.

In that situation the cops are less likely to hurt the kid with a blast of pepper spray than if they tried to physically restrain him and ended up accidently dislocating his shoulder or breaking his arm or something.

Maybe the cops can comeback next week and pepper-spray the kid and his parents.

[timj219]

No doubt the police acted appropriately. But if the boy is mentally ill I'm afraid it's not likely the pepper spray will give him a "new lease on life". The next time he suffers an episode his memory of this incident will play no part in determining his actions.

[markem]

The article that I read indicated that the teachers barricaded themselves and the other kids in a room and that the out of control kid was trying to get to them. The kid had a spear, intended to use it, announced his intention and got sprayed after the police could not talk him down (they apparently had prior contact with the kid).

The article that I read indicated that the mom said something to the effect that the kid deserved what he got. Dunno if that was rumor or something else.

[icehog3]

F*** with the bull and you get the horns. Sorry the kid had to get sprayed, but he brought it on himself, and as Rick mentioned, he was much less likely to get permanently hurt this way than by physical restraint.

[Blueface]

The mom and the kid were on the Today show earlier this week.
The mom made no apologies.
Said he was a very good kid everywhere and only acts up in school.

Meantime, ifnit was my kid during that interview, I would have cracked him a shot and told him to sit right and get his feet off someone else's furniture.

That kid is sadly a ticking time bomb and his mother is no help.

Here is the Today link.
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=H_uXO07Ki4g&feature=youtube_gdata_player

[backwoods357]

:c
That really pisses me off. From the video Carlos posted, this isn't the first time the police had to come (she mentioned that they have had to talk him down repeatedly in the past), and that he is mentally sound. I wish they had launched cs gas through the window and tazered the little turd. Maybe throw some waterboarding in there for good measure. The kid hasn't ever been punished, every time he goes ape-sh!t he gets talked down and babied by his mother and the cops drop the charges. I really hope he doesn't pass a psych screening and become a marine. This kid is a perfect example of the last two horrible generations. (at least gen X didn't really pull this kind of bull)
Like Jason my parents were in their 40's when I was born. They taught me right, and I got spanked. I'm a little twisted but I think I function decently. ;)

[rrplasencia]

I went to an all boys catholic high school where the teachers, priests, and brothers wouldn't of needed the cops, they would of charged the room themselves with paddles. you know the old school wooden boards with holes drilled into them.

[OLS]

I hope that one day we get a little more for our money and actually SEE and HEAR a refutation by the
psychological community that this whole Time-out chair mentality has been a big step back for
American society. You can plot the behavior on a chart from where my parents were and the way I and
others like me turned out to the way these generations have turned out. Add in the internet and you are
going to see an exponential rise in this kind of behavior. I got may a$$ whipped SEVERELY as a child,
because I was a limits-tester. Early and often, sometimes 40-50 good licks with the belt. And I can tell
my mother is gratified by the fact that I never held it against them or stated that I thought they were
wrong. My mother dreaded parent-teacher night, because invariably the story I was telling and the story
they later got from the teacher was completely divergent. She was always embarassed to hear the real story.
Those were usually the worst beatings. But they took their responsibility seriously and raised three smart,
well-thought of children who became well-adjusted adults who understand personal responsibility. Pity
this country the children they have spawned with this everbody gets a trophy, no beatings at home or
in school drooling doofus squad. Ironic that society has forced us to consider SO MUCH the impressions of
others as to how we raise our own children, and yet somehow this results in generations of children who could
CARE LESS what people think of them. Our society functions best when each child thinks first about how
his behavior affects the lives of others.

[replicant_argent]

so, according to his mom, he "doesn't have these issues at home," or somesuch.

That tells me that he is probably just a little sh!t when he doesn't think he is going to get into trouble. The professionals don't think there is an actual mental problem with him, mom says? Okay, that leaves a simple discipline problem.
I may not be the worlds greatest dad, but I can recognize bullsh!t when I see it.

[mariogolbee]

I went to an all boys catholic high school where the teachers, priests, and brothers wouldn't of needed the cops, they would of charged the room themselves with paddles. you know the old school wooden boards with holes drilled into them.
I got this kind of treatment when I was in Catholic school during kinder and 1st. That school and it's treatment of kids is the exact reason I turned form God until my late 20's. That school showed me that God was represented by some old whore with a paddle that showed not love but hate. If God is represented by nuns, and nuns just scream, speak of Satan, and hit kids, then God must hate humans, right?
Our society functions best when each child thinks first about how
his behavior affects the lives of others.
This part of what you mentioned is very true. Of course, adults should be a little more creative than just having to smack someone. When we are adults if we smack each other to prove a point it is unacceptable. As parents it is our job to teach our children how to function in society, among other things. Beating the sh*t out of them shows them what, that when we can't control another person we should hit them? Interesting.

I don't think this kid's behavior is excusable. Something, maybe even pepper spray, needs/needed to be done about him. He is an extreme example and all of society should not be judged based on how this one kid acts. I'm pretty tired of hearing all of this "old school" kids deverve a whoopin' sh*t though. My father beat us. He is a POS and it didn't teach us anything except to hate and detest him. It took us a while to get past the BS anger issues instilled in us from the abuse we took as children. Might does not equal right. I can beat the hell out of most people that stood in my way if I chose. Try challenging yourselves and figure out a more creative solution to your problems. :sh

For the record, I still don't think this kid's behavior is justified. There is a real issue hear that does need to be dealt with, though. And others should not need to suffer or be put in danger due to his issues.

[Bill86]

Good for the police. My parents would have asked if they could just mace us whenever we miss behaved. Hell I'd have gotten my ass kicked the whole way home while they were driving.

Probably put in a complaint with the PD that pepper sprayed me saying they didn't use enough.

Kids and parents these days.

[replicant_argent]

While teaching kids their actions have effects on others is very important, it is not more important than teaching them personal responsibility. That can be stressed and taught far before second grade. It is also a lost cause for many, anathema to some, and unthinkable to an unfortunate and growing minority.

[backwoods357]

I think the reason the mother claims he doesn't have these problems at home is because she is either lying or just lets him run the house as he sees fit. Also it looks like Mark is right, the little turd had them trapped in a room. He admitted that he wanted the piece of wood to be pointy, to "hit them with", he pretty obviously wanted to stab them. As far as I'm concerned he should be charged with a felony (assault, attempted murder) for each person he had cornered in that room. I wouldn't want him to serve time, I feel that could only make him worse. I just don't want him to be able to own a gun or join the armed forces.

[Blueface]

I think the key difference between his upbringing, mine and the way I raised my kids is I would have had by butt inverted by my dad's foot.
I would be be bed bound for months.
I would have my favorite toys literally thrown away, regardless of what my dad paid for them.
Lastly, my dad would express shame and the very last thing he would ever, ever do is defend me or justify my actions.
That is the way I raised my kids. They are not perfect but have never been criminals.

[T.G]

Just cut off his foot and be done with it already. Teach that little rebellious punk once and for all.

[backwoods357]

I'm pretty tired of hearing all of this "old school" kids deverve a whoopin' sh*t though. My father beat us. He is a POS and it didn't teach us anything except to hate and detest him.

There is a line between beating your kids and discipline and I think its pretty clear. I don't agree with hitting your kids, or physically contacting them in anger. I got spanked pretty often for a few years and after I got the point almost never. My stepdouche liked to toss me around ( I remember him once repeatedly full palm belting me across the face while I was in the shower) but my mom and dad didn't.

[Blueface]

There is a line between beating your kids and discipline and I think its pretty clear. I don't agree with hitting your kids, or physically contacting them in anger. I got spanked pretty often for a few years and after I got the point almost never. My stepdouche liked to toss me around ( I remember him once repeatedly full palm belting me across the face while I was in the shower) but my mom and dad didn't.

I agree with being anti beatings.
However, one swift solid foot up the a$$ requiring a proctologist to remove the shoe is perfect for this situation.

[emopunker2004]

No doubt the police acted appropriately. But if the boy is mentally ill I'm afraid it's not likely the pepper spray will give him a "new lease on life". The next time he suffers an episode his memory of this incident will play no part in determining his actions.

True but that is not the goal of of spray. It's meant to get the person to stop doing what they are doing and allow you to control the situation which it clearly did. Kid got what he deserved. To be honest if he is that mentally ill it would not have effected him, trust me.

[icehog3]

I got spanked pretty often for a few years and after I got the point almost never.

I got the point loud and clear when I got the belt, I promise you.

Children don't read adult friends, or to be "reasoned" with. They need parents. :2

[timj219]

True but that is not the goal of of spray. It's meant to get the person to stop doing what they are doing and allow you to control the situation which it clearly did. Kid got what he deserved. To be honest if he is that mentally ill it would not have effected him, trust me.Of course it's not the goal of pepper spray. I was responding to a post on the thread that expressed the opinion that it might have that effect. And please trust me, most mentally ill people respond to pepper spray the same way you would most of the time. Methods of coercion and restraint used in mental health institutions are very similar to those used everywhere and they are most often effective in the short term.

[thebayratt]

My parents would have charged the classroom themselves and beat my ass all the way home. The Police would have been the LEAST of my worries. :r

You got that rite!!

:sl

I bet that kid tells his mom what to do, when to do it, and how to do it....
He deserves what he gets... any kid with anger issues @8.... c'mon I can bet the parents are a bunch of PTA award winners in the first place.

[emopunker2004]

hey that kid's lucky he didn't get shot

[Stephen]

My parents would have charged the classroom themselves and beat my ass all the way home. The Police would have been the LEAST of my worries. :r
:tpd:

[Stephen]

As good a reason as any to post a South Park (http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=AW7cO01SpzI) video.:banger

[shilala]

There was question to the kid's mental condition.
In the interview, there was mention that the child was afflicted with PTSD. The interviewer picked apart the PTSD thing, and it appears he has PTSD from being bullied.
Which brings me to bullying...
If some of you do not have kids going to school right now (we have 3, 9-14), the latest and greatest craze is the "just say no to bullying" campaign. There are assemblies, "special people" come to the school, non in-house police visit the schools, there are homework assignments, and tests on how to handle a bully.
Mind ya now, this is no sh1t coming right here...
If a bully, say, grabs your arm, you are to pull your arm away and shout "NO!!!!" That will instantly and effectively eradicate the bullying, at which time you are to immediately go to the office and file a report on the incident.
To this point in time, that's it. The kids haven't been instructed in self defense, haven't been taught how to break a nose, they weren't even so much as taught to run screaming to draw attention. Nothing realistic to protect themselves.

I don't really want to make light of this, because I guess some think it's become a great big problem. I can't imagine how bad I'd feel if my child were regular bully meat. I was fortunate growing up, I got bullied once by a kid much bigger than me. He took to writing on my face with a marker. I slapped the marker away and he was fixing to whip my ass when my brother came around the corner. The ass whipping immediately changed ownership, and said bully never came within 50 feet of me the rest of the year. By the following year, I could take care of him myself. Thank God for big brothers.:)
That leads me to a point/question...
There's gazillions of "kids band together and banish the bully" feel-good movies out there. None of our kids (5) have ever had a problem. Is this one another blown-up media hypesicle, or do your kids report that it's really gotten worse?
Mine have not. If anything, it's the opposite. There are penalties in place now for violating another kid's personal space that weren't in place when I was coming up, but on the other hand, the kids can say most anything without fear of reprisal. There's a big difference there.

[OLS]

I guess Mario that what you are saying is that you got beat for no reason. I made it clear that I had it
coming everytime. I know why I got beaten, I took the beatings, I did not associate the beatings with
any flaw in my parents but rather a reward for the fun that I had that I knew I would have to pay for
one day. I knew I was a devious lil $hi+, and I knew there would be a day of comeuppance.
And it was worth it. I feel for people who were abused by POSs, and yet it still does not change my
opinion that kids have no fear of consequences today, and that is DUE TO SOMETHING MISSING that has
been taken out of the aresnal of good parenting. I can understand the real sensitivity you have to the issue
Mario, but to me it is like saying that everyone who owns a gun is going to murder someone someday.
A good weapon in the hands of a person with bad intent is going to be abused. I see spanking as a good
weapon that can be used for bad by cruel people.

[shilala]

I guess Mario that what you are saying is that you got beat for no reason. I made it clear that I had it
coming everytime. I know why I got beaten, I took the beatings, I did not associate the beatings with
any flaw in my parents but rather a reward for the fun that I had that I knew I would have to pay for
one day. I knew I was a devious lil $hi+, and I knew there would be a day of comeuppance.
And it was worth it. I feel for people who were abused by POSs, and yet it still does not change my
opinion that kids have no fear of consequences today, and that is DUE TO SOMETHING MISSING that has
been taken out of the aresnal of good parenting. I can understand the real sensitivity you have to the issue
Mario, but to me it is like saying that everyone who owns a gun is going to murder someone someday.
A good weapon in the hands of a person with bad intent is going to be abused. I see spanking as a good
weapon that can be used for bad by cruel people.
There's always gonna be an asshole in every crowd, and unfortunately, Mario found him.
Mario shows day in and day out that some of the best men ever made walked a long sh1t-covered road to get there.

[KenyanSandBoa]

I got the point loud and clear when I got the belt, I promise you.

Children don't read adult friends, or to be "reasoned" with. They need parents. :2

:tpd::tpd::tpd:

I couldn't agree more, Tom. I see all of these parents that spend more time trying to be friends with their kids than being parents. Living in the crazy liberal state of Massachusetts, if you discipline your kids, you're called out for being cruel.

When I was growing up, my father raised us on the 2-Strike rule...he told you not to do somethng, and if you did it again, you got your a$$ handed to you...none of this "try to rationalize with your child" BS.

[shilala]

:tpd::tpd::tpd:

I couldn't agree more, Tom. I see all of these parents that spend more time trying to be friends with their kids than being parents. Living in the crazy liberal state of Massachusetts, if you discipline your kids, you're called out for being cruel.

When I was growing up, my father raised us on the 2-Strike rule...he told you not to do somethng, and if you did it again, you got your a$$ handed to you...none of this "try to rationalize with your child" BS.
My old man rationalized with me in his own way. "Because I said so" was pretty popular. He really did take the time to tell me the where's and why's of things along the way, even if it was just "you clean your room because we don't live like pigs". Short and to the point.
Lots of things were like that. Others he'd really take the time because he drank a lot and he liked to hear himself talk. I took great stock in all the things he taught me, and still do. Later in life I found out that a lot of things he believed were wrong, and made changes for myself, but he still covered everything that he could the best he could.

[Blueface]

I got the crap beaten out of me as a child.
In fact, I vividly recall the embarrassment of once going to school with a black eye at the hands of my father.

I don't hold any grudges.
In fact, few men I admire as much as him.

He has been a role model, faithful husband.
He has always been a hard working, honest man, at times never working less than seven days a week to provide for us.
Anything he could give me, including a college education, a car and so on, he did.

I say all this because again, he beat the chit out me.
He would unscrew the stick on a toilet plunger and chase me for blocks, in front of my friends, until he eventually got me at some point in the day.

Frankly, I deserved it.
I was on a bad road growing up in the streets of Newark.
Of all my friends at the time (20 or so of us), I am the ONLY one to graduate college.
I am one of maybe three of us that did not land in jail, although I was tailed in HS and had officers undercover visit my home and drag me into the pricipal's office in school.
About half are now dead.
One turned massive murderer.
I have a great life today, with a successful career, home and more importantly, family.
I truly feel I owe all it to my dad and his discipline.
The road I was on was not going to get better by talking.

My dad never laid a hand on me unless I was out of control.
When I behaved, there was no greater father.

The similar discipline was used with my son.
Except the stick and black eye part.
He is a stellar young man, with a great career and good head on his shoulers and we have a great relationship.

My daughter on the other hand was mostly spoken to and she gave me all the headaches. Go figure. So much for talking.

I share this to show not all beatings make you hateful. Some truly knock sense in you.

[backwoods357]

He would unscrew the stick on a toilet plunger and chase me for blocks, in front of my friends, until he eventually got me at some point in the day.


Reminds me of the time my mom broke the ruler she was spanking me with and to piss her off I started laughing about it (tears still in my eyes). This resulted in me running for my life around the yard, her close behind with a tree limb a little thicker than a baseball over her head. Don't know what she would have done if she caught up with me before my dad showed up. :r

[jjirons69]

My parents would have charged the classroom themselves and beat my ass all the way home. The Police would have been the LEAST of my worries. :r

:tpd:

I know what you mean, Darrell! I didn't have to live with the police. I would've been praying for jail time to keep from having to go home!

[N2 GOLD]

I agree with being anti beatings.
However, one swift solid foot up the a$$ requiring a proctologist to remove the shoe is perfect for this situation.

:tu Agree, good ol fashioned discipline is good every now & then. By NO means do I condone beating any child. Just keep them in line old school way.

[Starscream]

I can think of many other children around that age that need to get pepper sprayed as well.:r

[Subvet642]

Modern parenting:

http://www.websters-online-dictionary.org/images/wiki/wikipedia/en/thumb/7/7d/Flanders_with_Parents.png/250px-Flanders_with_Parents.png

I've tried nothin', Man, and I'm outta ideas.

[KenyanSandBoa]

My old man rationalized with me in his own way. "Because I said so" was pretty popular. He really did take the time to tell me the where's and why's of things along the way, even if it was just "you clean your room because we don't live like pigs". Short and to the point.
Lots of things were like that. Others he'd really take the time because he drank a lot and he liked to hear himself talk. I took great stock in all the things he taught me, and still do. Later in life I found out that a lot of things he believed were wrong, and made changes for myself, but he still covered everything that he could the best he could.

Yeah..."Because I said so" was a common one for me too. :D My dad never drank, so I never had to experience that, but he was a "it's my way, or the highway" type of guy. Granted when I was a kid, I thought there times when I hated my dad for his No-BS mentality, but I realize that it made me stronger and much more disciplined now I'm an adult.

As much as I would hate to admit this, and God help me if my father heard this, but I will raise my kids the same way he raised me...even though I'm sure there were times I swore that I wouldn't be like that when I have kids. :r

[mosesbotbol]

F*** with the bull and you get the horns. Sorry the kid had to get sprayed, but he brought it on himself, and as Rick mentioned, he was much less likely to get permanently hurt this way than by physical restraint.

Yup, the police were called, that is what they decided as professionals was the safest to protect the crowd, perp, and themselves.

[357]

Pity
this country the children they have spawned with this everbody gets a trophy, no beatings at home or
in school drooling doofus squad. Ironic that society has forced us to consider SO MUCH the impressions of
others as to how we raise our own children, and yet somehow this results in generations of children who could
CARE LESS what people think of them. Our society functions best when each child thinks first about how
his behavior affects the lives of others.


I got the point loud and clear when I got the belt, I promise you.

Children don't read adult friends, or to be "reasoned" with. They need parents. :2


I'm with you guys. If a child will not respect his parent, how do you expect that same child to respect any other authority; teacher, professor, police officer, or the law in general.

Proberbs is known as the book of wisdom for good reason.


Proverbs 13:
[24] He that spareth his rod hateth his son: but he that loveth him chasteneth him betimes.

Proverbs 22:
[15] Foolishness is bound in the heart of a child; but the rod of correction shall drive it far from him.

Proverbs 23:
[13] Withhold not correction from the child: for if thou beatest him with the rod, he shall not die.
[14] Thou shalt beat him with the rod, and shalt deliver his soul from hell.

Please understand that today the word beat has a negative connotation. The context surrounding these verses makes it very clear that this is not the kind of beatings that happen out of rage, drunken or otherwise. The heart and mind of a parent must not be filled with rage or anger when administering punishment.

[OLS]

Mario shows day in and day out that some of the best men ever made walked a long sh1t-covered road to get there.
I agree...I loves me some Mario.

[OLS]

And don't forget the Clarence Thomas rule...Thou shalt not show thy rod to thy staff.

[Zeuceone]

play stupid game, win stupid prizes.

[KenyanSandBoa]

And don't forget the Clarence Thomas rule...Thou shalt not show thy rod to thy staff.

:r:r:r