More Questions :) What is Cellaring

[SilverFox]

I have stumbled on this a couple of times.

Does cellaring mean aging or is it just a way to say what you are keeping in stock.

On that note...........does pipe tobacco improve with age?

What are the ideal storage conditions?

Am I driving you all crazy yet?

[perogee]

cellaring is aging :), and yes, it does improve with age
typically you cellar unopened tins, so you just need to keep them cool and dry enough they do not corrode too badly
:tu

[DrDubzz]

Cellaring can mean either purposeful aging, or just storing

However it generally means intentional aging of either tinned tobacco, or jarring (mason jars usually) bulk tobaccos.

Pipe tobacco, much like cigars, generally improves with age. The benefit gained is proportional to the (natural) sugar content of the tobacco. Thus making Virginia tobacco the best candidate for long term aging. However, English blends with latakia and orientals improve as well. The changes seen with aging are, again, similar to that with cigars.

Flavors meld together more completely, harshness smooths, sometimes strength increases. It really just depends. The main difference in again pipe baccy and cigars is how. By that I mean that cigars are not aged in air-tight environments. Air-restricted, but not air tight. Pipe tobacco won't age/mature fully unless it is in a sealed environment such as a sealed tin or seal mason jar.

Ideal conditions, as above, are air-tight sealed conditions. The tobacco should maintain its moisture well enough that it doesn't require any external humidification like cigars do. Although if you cellar dried out tobacco you'll just end up with old dried out tobacco.

[SilverFox]

Hmmmmm very intriguing.

Perhaps I should determine what if any I like before I start cellaring.

I do like the Mason Jar idea though, some nice lables, a great shelf to put em on.........say above the humi.

Awww not another slope.

:r:r

[DrDubzz]

Awww not another slope.

:r:r

just let it happen :tf

[BigFrank]

Mason Jars are decent. best thing to do is sample tobaccos. When you find one you really like, buy a pound ( often cheaper to buy inbulk go figure ) get some small and large jars. I usually load like 1 oz in smaller jars and the rest in larger jars. Allows me to smoke some of my aging tobacco periodically.

[SilverFox]

Mason Jars are decent. best thing to do is sample tobaccos. When you find one you really like, buy a pound ( often cheaper to buy inbulk go figure ) get some small and large jars. I usually load like 1 oz in smaller jars and the rest in larger jars. Allows me to smoke some of my aging tobacco periodically.


So if you are aging tobacco should you then not open it?

As in lets say I bought a pound and had a smaller smoking jar 1 oz or some similar and it was to get empty is there anything wrong with opening it and refilling or does opening effect the aging process adversely

[Curly Cut]

correct. if you buy them in a TIN, do NOT open them (if your intent is to age them).
if you find a blend you like that's sold in bulk (cheaper/larger amounts), then you can seal them in large mason jars.

my tins are on my closet shelf... not on display, etc. there are some ppl around here with hundreds of tins, and probably 20+ lbs of bulk sealed in jars. so, having all that on top of your humidor would be difficult to pull off.

[SilverFox]

correct. if you buy them in a TIN, do NOT open them (if your intent is to age them).
if you find a blend you like that's sold in bulk (cheaper/larger amounts), then you can seal them in large mason jars.

my tins are on my closet shelf... not on display, etc. there are some ppl around here with hundreds of tins, and probably 20+ lbs of bulk sealed in jars. so, having all that on top of your humidor would be difficult to pull off.

Ok so ready for the famous last words

I will not have that much tobacco.

[BigFrank]

So if you are aging tobacco should you then not open it?
As in lets say I bought a pound and had a smaller smoking jar 1 oz or some similar and it was to get empty is there anything wrong with opening it and refilling or does opening effect the aging process adversely
What I meant was I buy a pound of tobacco, and take over half of it (10-12oz) and put it in a large jar for long term cellaring. I then take the remaining 4-6oz and split that tobacco up in smaller mason jars, usually 1oz or more, so that I can open a jar periodically and not spoil the larger mason jar.
Ok so ready for the famous last words

I will not have that much tobacco.
You will. Best thing I did was buy a nice large rubber maid container and I just place everything in there and keep it in my closet. But now I have two, one for tins and one for jars...

Wal-Mart or Target sells a glass jar with a rubber seal at the top. I find these are nice for keeping tobacco. They also look nice. I usually open a tin and store it in a jar. These are kept on my desk. rX has a ton of them, check some of his pictures of his stash.

[DrDubzz]

Wal-Mart or Target sells a glass jar with a rubber seal at the top. I find these are nice for keeping tobacco. They also look nice. I usually open a tin and store it in a jar. These are kept on my desk. rX has a ton of them, check some of his pictures of his stash.


Ema (Emma?) Jars. Very nice for tobacco you are going to be smoking regularly, pretty cheap too:tu

[Mister Moo]

Rule of thumb about aging sealed tobaccos -

1. english blends tend not to show great improvement over time
2. most burley blends aren't known for their development over time
3. virginia tobaccos tend to improve over time

[RevSmoke]

Rule of thumb about aging sealed tobaccos -

1. english blends tend not to show great improvement over time
2. most burley blends aren't known for their development over time
3. virginia tobaccos tend to improve over time

This is most certainly true, but I'd add a little something

Virginias and Va/Pers age very well, and may even change drastically.

That means also that any blends containing a good amount of virginia have a good possibility of aging well - including English and/or Oriental blends.

If you want to cellar for aging purposes, whatever you sit aside - whether sealed tins or bulk in mason jars - leave alone and do not open.

If you are cellaring just to keep a little tobacco on hand (what I do) and buying by the pound (it is cheaper that way), get some smaller mason jars. I like 1/2 pint jars, and a pound will usually garner four 1/2 pint jars. Unintentional aging.

The nice thing about using mason jars, you can open them occasionally to draw tobacco out and it will remain fresh. The seal on the lids is usually very good.

[Bruce]

I would have to disagree about English blends not ageing well.
I have tins of John Cotton's, Sullivan's, Dunhill's, and Sobranie that are simply marvelous after 20/30/40 years in the tin.
As a matter of fact, I will only smoke tobaccos that have been aged for at least 5 to 10 years.

[JaKaacH]

Hmmmmm very intriguing.

Awww not another slope.

:r:r

Do you like Coffee?

[Curly Cut]

I would have to disagree about English blends not ageing well.
I have tins of John Cotton's, Sullivan's, Dunhill's, and Sobranie that are simply marvelous after 20/30/40 years in the tin.

i have to agree with bruce and have sampled some of the tobacco from his cellar he mentions.

it's not that latakia based blends don't age well, it's just that the amount of time needed for them to improve is so much longer than it is for a VA - most don't want to wait that long or don't want to pay the premium for vintage sealed tins.

in my own experiences, the aged latakia blends are far, far, far superior to their fresher/younger versions. so much so that you would think you're not even smoking the same blend. i've had some that i doubted had a lick of latakia in them, that's how much they aged/improved. to me, it's a large improvement if i can't tell it has latakia, cuz i have found out i really don't like latakia.

so, it's not that they don't age/improve, it's just that to taste it, you have to age them for a while longer than a VA or VA/Per. where a VA can improve/mellow out/smooth the edges after 5 yrs or so, i haven't been able to tell a difference in 5 yr old heavy English or Oriental blends.

at least, that's what i've personally experienced.

[Starscream]

Wal-Mart or Target sells a glass jar with a rubber seal at the top. I find these are nice for keeping tobacco. They also look nice. I usually open a tin and store it in a jar. These are kept on my desk. rX has a ton of them, check some of his pictures of his stash.

Ema (Emma?) Jars. Very nice for tobacco you are going to be smoking regularly, pretty cheap too:tu

So these jars can be opened from time to time and still age? Kinda like opening a humi from time to time?

[SilverFox]

Do you like Coffee?

Yup love coffee

But I am very very happy with my keurig

[SilverFox]

Is it bad that I am already surfing looking for new tobaccos to try when I haven't even tried a single one as yet??

[ir13]

Is it bad that I am already surfing looking for new tobaccos to try when I haven't even tried a single one as yet??

Dont worry, in 6-10 days you will have about 50 to try from.

[skier171]

Do you like Coffee?

So many slippery slopes...tea...coffee...cigars...pipe tobacco...uh oh.

not good for a college student at all. good thing for a internship. but still.

I'd never heard of cellaring, makes complete sense, but im buying a couple tins right now that ill toss in my closet and find in a few years.

[Mister Moo]

I would have to disagree about English blends not ageing well.
I have tins of John Cotton's, Sullivan's, Dunhill's, and Sobranie that are simply marvelous after 20/30/40 years in the tin.
As a matter of fact, I will only smoke tobaccos that have been aged for at least 5 to 10 years.I cannot disagree with your disagreement but I did say english blends "tend" not to show great improvement, not that they do never improve. (I've enjoyed Sobranie and some Barry Levin stuff that was spectacular after 10-20 years in the can I've seem more latakia appear to hold, or lose, ground in my short viewing span of five-eight years.) This would be something interesting to discuss in depth in a new thread, if you would. -moo

[DrDubzz]

So these jars can be opened from time to time and still age? Kinda like opening a humi from time to time?

well... no not really, as far as the aging is concerned

The point was more that, for smaller amounts, these are easy access, and maintain a good seal.

but when you introduce new air, and release the previously sealed, fermenting air (for lack of a better term as the air itself is not actually fermenting), you are essentially starting over.

Although, if you have really stuffed the jar tight, then perhaps the tobaccos towards the bottom won't be so much affected.

I'm not entirely sure, but it was more of an access thing and convenience, than aging apparatus

[Starscream]

well... no not really, as far as the aging is concerned

The point was more that, for smaller amounts, these are easy access, and maintain a good seal.

but when you introduce new air, and release the previously sealed, fermenting air (for lack of a better term as the air itself is not actually fermenting), you are essentially starting over.

Although, if you have really stuffed the jar tight, then perhaps the tobaccos towards the bottom won't be so much affected.

I'm not entirely sure, but it was more of an access thing and convenience, than aging apparatus

:tu Gotcha. Not good for cellaring, but good for keeping from drying out.

[DrDubzz]

:tu Gotcha. Not good for cellaring, but good for keeping from drying out.

yes

now, you can long term store if you don't open them, but some seal better than others

[SilverFox]

should tins be sealed in some other airtight container or are they air tight themselves?

Are the tins dated or do they need labeling

on bulk tobacco you mention mason jars, does light impact tobacco as in should they be aged in the dark?

Thank you

[Curly Cut]

should tins be sealed in some other airtight container or are they air tight themselves?
if the tin is still sealed, it's sealed, no need for airtight containers

Are the tins dated or do they need labeling
only tins made by McClelland and C&D are dated (that includes GL pease, PCCA, Hearth and Home, etc, whoever does the making of the blend and tins it, if it was C&D or McClelland, it will have a date stamp on the bottom - they do it differently from each other) C&D tins are a mo/day/year stamping; McClellands are a blend#/batch/yr stamping

on bulk tobacco you mention mason jars, does light impact tobacco as in should they be aged in the dark?
not that i know of.

Thank you
reply in the quote.

[BigFrank]

well... no not really, as far as the aging is concerned

The point was more that, for smaller amounts, these are easy access, and maintain a good seal.

but when you introduce new air, and release the previously sealed, fermenting air (for lack of a better term as the air itself is not actually fermenting), you are essentially starting over.

Although, if you have really stuffed the jar tight, then perhaps the tobaccos towards the bottom won't be so much affected.

I'm not entirely sure, but it was more of an access thing and convenience, than aging apparatus
I dont think I would use them for aging. They do keep the moisture over a long period of time compared to just leaving it in the tin. For someone like myself who takes a decent amount of time to finish a tin, they are very nice. Also, I keep a few of them on my desk with tobacco in them. they look decent enough to leave laying around, and for the price (2-3$) they are well worth it. When I finish a tin, I just wash them out with some soapy water let them dry out, then crack open a new tin and put the contents into the glass jar.

[Paulmac]

If yer interested in aging pipe tobacco, this outta keep ya busy for an hour or ten

http://nocturne.org/aging/