People never cease to amaze me

[Blueface]

I had to contact my alarm company yesterday to run a test to see if the back up system to communicate with them, in the event someone tampers with my phone line, was functioning as it should.

That entailed disconnecting my phone line from the alarm and then intentionally tripping it and letting the siren go off for over a minute.

While a minute sounds like nothing, try counting 60 seconds with a glaring outside siren, while a second equally as loud or louder inside one is also going off. It seems like forever!!!

While the siren was going off, I went outside as I was concerned having a police officer next door, that was at home at the time. Didn't want him to come with guns blazing. Turns out that as I looked around, I noticed at least 7 very close by neighbors that were at home, including the police officer. Of all these folks at home, only one (the guy across the street from me) bothered to open their door, go outside and wonder what was going on at my home. I yelled across the street that I was doing a test and thanked him for being concerned. Today, I went over and handed him a Cuban cigar to thank him for being the only person interested in my home's well being.

All I can say is WTF??? That pissed me off. How can people be so accustomed to alarms going off that they no longer care and ignore them. This, while not nearly as bad, reminds me of the many videos we see on TV where folks are being assaulted and bystanders pass by and do nothing to assist. What is this world coming to? As much as I may want to not do anything in return for these neighbors should the same happen to them, I don't have that in me and it is not the example I wish to set for humanity.

[croatan]

Sad state of affairs, Carlos.

People in Texas are much friendlier (and more likely to shoot when they hear sirens). You should come here for another visit ;)

[Darrell]

That makes me sick. What if someone was really in harms way, people could not be bothered to get off their lazy asses and check it out? Nobody is asking them to run in the "burning house", but they can at least see if their is anything they can do.

Losers. :td

[replicant_argent]

The neighbor that came out wasn't just annoyed at the noise and wanted to make sure whose ear to chew on for interrupting his nap? I have very little faith in the general population, and of all my neighbors, I would only trust one of them to have/show concern over my home. It's just the despicable cynic residing in my instinctual animal brain.

[Kreth]

This, while not nearly as bad, reminds me of the many videos we see on TV where folks are being assaulted and bystanders pass by and do nothing to assist.
Hell, some of them grab a video to post on YouTube. :rolleyes:
I came to the conclusion a long time ago that most people suck. It's a shame that more people can't be like Asylum members, funny as that sounds.
Posted via Mobile Device

[Subvet642]

How do you know they didn't call 911? Or, what if it were a home invasion? It would be kind of foolish for your neighbors to go outside and become nice, soft targets for the bad guys.

[Blueface]

How do you know they didn't call 911? Or, what if it were a home invasion? It would be kind of foolish for your neighbors to go outside and become nice, soft targets for the bad guys.

Well, as far as 911, no police ever showed up at my home so I think we can rule that one out.

As far as a home invasion? Sure, not saying that any of them should come running over, but what about the police officer? Isn't his job to serve and protect? The neighbor that came out told me today the reason he did it was his concern for what was going on. He didn't see me outside at first and was ready to go inside and call the police.

I guess there are a million "what if" one can ask. I guess my problem with understanding this is I am the kind of person that would have run over and would have tried to do something if one of my neighbor's homes was being compromised. I guess not everyone thinks the same and from my perspective, that is a sad state of affairs when human beings don't look out for one another.

[elderboy02]

Carlos, keep a gun on you. :gn Take care of yourself :tu Your neighbors just proved that they only care about theirselves.

[T.G]

I yelled across the street that I was doing a test and thanked him for being concerned. Today, I went over and handed him a Cuban cigar to thank him for being the only person interested in my home's well being.


That tent peg ought to teach him not to meddle in your affairs. ;)

[replicant_argent]

Remember Carlos, when seconds count, the Police are only minutes away..
The other thing to remember is that we all have our personal perspectives (legal/moral/ethical) on putting our own selves in harms way with protecting a neighbor versus a defensive stance with your own family.

[68TriShield]

I am not surprised in the least Carlos.

[Blueface]

That tent peg ought to teach him not to meddle in your affairs. ;)

:r
Actually, I gave him a Partagas PSD4.
I gave my other neighbor, who wasn't home at the time of my alarm test, and who always grubs cigars from me and rarely gives some back, who doesn't know what a good cigar is unless it comes from me, one of the Boli PC's that I left in my truck per my thread on the Habanos section.:r
He was also outside and I felt bad giving one a cigar and not the other.

[Blueface]

The other thing to remember is that we all have our personal perspectives (legal/moral/ethical) on putting our own selves in harms way with protecting a neighbor versus a defensive stance with your own family.

Totally agree Pete.
However, one would think that at minimum, from the safety of their front door, they could stand there, look over to my home, see if my truck was in the driveway, wonder what was going on, noticed other neighbors standing outside also scratching their heads, without walking over to my house, run to the police officers house instead and get his ass out, or even call the police on their own and keep an eye to see if the see anyone leaving my home with half of my contents, all from the safety of their own home?

[CigarNut]

I know that with my alarm company they will not call 911 until they have tried to get in touch with me to verify the event. If they cannot get in touch with me then they would call 911. In your case since the alarm company knew it was a test they would not have called 911.

As for your neighbors, I find that the only neighbors that seem concerned about me are those that I am friendly with -- which is not all of my neighbors. The few times our alarm has gone off it has only been for a short period (even when we test), so they ask me about it later, but figure that it was an accident...

Having said all of that, I am not sure that I would count on my neighbors if it were a real emergency -- would much rather count on the (armed) Police, Fire and Ambulance arriving quickly...

[mosesbotbol]

In MA, people are too liability scared to do anything. The only thanks one gets in MA for being a good samaritan is a law suit.

[MarkinAZ]

All I can say is WTF??? How can people be so accustomed to alarms going off that they no longer care and ignore them. This, while not nearly as bad, reminds me of the many videos we see on TV where folks are being assaulted and bystanders pass by and do nothing to assist. What is this world coming to? As much as I may want to not do anything in return for these neighbors should the same happen to them, I don't have that in me and it is not the example I wish to set for humanity.

It is a sad state of affairs Carlos when your fellow human being does nothing in response to a neighbor in need.

I call these individuals cattle and sheep. They do not want to get involve, participate, or help. They would rather stand-by inside their little shelter of a box, turn up the sound of the tv/radio, close the shades, and not have to worry period. These individuals can simply go to hell as far as I'm concerned, and do not contribute to a healthy and safe community.

I'm one who stays involved and active in my community by saying hello and chatting with my fellow neighbors. We know one another in my community, and a number of us tend to look out for others where I live. So far, Mr. Springfield has not had to speak up on my behalf. I walk my community at some points during the day, but mainly at nights, armed with my cell phone and Surefire P9. Sometimes, I find dark garages with the doors up and have been able to enlighten my neighbors, who thank me for advising them. You also get to meet new neighbors too.

Being proactive in your community is key to deactivating any potential crime that may occurr. I guess that's why we don't have druggies in my community any longer:tu

Get involved and stay involved in your communities folks...

[Blueface]

I know that with my alarm company they will not call 911 until they have tried to get in touch with me to verify the event. If they cannot get in touch with me then they would call 911. In your case since the alarm company knew it was a test they would not have called 911.

As for your neighbors, I find that the only neighbors that seem concerned about stuff are those that I am friendly with -- which is not all of my neighbors. The few times our alarm has gone off it has only been for a short period (even when we test), so they ask me about it later, but figure that it was an accident...

Having said all of that, I am not sure that I would count on my neighbors if it were a real emergency -- would much rather count on the (armed) Police, Fire and Ambulance arriving quickly...

Michael, the pisser is these are all folks that I am friendly with. I do so much crap for all these people. After storms, it has been that has helped them with tools like generators or chainsaws, it has been me that has helped with the clean up, have helped them with their insurance claims in getting new roofs, have cooked on my grille for all of them who had no power, and on and on and on. That is what drives me the craziest with this event.

[Subvet642]

(SNIP)...
I guess there are a million "what if" one can ask. I guess my problem with understanding this is I am the kind of person that would have run over and would have tried to do something if one of my neighbor's homes was being compromised. I guess not everyone thinks the same and from my perspective, that is a sad state of affairs when human beings don't look out for one another.

And, quite probably, you would have become a casualty. Damning your neighbors based on almost no factual knowlege of what they did or didn't do, is I think, somewhat less than fair. Now, your interactions with your neighbors will be be stained by a possibly inaccurate belief about their character(s). Your purchase of an alarm system does not obligate them to do anything. After all, if they know about it and its connection to a monitoring company, what's to make them believe that the police aren't on their way? :2

[Blueface]

And, quite probably, you would have become a casualty. Damning your neighbors based on almost no factual knowlege of what they did or didn't do, is I think, somewhat less than fair. Now, your interactions with your neighbors will be be stained by a possibly inaccurate belief about their character(s). Your purchase of an alarm system does not obligate them to do anything. After all, if they know about it and its connection to a monitoring company, what's to make them believe that the police aren't on their way? :2

Darren,
Just curious.
Please don't be offended.
Purely me being inquisitive.

Are you one of those that I alluded to that walks by someone being harmed and does nothing?

[neoflex]

Just goes to show most people nowadays are only concerned about themselves. I say this to my wife all the time as it pisses me off. No one has any concern or regard for others unless it will impact them directly. Perfect example is a neighbor of mine had their house broken into about a month ago. Two neighbors work from home and two others are retired. The neighbor whose house was broken into came over and asked if I saw anything. I wasn't home all day so of course I couldn't be of any help but told her I would keep my eyes and ears open and let her know if I hear anything that could be of help. The one neighbor who works from home and lives directly across the street said he noticed a green SUV parked in the driveway and the people driving it looked suspicious. Nice! So it looked suspicious but yet you chose to do nothing about it. I haven't said two words to him since. Not even the neighborly "Hello." Nice to know he could give to sh*ts while his neighbors house gets robbed. Hell don't even go over there at least call the cops as response times in my neighborhood tend to be fairly quick. Worse case scenario is the cops show up and find out they are doing nothing wrong.
There is a home that recently went into foreclosure on the other side of my neighborhood. One day I noticed two guys going through the side window while driving by so I pulled over a couple houses away and called the Police. They showed up and it turns out they were there to do work on the house for the real estate company that just bought the house and they must not of had a key. Sad thing is I saw about a dozen cars drive by while they were doing this and it was in broad daylight in plain sight. After the cop showed up I walked over to talk to him and jokingly said, "Man, how many reports did you guys get for this one." His response was, "Just the one, why was it you who called?" I was amazed but not surprised. Hell I lost faith in my neighbors last year when I participated in a split for Tat Noella Reservas and my mailman delivered the package to one of my neighbors houses by accident but the idiot couldn't remember which one but distinctively remembered delivering a Priority box on my block the day the DC showed delivered. Apparently whoever got it must have been curious to what was in the box and opened it to find a treat and decided to keep rather than walk it over as it it never turned up. After that incident I kind of wrote most of my neighbors off even though it's not fair to judge them all on one persons actions but most of my neighbors except for a handful are douchy anyway. My wife and I love our house but actually can't wait until the housing market improves to sell and move. It's sad when I would rather hang out with some of my buddies neighbors than my own.

[G G]

Personally I would have responded to see what was up too. And if someone is in harms way I would also have tried to help. If we don't help each other there is no help. The police cannot be everywhere at once. Just my 2 cents worth.:tu

And if a neighbors wife or children were hurt or killed and I had not tried to help, how could I live with myself?

[pektel]

I only count on myself for home protection. I live a little ways out in the country. Any type of confrontation would be well over with by the time the police made it there. Which is why I have a 12 guage pump action with bird shot (won't go through 2 layers of sheetrock), a Browning (Belgian made)30-06, and a Kimber .45. I'm pretty well covered. :D

There is a vacant house next door to me, where the previous owner died a couple years ago. Anything fishy goes on over there, I'm out at the fenceline, making my presence known.

I guess I wouldn't feel right about NOT doing anything about it.

[Trouble]

Problem is that the majority of the time an alarm goes off it is user error or a test such as in this case.

[G G]

Well I also was thinking about what i do for a living. Some folks in my line of work say they would not stop at an accident scene it they happen upon one while they are not on duty. They think up all sorts of scenarios where they don't have a duty to act and this and that. I would not be able to pass by a scene and not stop, it's a moral issue for me, regardless who it is, it could be one of your family members and it could be someone entirely unknown to me, I don't really care who they are I will stop. Do unto others as you would have them do unto you. Not sure about anyone else but if someone was in the process of wearing me out to try to rob me or kill me it would sure be nice if someone lent a hand.

[Blueface]

On point Greg.
Heroes come from folks who sacrifice themselves to help others. I rather die a "do er" than stand by and do nothing at all.

Wife and I were on e first at the scene of a horrific roll over that happened in front of us. An infant was badly injured as was the driver. Blood everywhere, including on us. It is only after we suppresed the bleeding half cut arm, hped the bleeding child out of the seat, that we considered having been tainted by any blood. Than God right after us, a nurse arrived to help us. I am not a hero for what I did. Instead, I simply call myself a fellow human being that would have wanted the same in return.

[G G]

On point Greg.
Heroes come from folks who sacrifice themselves to help others. I rather die a "do er" than stand by and do nothing at all.

Wife and I were on e first at the scene of a horrific roll over that happened in front of us. An infant was badly injured as was the driver. Blood everywhere, including on us. It is only after we suppresed the bleeding half cut arm, hped the bleeding child out of the seat, that we considered having been tainted by any blood. Than God right after us, a nurse arrived to help us. I am not a hero for what I did. Instead, I simply call myself a fellow human being that would have wanted the same in return.
Amen Carlos.:tu

[neoflex]

On point Greg.
Heroes come from folks who sacrifice themselves to help others. I rather die a "do er" than stand by and do nothing at all.

Wife and I were on e first at the scene of a horrific roll over that happened in front of us. An infant was badly injured as was the driver. Blood everywhere, including on us. It is only after we suppresed the bleeding half cut arm, hped the bleeding child out of the seat, that we considered having been tainted by any blood. Than God right after us, a nurse arrived to help us. I am not a hero for what I did. Instead, I simply call myself a fellow human being that would have wanted the same in return.

I still keep a halligan tool in my truck just for this reason. Just never know when it may come in handy.

[Subvet642]

Darren,
Just curious.
Please don't be offended.
Purely me being inquisitive.

Are you one of those that I alluded to that walks by someone being harmed and does nothing?

No, not at all. I've worked in security in Boston for 22 years. My wife and I always look after the neighborhood, but we usually don't stand in our door doing it. It's much more effective and safe to stay inside, look out the window, so as not to alert any perp that they are being observed, and call the police with an accurate description and direction of flight.

[357]

Justices Rule Police Do Not Have a Constitutional Duty to Protect Someone

http://www.nytimes.com/2005/06/28/politics/28scotus.html

The Supreme Court ruled on Monday that the police did not have a constitutional duty to protect a person from harm, even a woman who had obtained a court-issued protective order against a violent husband making an arrest mandatory for a violation.


A similar decision was reached in another case, primarily what the decision in this case was based on. Same article


A 1989 decision, DeShaney v. Winnebago County, held that the failure by county social service workers to protect a young boy from a beating by his father did not breach any substantive constitutional duty.

Now this may be tragic, but you have to read between the lines. If the police have no obligation to protect you, then where does that obligation belong?

On yourself. You have the not onlt the right, but the obligation to protect yourself. The best way to do that is to arm yourself.

[G G]

Justices Rule Police Do Not Have a Constitutional Duty to Protect Someone
I had actually remembered that when I was posting my replies Mike.:tu

[T.G]

The best way to do that is to arm yourself.

http://www.cigarasylum.com/vb/attachment.php?attachmentid=6975&stc=1&d=1282155745

Well ARMED...

;)

[longknocker]

I Guess I Count My Blessings, Carlos!:tu My Alarm Went Off The Other Day While I Was Playing Golf. My Playing Partner Asked Me If That Was My Alarm. By The Time The Alarm Company Called My Cell & Told Me The Alarm Was Going Off & I Arrived Home, There Were 3 Neighbors & The Police In My Front Yard. I Agree With GG; I'm Going To Help someone In Trouble, No Matter What.:2

[Jbailey]

Is that picture from The Young Ones Adam?

-Sorry to thread jack-

[tsolomon]

I guess there are a million "what if" one can ask. I guess my problem with understanding this is I am the kind of person that would have run over and would have tried to do something if one of my neighbor's homes was being compromised. I guess not everyone thinks the same and from my perspective, that is a sad state of affairs when human beings don't look out for one another.I have done what you're suggesting, but I was told by the police that arrived later that poking around a house that has an alarm going off is a bad thing to do.

[Subvet642]

I have done what you're suggesting, but I was told by the police that arrived later that poking around a house that has an alarm going off is a bad thing to do.

My point exactly.

[T.G]

Is that picture from The Young Ones Adam?

-Sorry to thread jack-

Yep, that's Neil after he found the old teapot with the genie in it and Vyvyan said something to him about having dinner ready and Neil started his typical whining about not feeling well and wishing he had six pairs of hands to prepare dinner with...

[Blueface]

I have done what you're suggesting, but I was told by the police that arrived later that poking around a house that has an alarm going off is a bad thing to do.

My point exactly.

I can totally see that point.

However, to me, it is no different than convenience store clerks who are held up, v. convenience store clerks that are held up and shot and killed, v. convenience store clerks that fight back and give the thief a good old fashioned ass kicking. It would be best if they just stayed at home as this way, they can limit any risks.:D

This is a serious present day social issue much more deep rooted than my little alarm incident. It is prevalent today in just about anything. Folks will see an old lady being beaten to death and will walk on by because it is not their problem and they don't want to be hurt also. Folks will hear auto alarms, they will come out eventually after it is all over with to learn their neighbor's car had all wheels and parts removed in the driveway but will dare not worry to see what the alarm sound is about. Folks will see something that should involve them for the sake of their fellow man and just keep on their way, because it is someone else's problem. How many times do you see a convenience store clerk being held up on those shocking video TV shows and folks either stand around watching it or leave the second they have a chance? It is a prevalent "if it doesn't affect me, I am not interested" attitude that is truly sad.

It is a relief to know not everyone feels the same way and some are willing to take risks and choose to be involved rather than look the other way.

[Chingas]

I Guess I Count My Blessings, Carlos!:tu My Alarm Went Off The Other Day While I Was Playing Golf. My Playing Partner Asked Me If That Was My Alarm. By The Time The Alarm Company Called My Cell & Told Me The Alarm Was Going Off & I Arrived Home, There Were 3 Neighbors & The Police In My Front Yard. I Agree With GG; I'm Going To Help someone In Trouble, No Matter What.:2

Same thing happened to me twice. Tho I wasn't golfing but my surrounding neighbors and a few down the block were all piled outside my house investigating. Two of which personaly called me to see if I was inside the house and alright. One of which grabbed a bat and circled my house peeking thru the windows until the cops came.

I do the same for them. It's just in some peoples blood and not in others. I'm glad you sticked the neighbor that came out...Never Loose your upbringing because of your surroundings.

[replicant_argent]

and God Bless the Sheepdogs....


A few fellas here might understand that.






Proud to be one.

[Subvet642]

I can totally see that point.

However, to me, it is no different than convenience store clerks who are held up, v. convenience store clerks that are held up and shot and killed, v. convenience store clerks that fight back and give the thief a good old fashioned ass kicking. It would be best if they just stayed at home as this way, they can limit any risks.:D

This is a serious present day social issue much more deep rooted than my little alarm incident. It is prevalent today in just about anything. Folks will see an old lady being beaten to death and will walk on by because it is not their problem and they don't want to be hurt also. Folks will hear auto alarms, they will come out eventually after it is all over with to learn their neighbor's car had all wheels and parts removed in the driveway but will dare not worry to see what the alarm sound is about. Folks will see something that should involve them for the sake of their fellow man and just keep on their way, because it is someone else's problem. How many times do you see a convenience store clerk being held up on those shocking video TV shows and folks either stand around watching it or leave the second they have a chance? It is a prevalent "if it doesn't affect me, I am not interested" attitude that is truly sad.

It is a relief to know not everyone feels the same way and some are willing to take risks and choose to be involved rather than look the other way.

Another reason it can be a bad idea is; startling a home invader can possibly get others killed as well as yourself. One should not barge into a situation one is not trained for.

[357]

Another reason it can be a bad idea is; startling a home invader can possibly get others killed as well as yourself. One should not barge into a situation one is not trained for.

Kind of a broad brush statement. I'm not trained in law enforcment or military tactics but if I came home and my family is in danger, I'm barging in; trained or not.

Nobody is trained for life. You learn as you go. Don't get me wrong as a wise man once said "True wisdom is learning from other's mistakes".

What I mean is a lot of people act like protecting yourself is unrealistic because that's the police's job and they are trained for it. Well, as I posted earlier, they have no legal obligation to protect you. Train yourself and protect yourself, don't wait for someone else to do it for you.

Conversely, if I know nobody is home and my house looks to have been broken into, I'm waiting for the cavalry. No need to risk it alone just to save some trinkets.

[Blueface]

Another reason it can be a bad idea is; startling a home invader can possibly get others killed as well as yourself. One should not barge into a situation one is not trained for.

So......what can I take away from this thread as result of your contribution? I am genuinely fascinated by your counterpoints, specially this one of "startling a home invader". Heck yeah I want to startle him. In fact, I wouldn't hesitate to put a bullet in his head if I am legally allowed to in self defense. Should we all ignore anything that goes on that may cause us harm if we try to look out for someone else?

In the event we chose to not necessarily ignore it, do we sit back, have a cup of coffee, seriously consider all our options, run down a list of identifying who should respond before we do, and then sleep over the idea and decide what to do in the morning, after it all passed?

I am not sure where we are going other than you clearly seem to explain my neighbors and clearly explain the reason I don't see the light is I am not programmed that way. I see I am not alone based on other similar views to mine. I truly just hope those of us that are willing to be involved always outnumber those that aren't.

[taltos]

and God Bless the Sheepdogs....


A few fellas here might understand that.






Proud to be one.Someone needs to get between the sheep and the wolves.:tu

[G G]

I aint trying to stir up nothing by posting my thoughts here at all. I think some of the difference is the area of the country that we were raised in. What I mean is this:

I have been to Massachusett's to visit family since 2000. I hadn't travelled outside of the south til then. I was in awe of how different the people's politics, and their philosophy on things were greatly different than mine. Not that I am saying that' s a bad thing in itself it was just a wake up for me. I mean to a rural raised NE Florida boy who believes in the absolute right to keep and bear arms, lots of my family members from New England (I believe because of a different and more liberal upbringing) didn't really believe it's your right to keep and bear arms so much. I mean most of them hunt and that's ok, but it seemed to me that they kinda view home protection as something else altogether. Please don't take it that this is a political statement, cause it aint intended to be, just saying that we are a product of our upbringing to a great degree. NE Florida is really almost ultra conservative and New England is more liberal in their beliefs, and that was like I said earlier almost a rude awakening for me. Just my observations.

[G G]

Also just for the record I am not picking on Massachusett's, but that's where family lives, and my experience in "The North" On the flip side I was also surprised how much the cigar smokers in the north are much more conservative than the average northerners. Also my personal observations, I don't have any empirical data to back any of this up.:tu Oh yeah, I love all of you.

[Blueface]

Also just for the record I am not picking on Massachusett's, but that's where family lives, and my experience in "The North" On the flip side I was also surprised how much the cigar smokers in the north are much more conservative than the average northerners. Also my personal observations, I don't have any empirical data to back any of this up.:tu Oh yeah, I love all of you.

Hey, love you too.;)

One thing the two of us know for sure, we would help each other out.:tu

[Starscream]

This is a serious present day social issue much more deep rooted than my little alarm incident. It is prevalent today in just about anything.


It's not just today's society. Remember the parable of the Good Samaritan? Only one person stopped to help the injured man who was almost dead. That story is 2,000 years old.

[MarkinAZ]

I aint trying to stir up nothing by posting my thoughts here at all.

Pot stir'er;):D

[Sr Mike]

Civilaztion sucks. I moved out to BFE away from the concrete jungle, I have 3 neighbors who I have become friends with, we each keep an eye on each other and our homes. If anything happens we keep each other informed, chase down loose dogs, rebuild fences, share cigars and food. Never knew if a place like this still existed, but it does.

http://www.cigarasylum.com/vb/attachment.php?attachmentid=6975&stc=1&d=1282155745

Well ARMED...

;)

My favorite British TV show! "Ha, you missed both my legs!"

[Subvet642]

Also just for the record I am not picking on Massachusett's, but that's where family lives, and my experience in "The North" On the flip side I was also surprised how much the cigar smokers in the north are much more conservative than the average northerners. Also my personal observations, I don't have any empirical data to back any of this up.:tu Oh yeah, I love all of you.

Hi Greg,

I'm not having an easy time trying to convey my views on this, so I'll try again:
I believe in the Second Amendment.
I believe in the Divine right to self defense.
I believe that we, as a society and as individuals, should look after our neighbors and all innocents. Bad guys can all fry.
I will risk my safety and life to protect innocent life.
I will not risk my safety or life to protect the PROPERTY of others, but I will do all I can up to that point.
As for Carlos' neighbors, all I'm saying is, they MAY OR MAY NOT be a-holes, but without KNOWING what they did, it's like judging a beauty contest in the dark.
I have been a sheepdog my whole adult life from my 4 years as a Torpedoman's Mate on a submarine playing tag with "Ivan" to my 22 years as a Security Officer. I have put myself in harm's way for others.

AND:

:l

[G G]

Pot stir'er;):D
Love everyone except you Mark. Dookie head.:r


Nah I guess i do love you anyway.

[G G]

Hi Greg,

I'm not having an easy time trying to convey my views on this, so I'll try again:
I believe in the Second Amendment.
I believe in the Divine right to self defense.
I believe that we, as a society and as individuals, should look after our neighbors and all innocents. Bad guys can all fry.
I will risk my safety and life to protect innocent life.
I will not risk my safety or life to protect the PROPERTY of others, but I will do all I can up to that point.
As for Carlos' neighbors, all I'm saying is, they MAY OR MAY NOT be a-holes, but without KNOWING what they did, it's like judging a beauty contest in the dark.
I have been a sheepdog my whole adult life from my 4 years as a Torpedoman's Mate on a submarine playing tag with "Ivan" to my 22 years as a Security Officer. I have put myself in harm's way for others.

AND:

:l
Darren, I almost didn't post all that just cause I was afraid you would take it the wrong way. My main point is how different parts of the country was raised way different and we tend to look at things as if we were in a fishbowl, that is judged against our own life experiences. Thanks for being gracious, and I shouldn't have been scared you would take it the wrong way, cause I know we could have talked it out. I can go with you maybe on the property protection, cause even in Florida we have the right to use deadly force to stop or prevent a "Forcible Felony" and property protection according to the Florida guru of gun law (Jon Gutmacher) prolly wouldn't work too good. Carlos, I would def help. I had a police friend of mine tell me one time that if I ever saw him getting wailed on and I didn't stop to help, he would either kill me or haunt me according to the outcome. So I guess it's a personal decision but for me (and Darren) and the others it isn't a hard decision as it is prolly built into us to get involved and help our fellow man when needed.

[G G]

Love everyone except you Mark. Dookie head.:r


Nah I guess i do love you anyway.
Plus I gave you a rep bump cause the good book says to treat others as I would like to be treated.:tu

[MarkinAZ]

Love everyone except you Mark. Dookie head.:r


Nah I guess i do love you anyway.


Plus I gave you a rep bump cause the good book says to treat others as I would like to be treated.:tu


Just too much love on this train:D, but I don't want to make Gary jealous, you know...

[Subvet642]

I guess I wasn't communicating very well. There are more people like you up here than most people would guess; we usually have to keep our views to ourselves.

[G G]

I guess I wasn't communicating very well. There are more people like you up here than most people would guess; we usually have to keep our views to ourselves.
Trust me I know, they'd run you outta town if they knew.:tu

I know that the South aint got no corner on Patriots, we can be found from sea to shining sea bro.

[G G]

Oh yeah, i think it's absolutely insane that when I travel to Massachusett's I have to leave my guns at home, or lock it up blah blah blah so it can't be used, or face years in prison in some of the states up there. So I have to give up my constitutional right to keep and bear arms to travel to parts of the USA. Nutty to say the least, but I digress.

[G G]

Just too much love on this train:D, but I don't want to make Gary jealous, you know...
Me and Gary have an open relationship.;)

[Subvet642]

Oh yeah, i think it's absolutely insane that when I travel to Massachusett's I have to leave my guns at home, or lock it up blah blah blah so it can't be used, or face years in prison in some of the states up there. So I have to give up my constitutional right to keep and bear arms to travel to parts of the USA. Nutty to say the least, but I digress.

A recent Supreme Court decision may change all that. IIRC, in a case involving a DC ban on pistols, the Justices ruled that gun bans are un-Constitutional.

[gettysburgfreak]

Sad state of affairs, Carlos.

People in Texas are much friendlier (and more likely to shoot when they hear sirens). You should come here for another visit ;)


In the 5 or so months I have spent living in Texas I have gotten that sense as well.

[G G]

A recent Supreme Court decision may change all that. IIRC, in a case involving a DC ban on pistols, the Justices ruled that gun bans are un-Constitutional.
Let's keep our fingers crossed.:banger

[Blueface]

As for Carlos' neighbors, all I'm saying is, they MAY OR MAY NOT be a-holes, but without KNOWING what they did, it's like judging a beauty contest in the dark.


Well, being the inquisitive butt head that I am, I ran into my next door dingbat yesterday and just saw the one across the street, next door to the one that came out.

I asked both the same question. "Hey, the other day, did you hear my alarm going off in the middle of the day?".

Their responses were almost mirror images of one another. Almost as if the responses came from one mind and not two.

Here is what they said.
"Yeah, we heard it. Didn't know it was yours. Figured it was a false alarm."

I then asked, why would you figure it was a false alarm v. a real, actual alarm?
They similarly said most are false.

I then asked what if it had been my alarm going off due to my smoke detector which is part of my monitored alarm system?
What if my pet was all alone and could have been saved by the fire? What if I had a heart attack and was passed out? What if I was consumed by smoke? What if it was my wife?
Neither considered that.

So, according to my neighbors, 3 of the 7, one worried about me and was concerned enough to look outside to see what was going on. That didn't involve risking his life in any way as evidenced by the fact he is still alive, well and not harmed in any way.
Two others wrote it off as a false alarm, not having any way of knowing the difference between a false one and a real one.

Mind you, the one next door travels often. Who do you think she asks to look out for her home as they have tried to break in a couple of times already?
Yeah, the guy with the freaking false alarm that instead we will just ignore it.
Good luck to her next time she needs me to look out for her home.

[neoflex]

That sucks. Sadly I am sure you are a good person by a fault like myself and even though your pissed you will still keep an eye out on their home while they are away. There is a reason why the saying "Good guys finish last" exists.

[Blueface]

even though your pissed you will still keep an eye out on their home while they are away.

:r
Yeah, I know.
I think that is what has me yet more pissed.:D

Something I forgot to mention that I think is important.
This was the first time I have heard an alarm in my neighborhood in at least a year or two.
As far as my house goes, this is the first time it has gone off since the last test that was done about three years ago.

[Blueface]

It's not just today's society. Remember the parable of the Good Samaritan? Only one person stopped to help the injured man who was almost dead. That story is 2,000 years old.

True.

[68TriShield]

I would only trust one neighbor to have my back.
Interestingly,it's the loony tune ex-military guy.

[Subvet642]

Well, being the inquisitive butt head that I am, I ran into my next door dingbat yesterday and just saw the one across the street, next door to the one that came out.

I asked both the same question. "Hey, the other day, did you hear my alarm going off in the middle of the day?".

Their responses were almost mirror images of one another. Almost as if the responses came from one mind and not two.

Here is what they said.
"Yeah, we heard it. Didn't know it was yours. Figured it was a false alarm."

I then asked, why would you figure it was a false alarm v. a real, actual alarm?
They similarly said most are false.

I then asked what if it had been my alarm going off due to my smoke detector which is part of my monitored alarm system?
What if my pet was all alone and could have been saved by the fire? What if I had a heart attack and was passed out? What if I was consumed by smoke? What if it was my wife?
Neither considered that.

So, according to my neighbors, 3 of the 7, one worried about me and was concerned enough to look outside to see what was going on. That didn't involve risking his life in any way as evidenced by the fact he is still alive, well and not harmed in any way.
Two others wrote it off as a false alarm, not having any way of knowing the difference between a false one and a real one.

Mind you, the one next door travels often. Who do you think she asks to look out for her home as they have tried to break in a couple of times already?
Yeah, the guy with the freaking false alarm that instead we will just ignore it.
Good luck to her next time she needs me to look out for her home.

It looks like you do, indeed, have some asswipe neighbors, and you know which ones they are, and knowing is a lot better than guessing.

[darkleeroy]

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Kitty_Genovese

That was almost 50 years ago.

But, on the plus note, I make sure to always go out and see what's going on when I hear an alarm.

[Starscream]

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Kitty_Genovese

That was almost 50 years ago.

But, on the plus note, I make sure to always go out and see what's going on when I hear an alarm.

I'm not a fan of the death penalty but that guy needs to go down. Crazy or not, he is a menace to society. I like the fact that he was crazy, yet still earned a B.A. in Sociology. WTF?:confused:

[darkleeroy]

I'm not a fan of the death penalty but that guy needs to go down. Crazy or not, he is a menace to society. I like the fact that he was crazy, yet still earned a B.A. in Sociology. WTF?:confused:

Well, it was an example to show that the bystander effect has been pretty prevalent for at least two and a half generations of American civilization. And was more to explain that even back then people weren't that good at looking out for other people.

As long as they can persevere through the curriculum, I've seen mentally challenged people get a college degree.

[Starscream]

Well, it was an example to show that the bystander effect has been pretty prevalent for at least two and a half generations of American civilization. And was more to explain that even back then people weren't that good at looking out for other people.

As long as they can persevere through the curriculum, I've seen mentally challenged people get a college degree.

I recognized the purpose of the article; I'm just sayin...:tu

I guess crazy people can get a degree. There are a lot of teachers who earned a degree in Education who don't seem capable of tying their own shoes.